RE: Ford Focus RS vs. Honda Civic Type R
Discussion
Good result for me, as I own the Civic, but does it really matter? There are a plethora of mega bhp hatches to suit all tastes. I feel we are in a bit of a golden age of hot hatchery, not seen since the 80's, driven by car manufactures trying to outgun each other.
At 16 all I wanted was a R5 Turbo or Fiesta RS Turbo, who'd have thought then, that one day we'd be in an era where 300bhp hot hatches would be the norm.
For me the Civic echo's the appeal that the R5 and Fiesta used to have before I could drive. The Focus may be quicker but the Civic appeals more to my inner 16 year old self.
At 16 all I wanted was a R5 Turbo or Fiesta RS Turbo, who'd have thought then, that one day we'd be in an era where 300bhp hot hatches would be the norm.
For me the Civic echo's the appeal that the R5 and Fiesta used to have before I could drive. The Focus may be quicker but the Civic appeals more to my inner 16 year old self.
I see the words, but I'm not feeling it. The synopsis seems to be that the Honda is better because it revs more, and is faster on a nice dry circuit, and dry empty roads. Damned with faint praise. I'm struggling to see how this relates to real roads under real (commute, Sunday morning drive in March, junctions with tarmac braking up and scattered gravel etc) conditions. The Focus might be a weighty young gal, but the Honda looks another half-class above it in terms of size (or is this just Father Dougal's cows?)
P.S. Car makers: I'm so over white paint, can we have something more interesting to look at now? Ta.
P.S. Car makers: I'm so over white paint, can we have something more interesting to look at now? Ta.
I don't understand all these people harping on about how much better the RS or Golf R are because of their inevitable advantage in the wet.
4WD gives you traction, so yes, they are able to get off the mark better and get the power down better and sooner than FWD so off into the distance they may well fly when it's wet, but...............
In the real world to be safe in the wet you also need grip because this ultimately stops you from sliding off into the scenery and it also, quite importantly enables you to slow down and stop. 4WD gives no advantage here.
These cars offer their best in perfect conditions, so dry is the obvious and only medium in which they should be compared IMHO
In the wet, driving responsibly, FWD is perfectly adequate for me personally
4WD gives you traction, so yes, they are able to get off the mark better and get the power down better and sooner than FWD so off into the distance they may well fly when it's wet, but...............
In the real world to be safe in the wet you also need grip because this ultimately stops you from sliding off into the scenery and it also, quite importantly enables you to slow down and stop. 4WD gives no advantage here.
These cars offer their best in perfect conditions, so dry is the obvious and only medium in which they should be compared IMHO
In the wet, driving responsibly, FWD is perfectly adequate for me personally
Mastodon2 said:
But they've made a better car than one of their biggest competitors and they didn't have a choice about letting the old engine style go - which I lament as much as anyone, but they weren't going to be able to compete with the 300bhp hatches and meet emissions regs, or get any sort of fuel economy with an old style VTEC engine.
Civic for me please, looks more exciting than the RS and seems to be a better drive too. I didn't think the RS was going to be so heavy, what a porker. It's turned out to be a bit of a damp squib.
Other reviews have favoured the focus, however you look at it their both good cars, the problem as I see it is the engines were one of the major selling points for Honda in the past, integra, Civic, S2000 and I can't help but feel that the current engine just does not have that same aura.Civic for me please, looks more exciting than the RS and seems to be a better drive too. I didn't think the RS was going to be so heavy, what a porker. It's turned out to be a bit of a damp squib.
I'm sure the engine itself is solid enough, but does nothing really different to other engines in the class, when your lining up a replacement for perhaps one of the greatest inline 4'a of all time then doing it well is just not enough, they needed the engine to really standout
What's going on in this thread? People are having a polite discussion on the merits of both cars with next to no fanboy attacks.
This is PH you know. Sort it out.
Personally they both leave me a bit cold, I admire the engineering but the weight of the Focus and the looks of the Civic put me off. I guess being in my early 40's I'm not exactly the target market though.
This is PH you know. Sort it out.
Personally they both leave me a bit cold, I admire the engineering but the weight of the Focus and the looks of the Civic put me off. I guess being in my early 40's I'm not exactly the target market though.
It obviously isn't one of the screamers of old but it pulls cleanly and breathes well all the way to 7,000rpm, it's a touch laggy at the low end but that doesn't bother me, it just adds to the character (which it is lacking compared to the old VTEC I admit).
It's probably the best "generic turbo" engine I have driven though, better than the Focus ST, Astra VXR, Golf GTI and Golf R (although that is nice and peaky too, but not as much so) for a certainty - it's a peach of a unit and whilst it might not match the RS off of the line it fairly piles on the pace once you are shifting, it's f
king fast as fk.
It's probably the best "generic turbo" engine I have driven though, better than the Focus ST, Astra VXR, Golf GTI and Golf R (although that is nice and peaky too, but not as much so) for a certainty - it's a peach of a unit and whilst it might not match the RS off of the line it fairly piles on the pace once you are shifting, it's f
king fast as fk.Edited by Axionknight on Sunday 22 May 17:50
KingNothing said:
I've got a Mk.2 RS, but I would probably have the Civic.
I think this is probably one of the problems the RS may have i.e. owners who loved the madness of the Mk2 car no longer feel the same way about the Mk3. ETA: however I am sure that the new car will capture buyers who may have purchased a Golf R but want something a bit crazier.It would be interesting to hear how the CTR performed with MPSS or MPSC2 fitted in place of the Continentals. From the sounds of it the car may go up another notch again!
Selmer Mk6 said:
When it rains (which over the course of the year is not that much) I tend to drive slower (I live in the South of England).
Do you live in a different England to me? Best case scenario it's raining one in three days, worst one in two. In winter it needs a couple of sunny days in a row for the roads to become dry-ish.
Doesn't surprise me, can remember when Honda were marketing the Civic to be something very special and they have delivered.
Lots of clutching at straws on here, reading a comment saying that it's not a fair test because it doesn't represent a daily commute?? Seriously sad. Yeah I love me a wet Monday morning commute to work, those are the best days......
You buy cars like these for empty roads, that's the dream, you don't go and buy an RS because you love your daily commute ffs.
Lots of clutching at straws on here, reading a comment saying that it's not a fair test because it doesn't represent a daily commute?? Seriously sad. Yeah I love me a wet Monday morning commute to work, those are the best days......
You buy cars like these for empty roads, that's the dream, you don't go and buy an RS because you love your daily commute ffs.
How come no one is comparing anything to the new 45 amg? Surely the best out there at the minute and only downside is it's a bit pricey! Having said that with what people are currently asking for the new Focus Rs it's on a par price wise I'd say with much more luxury and quality so surely it's got to be reviewed much more often than its currently being done
Justin-40y0e said:
How come no one is comparing anything to the new 45 amg? Surely the best out there at the minute and only downside is it's a bit pricey! Having said that with what people are currently asking for the new Focus Rs it's on a par price wise I'd say with much more luxury and quality so surely it's got to be reviewed much more often than its currently being done
Have to agree, I think it's because of the price point more than anything but still should be more in the mix. Same can be said for the Golf R as well.J4CKO said:
Yeah, all done on bone dry tarmac, which isnt the case in the UK most of the time, 300 bhp and fwd in the wet is going to be interesting, the Ford seems better value, they are pretty much the same price yet Ford manage to include 4WD.
So make it an unfair test then..? They also managed to include a lot of weightVery surprised at the outcome. Seems to go against most other hatch reviews for the cars. I was also reading a review of the 308gti. Apparently the claimed weight figures for those is 1205kg. I think that is quite a lot less than other larger hatches. Plus not too different from the 306gti6 and the 208gti.
Hopefully others follow suit if the figures are correct.
Hopefully others follow suit if the figures are correct.
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