Anyone else falling out of love with driving a 'fast' car?
Discussion
I agreed with this thread at the start because I sold my 911 for some of the reasons discussed . It's not fast I know, (it's Pistonheads) and yesterday I bought an R34 GTR (again not fast, we're on PH) and I have come to this conclusion.
`Owning` such a car, or similar doesn't necessarily mean you need to drive it like a tool so you don't need to actually fall out of love with ownership experience. There is something kinda cool about having an `Iron fist in a velvet glove` so to speak (if you own something fast I mean).
`Owning` such a car, or similar doesn't necessarily mean you need to drive it like a tool so you don't need to actually fall out of love with ownership experience. There is something kinda cool about having an `Iron fist in a velvet glove` so to speak (if you own something fast I mean).
Edited by bigkeeko on Friday 1st April 19:31
Back to the OP. yes, I did. Not particularly fast in the grand scheme of things but I have just got rid of my 3.0 XF sport because it was just a bit....dull I guess (well... apart from wondering which fault code was going to pop up on the dash next...). 0-60 in 6 or so seconds but it was so quiet and smooth that you were divorced from the outside world.
I have a mk1 MX5 in the garage and I genuinely feel more alive driving that than I ever did in the Jag.
I have a mk1 MX5 in the garage and I genuinely feel more alive driving that than I ever did in the Jag.
I've come from a similar situation. Whilst not fast compared to what many are speaking of in this thread; I owned a Stage 2 mk2 Octavia vRS. It was around 285 BHP and 335 lbft torque.
It was a bit of a pig to get off the line quickly; once rolling it accelerated very quickly. Even with decent tyres it'd spin 1st and 2nd in the dry. When the ambient temperature hit low single figures, or there was a hint of dampness on the road it'd spin in 3rd quite happily.
Now, I understand the throttle isn't an on-off switch; sometimes it's nice to be able to use full throttle out of a bend without having to be too cautious.
I also found that you got into licence losing speeds quickly enough. Sometimes it's nice to hang on to a gear to the redline without blasting past the speed limit.
I now drive a 155 BHP Accord. It'll be modified to handle and brake better, perhaps an intake to free up some induction sound.
There are times I miss the acceleration of the Octavia; but there are also times I love going through the first three gears, whilst holding onto the revs.
It was a bit of a pig to get off the line quickly; once rolling it accelerated very quickly. Even with decent tyres it'd spin 1st and 2nd in the dry. When the ambient temperature hit low single figures, or there was a hint of dampness on the road it'd spin in 3rd quite happily.
Now, I understand the throttle isn't an on-off switch; sometimes it's nice to be able to use full throttle out of a bend without having to be too cautious.
I also found that you got into licence losing speeds quickly enough. Sometimes it's nice to hang on to a gear to the redline without blasting past the speed limit.
I now drive a 155 BHP Accord. It'll be modified to handle and brake better, perhaps an intake to free up some induction sound.
There are times I miss the acceleration of the Octavia; but there are also times I love going through the first three gears, whilst holding onto the revs.
Edited by Stu08 on Friday 1st April 23:07
Edited by Stu08 on Friday 1st April 23:08
SuperchargedVR6 said:
V8RX7 said:
I've been speeding for 25+ years without an accident so clearly I'm doing something right.
Same. Have only received 3 speeding convictions over that period, too. I put it down to luck! It will run out one day though.Stu08 said:
I've come from a similar situation. Whilst not fast compared to what many are speaking of in this thread; I owned a Stage 2 mk2 Octavia vRS. It was around 285 BHP and 335 lbft torque.
It was a bit of a pig to get off the line quickly; once rolling it accelerated very quickly. Even with decent tyres it'd spin 1st and 2nd in the dry. When the ambient temperature hit low single figures, or there was a hint of dampness on the road it'd spin in 3rd quite happily.
Now, I understand the throttle isn't an on-off switch; sometimes it's nice to be able to use full throttle out of a bend without having to be too cautious.
I also found that you got into licence losing speeds quickly enough. Sometimes it's nice to hang on to a gear to the redline without blasting past the speed limit.
I now drive a 155 BHP Accord. It'll be modified to handle and brake better, perhaps an intake to free up some induction sound.
There are times I miss the acceleration of the Octavia; but there are also times I love going through the first three gears, whilst holding onto the revs.
For all of those reasons I am thinking about asking the place that tuned my Megane R26 to do one of their map tweeks on it to take the boost down to 1 bar below 4k rpm. The level of low down torque like these cars have is just not needed, it makes the cars more on/off to drive in normal driving and puts to much load on all the drive train components. Its even more silly on the Megane as it has 6 lovely close ratio and mostly low gears so anything below 4k rpm so its just not needed when driving properly hard as the car can do all its work in the 4k to 6k window. Tuning therefore to have massive torque at 2k or 3k is only about making the car feel fast.
It was a bit of a pig to get off the line quickly; once rolling it accelerated very quickly. Even with decent tyres it'd spin 1st and 2nd in the dry. When the ambient temperature hit low single figures, or there was a hint of dampness on the road it'd spin in 3rd quite happily.
Now, I understand the throttle isn't an on-off switch; sometimes it's nice to be able to use full throttle out of a bend without having to be too cautious.
I also found that you got into licence losing speeds quickly enough. Sometimes it's nice to hang on to a gear to the redline without blasting past the speed limit.
I now drive a 155 BHP Accord. It'll be modified to handle and brake better, perhaps an intake to free up some induction sound.
There are times I miss the acceleration of the Octavia; but there are also times I love going through the first three gears, whilst holding onto the revs.
Edited by Stu08 on Friday 1st April 23:07
For all of those reasons I am thinking about asking the place that tuned my Megane R26 to do one of their map tweeks on it to take the boost down to 1 bar below 4k rpm. The level of low down torque like these cars have is just not needed, it makes the cars more on/off to drive in normal driving and puts to much load on all the drive train components. Its even more silly on the Megane as it has 6 lovely close ratio and mostly low gears so anything below 4k rpm so its just not needed when driving properly hard as the car can do all its work in the 4k to 6k window. Tuning therefore to have massive torque at 2k or 3k is only about making the car feel fast.
Edited by Stu08 on Friday 1st April 23:08
Zed 44 said:
Leins said:
I think you're misinterpreting the benefit of an empty road, more specifically that it's not about being able to use it as your own drag strip. It's about not being held to a crawling pace
The roads I chose to head to early on weekend mornings have a 60mph limit, but it is actually quite difficult to drive in excess of this speed due to their very nature. The appeal, when free, is that you can cut lines inbetween bends that you wouldn't be able to do normally, and chose your own braking points for corners. This isn't about reckless endangerment of others, it's about being able to choose how you approach the road, not have it be enforced on you by the dawdling masses that must normally be endured
I think this is probably the most sensible response in 17 pages. +1The roads I chose to head to early on weekend mornings have a 60mph limit, but it is actually quite difficult to drive in excess of this speed due to their very nature. The appeal, when free, is that you can cut lines inbetween bends that you wouldn't be able to do normally, and chose your own braking points for corners. This isn't about reckless endangerment of others, it's about being able to choose how you approach the road, not have it be enforced on you by the dawdling masses that must normally be endured
I was reading this thread a few hours ago. Decided to jump into the S2000 in a t shirt - the sun was shining for the entire 1 hour drive! For the main part of the trip, I only encountered a few cars. Plenty of VTEC action, though even outside of VTEC the car makes a good noise with the big fat intake tube running down to behind the bumper.
This was travelling west out of Worcester and driving along the country roads.
I had to stop after an hour as I needed petrol and knew the oil level was running low on the dipstick and needed to top her up before going round a corner with too much speed and ruining the bearings!
This was travelling west out of Worcester and driving along the country roads.
I had to stop after an hour as I needed petrol and knew the oil level was running low on the dipstick and needed to top her up before going round a corner with too much speed and ruining the bearings!
Leins said:
I think you're misinterpreting the benefit of an empty road, more specifically that it's not about being able to use it as your own drag strip. It's about not being held to a crawling pace
The roads I chose to head to early on weekend mornings have a 60mph limit, but it is actually quite difficult to drive in excess of this speed due to their very nature. The appeal, when free, is that you can cut lines inbetween bends that you wouldn't be able to do normally, and chose your own braking points for corners. This isn't about reckless endangerment of others, it's about being able to choose how you approach the road, not have it be enforced on you by the dawdling masses that must normally be endured
I like that post Leins, sums it up well. The roads I chose to head to early on weekend mornings have a 60mph limit, but it is actually quite difficult to drive in excess of this speed due to their very nature. The appeal, when free, is that you can cut lines inbetween bends that you wouldn't be able to do normally, and chose your own braking points for corners. This isn't about reckless endangerment of others, it's about being able to choose how you approach the road, not have it be enforced on you by the dawdling masses that must normally be endured
Leins said:
RayPike said:
giblet said:
Interesting thread. ... Early Sunday morning drives are the only real time when I can enjoy it, I'm only 30 mins away from some cracking countryside roads which are empty at that time.
You see, it's this bit in bold that is the fly in the ointment here. How do you KNOW they're empty as a matter of stated fact (as you say)? They may have been empty in the past, but the next time may be the time a young family has set off early to get somewhere and you come hooning around a bend, slightly over the line and pow! Your (not only your, of course, but you're the one who's posted it most recently) "pistonheads enthusiast" attitude towards what you perceive as empty roads is potentially lethally dangerous and yet the impression I get from your post would be that if the road wasn't empty that particular day, it somehow wouldn't be your fault if something went wrong because a lesser driver enjoying their piddly 2 litre engine with only 190bhp wasn't able to cope with your driving? If, you know, they were only doing 60mph on a stretch of road where your knowledge, skill and experience means you know it's perfectly safe to do 90mph could lead you to do something impetuous that could put not just you at risk. The roads I chose to head to early on weekend mornings have a 60mph limit, but it is actually quite difficult to drive in excess of this speed due to their very nature. The appeal, when free, is that you can cut lines inbetween bends that you wouldn't be able to do normally, and chose your own braking points for corners. This isn't about reckless endangerment of others, it's about being able to choose how you approach the road, not have it be enforced on you by the dawdling masses that must normally be endured
The meaning of the word disappointment, is coming around the first bend of your favourite twisty driving road.......and seeing a Nissan Micra ahead
No it isn't - Micras are easy enough to deal with; the real problem is an A4 TDI , driver with shades on and because it's an S Line he 's going to show you he could have been Jason Plato. Or even worse- sorry bikers- is being overtaken by a superbike on the straight before the bends and then being forced to watch the bloody thing crawl through the corners - as I have yet to encounter a biker who let me by, being in denial that anything with four wheels can go a lot quicker on the right road
coppice said:
No it isn't - Micras are easy enough to deal with; the real problem is an A4 TDI , driver with shades on and because it's an S Line he 's going to show you he could have been Jason Plato.
I find the general level of delusion of the typical 'Aldi' driver to be much higher than any other mainstream repmobile......especially when its a diesel s
t line whatever and said moron is wearing sunglasses to hide the clouds and their embarassment perhaps....
:I was going to reply when I saw this the other day but forgot.
I entirely agree and have felt this way for a while. What did it for me was a trip to tuscany in my Tuscan.
The roads (as soon as you got over the channel) were clear, smooth, interesting (apart from the motorways which tbh are so smooth even that was enjoyable
When we got to tuscany it was like a motorists nirvana. Smooth perfect roads, going up the side of low mountains. Hairpins, s bends all sorts, all perfectly tarmacced, no nob heads with dash cams waiting to report you , the knowledge that even if the police catch you speeding which is slim then it's a fine and on your way. You basically use your common sense and have fun without having to go mad, but that fun here would likely equal prison.
As soon as I got back to England it was like a sudden realisation of how st it is here. As such I've probably done about 500 miles in the Tuscan in about 3 years! I don't know if I can bring myself to sell it but I must say every time I go out it's a disappointment 
I entirely agree and have felt this way for a while. What did it for me was a trip to tuscany in my Tuscan.
The roads (as soon as you got over the channel) were clear, smooth, interesting (apart from the motorways which tbh are so smooth even that was enjoyable
When we got to tuscany it was like a motorists nirvana. Smooth perfect roads, going up the side of low mountains. Hairpins, s bends all sorts, all perfectly tarmacced, no nob heads with dash cams waiting to report you , the knowledge that even if the police catch you speeding which is slim then it's a fine and on your way. You basically use your common sense and have fun without having to go mad, but that fun here would likely equal prison.
As soon as I got back to England it was like a sudden realisation of how s
t it is here. As such I've probably done about 500 miles in the Tuscan in about 3 years! I don't know if I can bring myself to sell it but I must say every time I go out it's a disappointment m3jappa said:
I was going to reply when I saw this the other day but forgot.
I entirely agree and have felt this way for a while. What did it for me was a trip to tuscany in my Tuscan.
The roads (as soon as you got over the channel) were clear, smooth, interesting (apart from the motorways which tbh are so smooth even that was enjoyable
When we got to tuscany it was like a motorists nirvana. Smooth perfect roads, going up the side of low mountains. Hairpins, s bends all sorts, all perfectly tarmacced, no nob heads with dash cams waiting to report you , the knowledge that even if the police catch you speeding which is slim then it's a fine and on your way. You basically use your common sense and have fun without having to go mad, but that fun here would likely equal prison.
As soon as I got back to England it was like a sudden realisation of how st it is here. As such I've probably done about 500 miles in the Tuscan in about 3 years! I don't know if I can bring myself to sell it but I must say every time I go out it's a disappointment
WalesI entirely agree and have felt this way for a while. What did it for me was a trip to tuscany in my Tuscan.
The roads (as soon as you got over the channel) were clear, smooth, interesting (apart from the motorways which tbh are so smooth even that was enjoyable
When we got to tuscany it was like a motorists nirvana. Smooth perfect roads, going up the side of low mountains. Hairpins, s bends all sorts, all perfectly tarmacced, no nob heads with dash cams waiting to report you , the knowledge that even if the police catch you speeding which is slim then it's a fine and on your way. You basically use your common sense and have fun without having to go mad, but that fun here would likely equal prison.
As soon as I got back to England it was like a sudden realisation of how s
t it is here. As such I've probably done about 500 miles in the Tuscan in about 3 years! I don't know if I can bring myself to sell it but I must say every time I go out it's a disappointment North west scotland
Yorkshire
6am alarm
Enjoy!
I used to live in West London until I moved out nearly six years ago. I frequently go into London for business and what's shocked me when I go back to areas I know well is how prevalent the 20mph limit has become. I think it's lunacy myself, at 20 I'm getting overtaken by cyclists and I spend so long looking at the speedo and not the road I don't see how it can be better for safety. Plus there's so much congestion traffic is probably hardly doing much better than 10mph for large chunks of town... or it's midnight and then doing 20mph on a clear road seems stupid.
Fortunately I moved out to the sticks and although it's got its own frustrations, there are a few roads around here where you can enjoy yourself. Fortunately they're twisty enough that doing the speed limit, or thereabouts, provides some fun without being reckless or silly fast. There are plenty of great driving roads about, but often it is a case of timing - as others have surely pointed out
Fortunately I moved out to the sticks and although it's got its own frustrations, there are a few roads around here where you can enjoy yourself. Fortunately they're twisty enough that doing the speed limit, or thereabouts, provides some fun without being reckless or silly fast. There are plenty of great driving roads about, but often it is a case of timing - as others have surely pointed out
I tend to agree OP; I'm in a job now where I lose it if I get 2 speeding fines so it's important for me to keep legal.
However I do still want some fun.
I've just bought a 1.4 turbo Vauxhall Astra GTC.
It's quick enough not to be a chore to drive but it's also a lot of fun on a twisty B road with it's nicely balanced chassis.
There's a lot more fun to be had IMHO on winding roads in a nicely balanced car with good handling than there is in blasting down the outside lane on a motorway.
However I do still want some fun.
I've just bought a 1.4 turbo Vauxhall Astra GTC.
It's quick enough not to be a chore to drive but it's also a lot of fun on a twisty B road with it's nicely balanced chassis.
There's a lot more fun to be had IMHO on winding roads in a nicely balanced car with good handling than there is in blasting down the outside lane on a motorway.
RayPike said:
AH33 said:
I dont think anyone on here who would get up early to find a good driving road would then go drifting around every corner and coming round blind bends at 90 on the wrong side of the road.
Its possible to exceed the speed limit without killing all the children of the world. Its also fun, and you dont need to feel guilty. You should try it sometimes.
As stated before, I'm exaggerating the point to make the point... There does seem to be a sense of entitlement among many PH members that they have a fast car and the imperialist nazi government is stopping them enjoying it on a day-to-day basis, therefore it's their right to find a less-policed road and "stretch its legs" or "stretch their toes" or "put their foot down" or "turn up the sound" or whatever emotive term is currently in vogue. The implication is that they have some godlike driving prowess that means they can exceed the safe speed for that stretch of road (let alone the NSL) with impunity. Statistics show that speed is very, very rarely the sole cause of an accident but I bet you that when there is an accident, the extra speed does a damn fine job of turning borderline bumps into welded metal. The prevailing attitude (it appears with 5 live callers every time there's an "is speed dangerous" type phone in too) among owners of powerful cars is that they have the capability of deciding what is and isn't an acceptable speed for any given stretch of road and this fails to take into account what is the no. 1 cause of accidents - crap drivers. You could all be driving gods as far as logic is concerned, but to post things like "there's this empty stretch of road, take your car there and open it up" (I'm paraphrasing) is possibly a bit dangerous.Its possible to exceed the speed limit without killing all the children of the world. Its also fun, and you dont need to feel guilty. You should try it sometimes.
Yeah, I do enjoy a bit of power under my foot, but common sense means I very rarely use that meagre bit of power as there are just too many unpredictable idiots on the roads. Suggesting that belting around at warp speed on unpoliced roads at the crack of sparrows in summertime is either acceptable, sensible or safe "if you know what you're doing" is not a particularly responsible attitude really.
edited to add re: the bold bit in your post - my point is that these things are far more likely to happen if someone is "stretching the legs" of their powerful car and it only has to go wrong once for it to cause a problem. Yeah, the odds are tiny, but do something with tiny odds enough times and it becomes likely.
Edited by RayPike on Thursday 31st March 09:10
For the this example you are Douglas. Douglas is a good driver, perhaps he's completed an IAM or similar course, so he knows how to safely drive fast. He's in his MX 5, with its PH sticker, and is on an empty NSL country lane early one summers morning.
His speed is realistically governed by his vehicles abilities and the road in front of him, and at times he will be going faster than 60. This can be perfectly safe and is what most people are talking about.
Also, assuming that he's not being daft, Douglas certainly should not be nicked for the above.
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