The new type r - is it a sales flop?
Discussion
I'd have one! They are very marmite though but one cannot argue with what a cracking engine and drivetrain its got, just a shame about the lack of noise...
I've only ever seen one in the "wild" but i believe they had supply problems early on which has probably had a knock on effect, plus no cheap lease deals (so no muppets in Golf-R's can buy them
)
I've only ever seen one in the "wild" but i believe they had supply problems early on which has probably had a knock on effect, plus no cheap lease deals (so no muppets in Golf-R's can buy them
)It is ridiculously overpriced for what it is, which i'm sure many of you have already said in this thread without reading it.
I was curious and the starting figure i saw was 25k
About 10 years ago when i was interested in these hot hatches, 12-15k was about right for a hot hatch. Wages haven't really moved on that much, starting salaries for jobs i had back then are about the same. Yet the price of the car has doubled. I just think this is ridiculous.
I also think younger people these days are more interested in lifestyle cars than chavved up racers. If you think about it, you don't see hardly any modified cars these days like you did back then with nova's, five's, 106's, clios, corsas.
I was curious and the starting figure i saw was 25k
About 10 years ago when i was interested in these hot hatches, 12-15k was about right for a hot hatch. Wages haven't really moved on that much, starting salaries for jobs i had back then are about the same. Yet the price of the car has doubled. I just think this is ridiculous.
I also think younger people these days are more interested in lifestyle cars than chavved up racers. If you think about it, you don't see hardly any modified cars these days like you did back then with nova's, five's, 106's, clios, corsas.
The few I've seen in the flesh look better than I expected from pictures, but still a bit OTT. I can't see many people of the age and means to buy a Type R wanting to buy into that image, to be honest, much as it probably appeals to the little boy in all of us. I like how they've gone with a very aggressive look to make a point and build an image, but I suspect they might sell more if much of the aero addenda were an option. Perhaps the wing and so on adds a nth to the Nurburgring time, but for the vast majority of buyers it's simply a big fugly thing people will take the piss out of. Perhaps a 'stealth' edition deleting the wilder aspects of it may be released in due course.
Judging by preview pics, the next Civic is absolutely eye-bleedingly, genocide-causingly ugly, so I'd not be getting my hopes up for any aesthetic improvement soon.
Generic problem with Honda is that while the new Type-R, the new NSX and F1 misadventures help move them away from a very mundane phase of their history, and there's much to admire about what they do and how they do it, the results seem to fall uncomfortably between stools in being in their own terms very good but versus the competition being neither one thing nor the other. Perhaps that's what makes them unique and commands such loyalty and cult appeal. I can't think of a current/upcoming car I'd like more than a NSX but I'm conscious that for most that would be an eccentric choice - I think a Type-R, in the hot hatch category, is the same.
Judging by preview pics, the next Civic is absolutely eye-bleedingly, genocide-causingly ugly, so I'd not be getting my hopes up for any aesthetic improvement soon.
Generic problem with Honda is that while the new Type-R, the new NSX and F1 misadventures help move them away from a very mundane phase of their history, and there's much to admire about what they do and how they do it, the results seem to fall uncomfortably between stools in being in their own terms very good but versus the competition being neither one thing nor the other. Perhaps that's what makes them unique and commands such loyalty and cult appeal. I can't think of a current/upcoming car I'd like more than a NSX but I'm conscious that for most that would be an eccentric choice - I think a Type-R, in the hot hatch category, is the same.
i do think finance has a lot to answer for in this case.
most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
LaurasOtherHalf said:
i do think finance has a lot to answer for in this case.
most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
Very much this.most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
The economies of scale of a Type R versus a Golf R must be absurd which must mean its difficult for Honda to do cheapo finance deals. The hardware of a Golf R can be spread over any number of different VW group cars whereas the Honda is a more bespoke and individually-engineered car. That makes it appealing in a way, but also expensive. I can see a Type R being a cult car when they're 10 years old - lairy, rare, relatively cheap - where as a 10 year old Golf R will just be an old fast Golf.
stuart-b said:
Shame. s
t.
I think the concept is considerably better than the end result.
The Honda concept designer once the first production car was shown to him
And here is something which actually looks coherent
How the fk does this look even remotely similar
This is a better reproduction of the design!
Agree for the most part - shame they chickened out of the rear light/spoiler design. However, the major reason why the production car looks so incongruous is the huge ride height and mismatched wheels sizes: both easy to sort out. t.I think the concept is considerably better than the end result.
The Honda concept designer once the first production car was shown to him
And here is something which actually looks coherent
How the f
k does this look even remotely similarThis is a better reproduction of the design!
Edited by stuart-b on Thursday 21st April 19:55
Edited by stuart-b on Thursday 21st April 19:57
Question: Why do manufacturers generally do such a piss poor job of filling wheel arches?? Is it really so hard to get right? That's at least 50% of the problem with this CTR. The mk2 FRS was a joke at the front - at least the mk3 without the flared arches fills them better.
tankplanker said:
Not sure how accurate the numbers are for new registrations are on howmanyleft but the Golf R has been hitting around 2k cars registered per year with the mark 7, this is about the same as the mark 1 and 2 Focus RS
The mk1 RS was limited to 4500 cars and only half of those were sold in the UK. Mk2 RS was indeed quite popular but still only approx 4000 cars sold in the UK.bp1000 said:
It is ridiculously overpriced for what it is, which i'm sure many of you have already said in this thread without reading it.
I was curious and the starting figure i saw was 25k
About 10 years ago when i was interested in these hot hatches, 12-15k was about right for a hot hatch. Wages haven't really moved on that much, starting salaries for jobs i had back then are about the same. Yet the price of the car has doubled. I just think this is ridiculous.
I also think younger people these days are more interested in lifestyle cars than chavved up racers. If you think about it, you don't see hardly any modified cars these days like you did back then with nova's, five's, 106's, clios, corsas.
I personally think you're living in the dark ages. 10 years ago a Golf GTI cost £20k, I know because I bought one in 2006. £12k - £15k didn't get anything in the hot hatch category.I was curious and the starting figure i saw was 25k
About 10 years ago when i was interested in these hot hatches, 12-15k was about right for a hot hatch. Wages haven't really moved on that much, starting salaries for jobs i had back then are about the same. Yet the price of the car has doubled. I just think this is ridiculous.
I also think younger people these days are more interested in lifestyle cars than chavved up racers. If you think about it, you don't see hardly any modified cars these days like you did back then with nova's, five's, 106's, clios, corsas.
Also £25k in todays money was £19k in 2006, so all these cars have done is move with inflation.
willmagrath said:
To me i think it looks just way too lairy! The competition, like the seat cupra and the golf r just looks so much better and understated.
But manufacturers can't win with the PH crowd. Too lairy and it gets criticised for being too lairy, too subtle and it gets criticised for being too subtle. Where is the middle ground?
otolith said:
Who wants everything in the middle ground anyway? If you want a lairy car, buy the Civic. If you want an understated one, buy the Golf. Choice is good!
I agree 100%, but you hear the same people complaining that VAGs, M135is etc are too boring, but the Civic is too Halfords. If the Civic had looked like the concept I'd have bought one without a second thought, I thought it looked amazing.Vocht said:
LaurasOtherHalf said:
i do think finance has a lot to answer for in this case.
most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
Very much this.most car enthusiasts don't mind playing in the £250-£300 per month with a bit of a deposit and that's fair enough. It's just the Type-R needs you to do that and chuck £10k into the deal as the deposit, it's laughably out of step.
then there's those who have £30k-ish in cash to actually chuck at the car, do you really want a brand new hot hatch over a lightly used proper performance car such as an M3 or 911?
that's before you start to consider future "classics" where you can kid yourself (or the wife) it's actually an "investment".
if these were £1.5k down and £280pcm they'd be everywhere, but they're not.
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