RE: Light IS Right: PH Blog
Discussion
otolith said:
I think the advantages of constructing the Evora from aluminium and fibreglass over pressed steel are probably more to do with tooling costs vs production volumes than lightness.
I'm sure that's right. As you say, it's a trade-off between tooling to build a production line or labour to build individual cars. The "problem" of that balance today is easily seen in the high retail price of cars like Ariel Atom and KTM X-Bow. Whether Alfa will ever make a bean out of the 4C remains to be seen but I reckon they'd have to sell a lot of cars to get there. Meanwhile Mazda and Porsche can churn out mass-produced steel sportscars by the bucket load with a very high level of engineering and quality control.Yep. Low volume manufacturers can't compete by taking on mass manufacturers on their own terms - they have to play to their own strengths.
I would not be at all surprised if the 4C is never expected to pay for itself. I think it was largely a profile raising exercise, mostly aimed at the re-entry to the US market.
I would not be at all surprised if the 4C is never expected to pay for itself. I think it was largely a profile raising exercise, mostly aimed at the re-entry to the US market.
was the case about 10 years ago and seems the always have been the trendy purist mantra,. but having owned many light and heavy cars.. I have to call boll o x on this.
it is just not the case in so many cars...
imo- there is a perfect weight for different types of cars. and that can be heavy, or light.
some of the most fun cars Ive had have been weighty,, and a couple of the very worst were the lightest.
.. this reminds me of the kind of old crap car sayings perpetuated by top gear and the like.. " you have to own an alfa at least once"
well I hired one for one week- and it was a piece of s
t.
it is just not the case in so many cars...
imo- there is a perfect weight for different types of cars. and that can be heavy, or light.
some of the most fun cars Ive had have been weighty,, and a couple of the very worst were the lightest.
.. this reminds me of the kind of old crap car sayings perpetuated by top gear and the like.. " you have to own an alfa at least once"
well I hired one for one week- and it was a piece of s
t.kambites said:
The ability to actually stop without requiring a brake servo is another reason I like lighter cars. Sadly these days it's impossible to get type approval without ABS, which in practice means a servo, even on light things. 
And it's true about Alfas- I have owned not one but two. One was sublime and one appalling - and they were the same model ... (Sud Ti - and don't let anybody say they aren't proper Alfas..!)
coppice said:
I wouldn't dream of having a non ABS road car as daily driver
I wonder how I've coped for the last 25yrs I've only had a couple of cars with ABS and I disconnected it in one (a new 406) after it nearly killed me 3 times one winter by refusing to apply the brakes at low speed coming up to junctions and I rolled across them.
I can't remember the last time I locked my brakes, the only time I can remember, was 10+years ago when a dog ran out in front of my car and then just stopped - I stopped from 60 with millimetres to spare, then it wandered off.
V8RX7 said:
I've only had a couple of cars with ABS and I disconnected it in one (a new 406) after it nearly killed me 3 times one winter by refusing to apply the brakes at low speed coming up to junctions and I rolled across them.
Gotta love these "ABS doesn't work" myths. I've got a special magnet attached to my fuel lines which gives me an extra 5 mpg.....
Ozzie Osmond said:
V8RX7 said:
I've only had a couple of cars with ABS and I disconnected it in one (a new 406) after it nearly killed me 3 times one winter by refusing to apply the brakes at low speed coming up to junctions and I rolled across them.
Gotta love these "ABS doesn't work" myths. Google will show it's far from a unique experience.
peterpeter said:
.. this reminds me of the kind of old crap car sayings perpetuated by top gear and the like.. " you have to own an alfa at least once"
well I hired one for one week- and it was a piece of st.
Actually I've always wondered about this saying too, I owned an Alfasud and for its time it was great, light years ahead of the rival Vauxhall Chevette or Ford Escort Mk2, but since then, most of the stuff served up by Alfa has been very, very average and backed up by awful owner satisfaction survey results. I think its time the "everyone must own an Alfa" quip is consigned to the dustbin.well I hired one for one week- and it was a piece of s
t.Uncle John said:
My Mk3 MR2 is a hoot to drive, 130'ish HP and under a ton, changes direction like a housefly.
With you on that. Mine I could steer on the throttle and the turn in was fantastic. I had the 10th car delivered to the uk and it was a great drive, but they did tone it down on later ones as people complained about how fast it responded !Did flip mine end over end on the m6 though,
As an aside, the ABS isn't just about stopping shorter (though it does that if you're frozen in pre-crash rictus) but crucially about being able to steer while you're foot is planted on the (otherwise skidding) brake; ABS lets you steer with semi-rotating wheels rather than ineffectually turning the direction of the skid patch.
I loved the feel of the unservoed brakes, but if I'm tootling around with the kids then of course, ABS every time. Being aware of the lack of ABS kept me sharper on the roads and increased my safety bubble by some margin & agreed - some early ABS were shocking and difficult in extreme conditions; much better systems now I think.
I loved the feel of the unservoed brakes, but if I'm tootling around with the kids then of course, ABS every time. Being aware of the lack of ABS kept me sharper on the roads and increased my safety bubble by some margin & agreed - some early ABS were shocking and difficult in extreme conditions; much better systems now I think.
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