Electric cars - finally a counter arguement...

[rscott]

George111 said:

AnotherClarkey said:

George111 said:

If I had been sufficiently interested I would have

There are more characters in your 'not sufficiently interested' sentence than it takes to google 'nissan leaf battery warranty', whereupon the answer pops up right in front of your face.

So ? I could spend all day searching for things I'm vaguely interested in or thought about but I'd then have no time do anything else. Plus commenting on here will probably get a more informative response from people who have a Leaf and can offer real world experience of battery degradation and possibly making a claim on the warranty. If you search for that sort of thing you'll end up with all the internet trolls and rubbish "dealer broke my car" posts from cretins who shouldn't be allowed to own a calculator let alone a car.

Happy now ?

Let me google the answer for you - https://www.nissan.co.uk/vehicles/new-vehicles/lea... .

nissan said:

1. BATTERY QUALITY GUARANTEE
(i) 24 KWH LEAF : If the battery capacity level gauge of your 24 kWh Nissan Electric Vehicle falls below 9 bars (out of 12
bars) within 60,000 miles or the first 5 years of the vehicle’s life (whichever comes first), Nissan will repair or replace the
damaged battery components free of charge to bring the capacity up to 9 bars.
(ii) 30 KWH LEAF : If the battery capacity level gauge of your 30 kWh Nissan Electric Vehicle falls below 9 bars (out of 12
bars) within 100,000 miles or the first 8 years of the vehicle’s life (whichever comes first), Nissan will repair or replace the
damaged battery components free of charge to bring the capacity up to 9 bars.

.

They're also offering to lend you a petrol car for up to 14 days in total over the first 3 years of Leaf ownership, charging you only for insurance. Plus free rapid charging at Nissan dealers, free recovery as long as you have the vehicle serviced by Nissan, etc.

[rodericb]

pherlopolus said:

I think the issue is that

1) the parties who wrote the piece are not unbiased
2) the journalists who picked up on the article were looking for sensational story that they could spin against EV cars
3) The Anti-EV "just because" groups have picked up on 2) with out doing research on 1)

You will not find any research which is not biased, especially when it comes to pollution and climate change. Big Oil funded research, climategate, Al Gore and his part ownership of the Chicago climate exchange, the list goes on and on. Mix that with keyboard warriors who spoil for a fight and play loose with facts (or lack subject matter knowledge) and it is all just a st sandwich.

[rscott]

Valgar said:

eh?

If you wanted to convince people not to buy EV vehicles just look at a 3 year old LEAF and see the depreciation

If that's not enough check out the price of a replacement battery £5000+

I notice you forgot to mention there's a £1000 credit from Nissan when you return the old battery pack...

[rodericb]

996TT02 said:

Well, technically, brake dust and tyre dust would be more voluminous for a heavy vehicle.

But yes the article is tripe, written by someone with an agenda just trying to justify it. And failing.

It doesn't help that the rear suspension geo is a bit out of whack one a well known and loved EV: http://insideevs.com/examining-tesla-model-s-exces...

Of course this could be the case with all vehicles but flogging out rear tyres faster than the equivalent ICE car doesn't help ones argument.

[Elliot2000]

98elise said:

pherlopolus said:

98elise said:

You know that most braking in ICE's is regen don't you.

Edited by 98elise on Wednesday 25th May 18:51

only if they don't use the brakes and coast?

Doh....obviously I meant EV.

EV's regen, LU trains don't (but they could)

Actually LU trains do most of their braking this way, and only the final stop or emergency is done by the brakes shoes

[Devil2575]

Mr GrimNasty said:

It's not utter tripe, I pointed out years ago that vehicle emissions were becoming so low that the biggest contributor to PMs would soon be brake/tyre dust.

The London Underground is electric but the metal/brake dust is a health 'risk'.

What is tripe is that any of this, including the worst diesel emissions from modern cars, is in anyway a significant health risk.

Science disagrees with you.

Given that science is evidence based it is far more likely to be right than you.

[Devil2575]

charltjr said:

It's not the scientists fault that the media is just looking for something controversial to get page views so suddenly pick up on a report that's been around for a couple of years and turn it into an "EVs are bad shock horror" headline.

This. In general reporting of science is pretty poor.

[Amateurish]

rscott said:

Valgar said:

eh?

If you wanted to convince people not to buy EV vehicles just look at a 3 year old LEAF and see the depreciation

If that's not enough check out the price of a replacement battery £5000+

I notice you forgot to mention there's a £1000 credit from Nissan when you return the old battery pack...

How bad is the depreciation? My Leaf Tekna was £17k new (after discounts), the cheapest 3 year old equivalent I can see on AT is £9k. So approx 50% after three years seems pretty standard for the sector.

[budgie smuggler]

rodericb said:

996TT02 said:

Well, technically, brake dust and tyre dust would be more voluminous for a heavy vehicle.

But yes the article is tripe, written by someone with an agenda just trying to justify it. And failing.

It doesn't help that the rear suspension geo is a bit out of whack one a well known and loved EV: http://insideevs.com/examining-tesla-model-s-exces...

Of course this could be the case with all vehicles but flogging out rear tyres faster than the equivalent ICE car doesn't help ones argument.

Probably not the best argument to be making TBH considering the sawtooth rear tyre wear problem a lot of (esp. VW/Audi) ICE cars have

[Terminator X]

Burn them with fire just to be sure.

TX.

[Monty Python]

They're not the only ones looking at non-tailpipe emissions from vehicles:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S... - down in the references section

[andrewrob]

rscott said:

Valgar said:

eh?

If you wanted to convince people not to buy EV vehicles just look at a 3 year old LEAF and see the depreciation

If that's not enough check out the price of a replacement battery £5000+

I notice you forgot to mention there's a £1000 credit from Nissan when you return the old battery pack...

I've been doing a lot of research around buying a two year old leaf. Found a company that can replace the battery for £1500, they're normally good for around 100k miles before they start loosing a fair chunk of range

[Terminator X]

andrewrob said:

I've been doing a lot of research around buying a two year old leaf. Found a company that can replace the battery for £1500, they're normally good for around 100k miles before they start loosing a fair chunk of range

Roughly 8 years of being charged almost every day?! Why don't they use this battery tech in say my electric shaver, that way I wouldn't need to replace it every fking year.

TX.

[andrewrob]

Terminator X said:

andrewrob said:

I've been doing a lot of research around buying a two year old leaf. Found a company that can replace the battery for £1500, they're normally good for around 100k miles before they start loosing a fair chunk of range

Roughly 8 years of being charged almost every day?! Why don't they use this battery tech in say my electric shaver, that way I wouldn't need to replace it every fking year.

TX.

They're not bad at all, cant remember which town now but they had a fleet of leaf taxis being fast charged after every drain, they'd only lost a bar of range at 100k miles which isn't bad at all. Further down the scale, I use lithium polymer batteries in large drones, I've still got batteries that are over 5 years and going strong. They are charged at 1 - 1.5C every time. Also use 6 of them hooked up in an electric bike that's used every weekday and charged at 1.5C each night and no noticeable degradation in nearly a year of heavy use

[George111]

rscott said:

George111 said:

AnotherClarkey said:

George111 said:

If I had been sufficiently interested I would have

There are more characters in your 'not sufficiently interested' sentence than it takes to google 'nissan leaf battery warranty', whereupon the answer pops up right in front of your face.

So ? I could spend all day searching for things I'm vaguely interested in or thought about but I'd then have no time do anything else. Plus commenting on here will probably get a more informative response from people who have a Leaf and can offer real world experience of battery degradation and possibly making a claim on the warranty. If you search for that sort of thing you'll end up with all the internet trolls and rubbish "dealer broke my car" posts from cretins who shouldn't be allowed to own a calculator let alone a car.

Happy now ?

Let me google the answer for you - https://www.nissan.co.uk/vehicles/new-vehicles/lea... .

nissan said:

1. BATTERY QUALITY GUARANTEE
(i) 24 KWH LEAF : If the battery capacity level gauge of your 24 kWh Nissan Electric Vehicle falls below 9 bars (out of 12
bars) within 60,000 miles or the first 5 years of the vehicle’s life (whichever comes first), Nissan will repair or replace the
damaged battery components free of charge to bring the capacity up to 9 bars.
(ii) 30 KWH LEAF : If the battery capacity level gauge of your 30 kWh Nissan Electric Vehicle falls below 9 bars (out of 12
bars) within 100,000 miles or the first 8 years of the vehicle’s life (whichever comes first), Nissan will repair or replace the
damaged battery components free of charge to bring the capacity up to 9 bars.

.

They're also offering to lend you a petrol car for up to 14 days in total over the first 3 years of Leaf ownership, charging you only for insurance. Plus free rapid charging at Nissan dealers, free recovery as long as you have the vehicle serviced by Nissan, etc.

Whilst I appreciate the assistance, you're too late

[amstrange1]

Amateurish said:

How bad is the depreciation? My Leaf Tekna was £17k new (after discounts), the cheapest 3 year old equivalent I can see on AT is £9k. So approx 50% after three years seems pretty standard for the sector.

That's the issue - such hefty discounts were available on list price when new, it makes it appear that the RV on a 2 or 3 year old car is terrible; when clearly it isn't.

[ZX10R NIN]

The incentives from the government seem to have been taken away now so your Leaf Tenka is now £20,630 before any discount you can get from the dealer.

[pherlopolus]

ZX10R NIN said:

The incentives from the government seem to have been taken away now so your Leaf Tenka is now £20,630 before any discount you can get from the dealer.

still there but changes...

2. Eligibility
There are 4 categories of low emission vehicles. The grant you can get depends on the category.

Category CO2 emissions Zero emission range Grant Maximum grant
1 Under 50g/km At least 70 miles 35% of cost £4,500
2 Under 50g/km 10 to 69 miles 35% of cost £2,500
3 50 to 75g/km At least 20 miles 35% of cost £2,500
Van Under 75g/km At least 10 miles 20% of cost £8,000