RE: Mercedes-AMG C43 saloon and estate confirmed
Discussion
scherzkeks said:
MikeTFSI said:
What is the point of AMG though? .
It is an in-house tuner. Does this really need explanation?I get that these days people want auto v8 Mercedes from their AMGs, but the thought of a deviated, more focused approach to the '43 models would have appealed. Big sideways smoking V8 '63 brutes and more nimble V6 '43 drivers cars, with a manual gearbox option.
Suppose I'm not the target audience though, so my musings are irrelevant.
At the risk of stating the bloody obvious, the point of AMG is to sell cars; not necessarily to sell AMG cars, though. Clearly all of the big German companies have decided they can make more money by using their halo brand as a trim level on hum-drum cars than by reserving them for the top-end models.
Seems a bit shorttermist to me, but they probably know better than me so either I'm wrong or they don't care.
Seems a bit shorttermist to me, but they probably know better than me so either I'm wrong or they don't care.
kambites said:
On the plus side, it'll depreciate like... well like a Mercedes with a large petrol engine. Should be able to get one for <£10k in five years' time. 
Lol really - take a look at E63Bi turbos 4 + years old now they don't start used until mid £30's. Take the one before it the 6.2v8 they are still in the teens heck the E55k is only just £8-18k and that's 10-15years old. Welshbeef said:
kambites said:
On the plus side, it'll depreciate like... well like a Mercedes with a large petrol engine. Should be able to get one for <£10k in five years' time.
Lol really - take a look at E63Bi turbos 4 + years old now they don't start used until mid £30's. Take the one before it the 6.2v8 they are still in the teens heck the E55k is only just £8-18k and that's 10-15years old. Actually with the current vitriol that diesels are attracting, I suppose it's quite possible that petrol values will firm up a bit anyway.
Edited by kambites on Saturday 23 April 08:39
MikeTFSI said:
That's just it though, it should be simple but as with most things the brand has been diluted by 'AMG line' models. Those three letters are (liberally) applied to un-tuned small diesel hatchbacks as well as top end high performance cars. The person I responded to said manual gearbox options are not the point of AMG, hence my post asking what the point actually is.
I get that these days people want auto v8 Mercedes from their AMGs, but the thought of a deviated, more focused approach to the '43 models would have appealed. Big sideways smoking V8 '63 brutes and more nimble V6 '43 drivers cars, with a manual gearbox option.
Suppose I'm not the target audience though, so my musings are irrelevant.
But the W205 is a still a fairly big, wafty car to drive, it simply suits the auto better, and I bet they would sell less than 1% in manual guise if offered. I get that these days people want auto v8 Mercedes from their AMGs, but the thought of a deviated, more focused approach to the '43 models would have appealed. Big sideways smoking V8 '63 brutes and more nimble V6 '43 drivers cars, with a manual gearbox option.
Suppose I'm not the target audience though, so my musings are irrelevant.
Even the new 911s sell better with an auto 'box, so Mercedes would have no chance.
W203 C32 and C55, W204 C63, all of those suit the auto, that is not going to change with the W205.
Fast Bug said:
Bias towards the rear wheels, and you can get the back end to play if you try
It does sound much better than many AWD systems but to me at least, part of the appeal of a powerful Merc (especially with AMG branding) is that it can be entertaining when required. Most modern AWD cars are about "point and squirt", which gets boring very quickly...especially on our public roads where you can't use the performance without a prison sentence.Fast Bug said:
Bias towards the rear wheels, and you can get the back end to play if you try
The fun of a powerful RWD was that you wouldn't have to be going mad to get a little drift as you left the roundabout, the problem with it being AWD is that now to get the rear end stepping out you'll have to be going bats
t crazy to do it which kills the fun factor.kambites said:
At the risk of stating the bloody obvious, the point of AMG is to sell cars; not necessarily to sell AMG cars, though. Clearly all of the big German companies have decided they can make more money by using their halo brand as a trim level on hum-drum cars than by reserving them for the top-end models.
Seems a bit shorttermist to me, but they probably know better than me so either I'm wrong or they don't care.
Economic recession, volatile market and short term memory consumer and all that...Seems a bit shorttermist to me, but they probably know better than me so either I'm wrong or they don't care.
Marketing dictates that you use what you have now to get to the next shareholder meeting. Long term strategy on branding is a thing of the past. Nowadays, all the car companies abuse their halo brand then when they have the opportunity and funds they then bring out a halo model with a different logo e.g. add -R or -s or GTS at the end of M or AMG or GT
DoctorX said:
Read into that what you will!
I'm astonished at the vinyl seats. Presumably many owners won't care as long as it looks like leather.
If its anything like my C250d spt its awful and not what I would expect on a £20k car never mind a £45k car. Started splitting after 30k miles and looks very worn. I'm astonished at the vinyl seats. Presumably many owners won't care as long as it looks like leather.
Was really hoping that this C43 estate would be my next car but by the time I'd have a decent spec, it would be in the territory of cars that offer better value.
JEA1K said:
DoctorX said:
Read into that what you will!
I'm astonished at the vinyl seats. Presumably many owners won't care as long as it looks like leather.
If its anything like my C250d spt its awful and not what I would expect on a £20k car never mind a £45k car. Started splitting after 30k miles and looks very worn. I'm astonished at the vinyl seats. Presumably many owners won't care as long as it looks like leather.
Was really hoping that this C43 estate would be my next car but by the time I'd have a decent spec, it would be in the territory of cars that offer better value.
ZX10R NIN said:
The fun of a powerful RWD was that you wouldn't have to be going mad to get a little drift as you left the roundabout, the problem with it being AWD is that now to get the rear end stepping out you'll have to be going batst crazy to do it which kills the fun factor.
you haven't driven an AWD have you?t crazy to do it which kills the fun factor.
MikeTFSI said:
That's just it though, it should be simple but as with most things the brand has been diluted by 'AMG line' models. Those three letters are (liberally) applied to un-tuned small diesel hatchbacks as well as top end high performance cars. The person I responded to said manual gearbox options are not the point of AMG, hence my post asking what the point actually is.
AMG does develop the revised steering rack settings and sport suspensions that come with the AMG packages on the std. Mercs. Not sure about the brakes, as they appear to just be perforated discs.The cosmetic tat is also something they have always offered -- just like every other tuner on earth. The AMG kitted cars do drive better than their std. versions, so I see no issue with it.
scherzkeks said:
AMG does develop the revised steering rack settings and sport suspensions that come with the AMG packages on the std. Mercs. Not sure about the brakes, as they appear to just be perforated discs.
The cosmetic tat is also something they have always offered -- just like every other tuner on earth. The AMG kitted cars do drive better than their std. versions, so I see no issue with it.
I can't argue that in most cases there are genuine improvements; my E46 had the 'Sport' (before it was called "M-Sport") package, with better seats, suspension etc. but the issue comes from the cynical marketing. - I'm sure we've all spoken to someone who goes out of their way to tell you they drive an "AMG", wanting you to believe it's something special when in reality it's just another 2.0-litre diesel. Even some of the salespeople at franchised dealers play to this because it helps them sell cars to people who just want the shiniest trinket with the "best" badge.The cosmetic tat is also something they have always offered -- just like every other tuner on earth. The AMG kitted cars do drive better than their std. versions, so I see no issue with it.
Sometimes the factory rice is genuinely appalling as well. - Volvo, for example, make an S60 with a dual exhaust on a 1.6 diesel. Cringeworthy.
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