In the news - Jaguar Land Rover Manager - Road Rage Crash
Discussion
longblackcoat said:
So boil it down. Which cars do you think bring out the worst in people? You say this the behaviour displayed is 'typical' so you must have the evidence of your own eyes.
You're the guy bringing the assertion, so let's hear which cars are the worst driven. Then we can look at the accident stats for those cars and see if they're more likely to be involved in a collision which, logically, they would be, if they're being driven as badly as you state.
I don't know if (in fact I doubt that) aggressive, bullying driving is necessarily reflected by insurance claim stats. I think, I don't know, that some, not all, agressive, bullying drivers are probably technically competent drivers and therefore avoid actually having accidents in most instances. Tragically, in this case he was obviuosly just crap is very possible sense.You're the guy bringing the assertion, so let's hear which cars are the worst driven. Then we can look at the accident stats for those cars and see if they're more likely to be involved in a collision which, logically, they would be, if they're being driven as badly as you state.
I don't want to derail it even more, as I think it's utterly ridiculous you're all having this petty argument on a thread about a tragic crash(Didn't want to use the word accident) which resulted in two little girls receiving life changing injuries.
I drive a car most consider flash, it has silly fairy lights on the front and when the headlights are on they're really bright LEDs, it isn't a 4x4 though, it's an E Class. I would agree for the amount of them you see there is more aggression, bullying from Audis, BMWs and the like then you do from say an Astra or Focus.
However you probably notice it more when it's an Audi because of the "typical Audi driver" logic, when you see a Focus be aggressive you probably just think "what a knob" without taking much notice to what they're driving.
I personally think the worst, most aggressive, biggest risk taking drivers are in tatty heaps, normally early Zafiras with no remaining wheel trims or a Picasso, but that's for another thread.
I drive a car most consider flash, it has silly fairy lights on the front and when the headlights are on they're really bright LEDs, it isn't a 4x4 though, it's an E Class. I would agree for the amount of them you see there is more aggression, bullying from Audis, BMWs and the like then you do from say an Astra or Focus.
However you probably notice it more when it's an Audi because of the "typical Audi driver" logic, when you see a Focus be aggressive you probably just think "what a knob" without taking much notice to what they're driving.
I personally think the worst, most aggressive, biggest risk taking drivers are in tatty heaps, normally early Zafiras with no remaining wheel trims or a Picasso, but that's for another thread.
carlove said:
I don't want to derail it even more, as I think it's utterly ridiculous you're all having this petty argument on a thread about a tragic crash(Didn't want to use the word accident) which resulted in two little girls receiving life changing injuries.
I drive a car most consider flash, it has silly fairy lights on the front and when the headlights are on they're really bright LEDs, it isn't a 4x4 though, it's an E Class. I would agree for the amount of them you see there is more aggression, bullying from Audis, BMWs and the like then you do from say an Astra or Focus.
However you probably notice it more when it's an Audi because of the "typical Audi driver" logic, when you see a Focus be aggressive you probably just think "what a knob" without taking much notice to what they're driving.
I personally think the worst, most aggressive, biggest risk taking drivers are in tatty heaps, normally early Zafiras with no remaining wheel trims or a Picasso, but that's for another thread.
Agree with just about all that.I drive a car most consider flash, it has silly fairy lights on the front and when the headlights are on they're really bright LEDs, it isn't a 4x4 though, it's an E Class. I would agree for the amount of them you see there is more aggression, bullying from Audis, BMWs and the like then you do from say an Astra or Focus.
However you probably notice it more when it's an Audi because of the "typical Audi driver" logic, when you see a Focus be aggressive you probably just think "what a knob" without taking much notice to what they're driving.
I personally think the worst, most aggressive, biggest risk taking drivers are in tatty heaps, normally early Zafiras with no remaining wheel trims or a Picasso, but that's for another thread.
nffcforever said:
Deerfoot said:
Looked like a case of red mist to me, he was totally focused on chasing the other car.
Fairly typical (although obviously an extreme example) of the kind of behaviour drivers of cars like this often seem to think is ok. Tailgating their way around the country with their little fairy lights twinkling away assuming for some reason that everyone is meant to get out of their way, the roads belong to them, and rules, laws and general manners aren't important, so long as they can arrive as soon as physically possible. Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them."Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them."
"Fairly typical (although obviously an extreme example) of the kind of behaviour drivers of cars like this "
OP is a tool trying to squirm out of it.
When you boil this down the crux of the matter being discussed (which has sadly veered away from the topic in question) is does a certain personality type choose a certain type or brand of car.
The answer is probably yes, but of course not everyone who chooses that type/brand of car will be of a certain personality type.
That is why these discussions are so pointless.
I drive a Mazda 6 during the week and an AMG at the weekend. The way I am treated by other road users when in the AMG is radically different to when I am in the 6... yet I am the same person.
So the argument while holding some water is not an absolute one and that is why there is little point discussing it.
Back to the topic - he deserves a custodial but more to the point it's very sad what the outcome of this incident means for that family who will live with the results of the idiotic actions of this driver for the rest of their lives!
The answer is probably yes, but of course not everyone who chooses that type/brand of car will be of a certain personality type.
That is why these discussions are so pointless.
I drive a Mazda 6 during the week and an AMG at the weekend. The way I am treated by other road users when in the AMG is radically different to when I am in the 6... yet I am the same person.
So the argument while holding some water is not an absolute one and that is why there is little point discussing it.
Back to the topic - he deserves a custodial but more to the point it's very sad what the outcome of this incident means for that family who will live with the results of the idiotic actions of this driver for the rest of their lives!
Sump said:
This is the problematic post.
"Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them."
"Fairly typical (although obviously an extreme example) of the kind of behaviour drivers of cars like this "
OP is a tool trying to squirm out of it.
The problem is that some people seem to be more keen to express offence at my opinion than at the Discovery driver."Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them."
"Fairly typical (although obviously an extreme example) of the kind of behaviour drivers of cars like this "
OP is a tool trying to squirm out of it.
I explained that utter tools lot of them meant people who drive like arses.
If you don't believe me or want to believe that you somehow know better than me what I actually think even though you don't know me from Adam then that's up to you.
nffcforever said:
How very pleasant of you. No, actually rather aggressive. A Discovery driver by any chance?
Edit to also add that, after re-reading my earlier post, and the offence it caused, I should clarify that "Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them." was referring to the drivers that assume "for some reason that everyone is meant to get out of their way, the roads belong to them, and rules, laws and general manners aren't important, so long as they can arrive as soon as physically possible", and categorically not to all drivers of "cars like this".
But, I would maintain, that anecdotally, in my experience, drivers of "cars like this" (by which I meant expensive, powerful, prestige etc, and not necessarily SUVs) are more likely to be excessively aggressive in their driving manner. There is probably someone more intelligent than me that has carried out research into the types of personalities that 'typically' drive such cars, and/or the effect that driving such cars can have on the manner of driving.
Anyway, that is all very inconsequential in the scheme of things. As mentioned above, hopefully this sorry episode will make at least one silly little boy think twice before losing his cool and having a temper tantrum at the wheel.
I can't tell you how much I condemn the driver of the Discovery in that crash. I would like to see him sharing a cell with Jimmy Savile and Ian Brady and a massive, testosterone-driven body builder nutter for the next few decades.Edit to also add that, after re-reading my earlier post, and the offence it caused, I should clarify that "Utter brainless, selfish, arrogant tools the lot of them." was referring to the drivers that assume "for some reason that everyone is meant to get out of their way, the roads belong to them, and rules, laws and general manners aren't important, so long as they can arrive as soon as physically possible", and categorically not to all drivers of "cars like this".
But, I would maintain, that anecdotally, in my experience, drivers of "cars like this" (by which I meant expensive, powerful, prestige etc, and not necessarily SUVs) are more likely to be excessively aggressive in their driving manner. There is probably someone more intelligent than me that has carried out research into the types of personalities that 'typically' drive such cars, and/or the effect that driving such cars can have on the manner of driving.
Anyway, that is all very inconsequential in the scheme of things. As mentioned above, hopefully this sorry episode will make at least one silly little boy think twice before losing his cool and having a temper tantrum at the wheel.
Edited by nffcforever on Thursday 26th May 23:19
However there are plenty of perfectly normal, considerate people who have expensive cars.
untakenname said:
Even though the other driver was to blame the mother will have to live with the fact that she instigated the tragic series of events that lead to her daughters being disabled.
Will the drivers insurers pay out considering it was a deliberate act and not an avoidable accident?
You've misread what happenedWill the drivers insurers pay out considering it was a deliberate act and not an avoidable accident?
The car that you claim instigated it had already turned right - which is why the eejert was trying to do same
The victims of it all were in a third car
untakenname said:
Even though the other driver was to blame the mother will have to live with the fact that she instigated the tragic series of events that lead to her daughters being disabled.
Will the drivers insurers pay out considering it was a deliberate act and not an avoidable accident?
The third party's rights are not affected. That's why third party insurance is compulsary. Whether the insurer pursues the insured in civil court after the payout is another matter.Will the drivers insurers pay out considering it was a deliberate act and not an avoidable accident?
cb1965 said:
I drive a Mazda 6 during the week and an AMG at the weekend. The way I am treated by other road users when in the AMG is radically different to when I am in the 6... yet I am the same person.
So the argument while holding some water is not an absolute one and that is why there is little point discussing it.
Agreed. I'm a vauxhall Corsa in the week then (until recently) an Aston Martin DBS at the weekend. Great fun but different discussions on the garage forecourts So the argument while holding some water is not an absolute one and that is why there is little point discussing it.
Look, I'm not going to defend all of the OP's post, or opinions, but I'll just make one point.
The sentiment is correct; in this situation, this particular driver has ruined a number of lives and is not going to 'benefit' from a probably limited time at Her Majesty's Pleasure.
However, the language that was used in making these points was not the best, hence the vitriol on both sides of the keyboard. While the OP has tried to clarify his words a number of times, the moment had gone and perhaps a little more patience should have been employed in making that initial point. Short story; everyone calm down, it's not helpful.
A driver can be an idiot irrespective of gender, age, occupation, vehicle type.
And to clarify, yes I'm (or at least my wife) is a Discovery driver, but cannot even vaguely get my head around what could possibly put the thoughts into someone's head to act like the driver did. As this whole story just points out; life is too short.
Now, where's my emergency kit of goatee, well-builtness, burning pitchfork, frozen sausages and can of RedBull?
The sentiment is correct; in this situation, this particular driver has ruined a number of lives and is not going to 'benefit' from a probably limited time at Her Majesty's Pleasure.
However, the language that was used in making these points was not the best, hence the vitriol on both sides of the keyboard. While the OP has tried to clarify his words a number of times, the moment had gone and perhaps a little more patience should have been employed in making that initial point. Short story; everyone calm down, it's not helpful.
A driver can be an idiot irrespective of gender, age, occupation, vehicle type.
And to clarify, yes I'm (or at least my wife) is a Discovery driver, but cannot even vaguely get my head around what could possibly put the thoughts into someone's head to act like the driver did. As this whole story just points out; life is too short.
Now, where's my emergency kit of goatee, well-builtness, burning pitchfork, frozen sausages and can of RedBull?
A.J.M said:
He believes that people who drive like that are tools.
The choice of car they use be it a 4x4 or an Audi A1 isn't the issue.
Trying to tar a whole car segment on the stupidity of one driver is what some people are annoyed at.
This is a good reason why road rage is not worth it. Keeping calm and being the better person wouldn't have seen that poor family suffer in such a horrible and cruel way.
I dont agree with our "Forest Fan" per se, but you saying the "choice of car is irrelevant" not true. If this arrogant tThe choice of car they use be it a 4x4 or an Audi A1 isn't the issue.
Trying to tar a whole car segment on the stupidity of one driver is what some people are annoyed at.
This is a good reason why road rage is not worth it. Keeping calm and being the better person wouldn't have seen that poor family suffer in such a horrible and cruel way.
t had made driven exactly the same in a mk2 fiesta or on a motorbike, the likely outcome would have bene far different. IMO there are SOME people that drive far less safely because they perceive (with some justification) that they are in a big safe vehicle and that "they will be ok" . Ie they are selfish tts who dont give a monkeys about anyone else. But if the intent of the post you reply to was to say all Disco drivers are bells, well clearly that isn't true. But do some people drive big cars because they themselves are a f
king liability on the roads, wither through incompetence or aggression...absolutely. IN a previous job we sold Land / range rovers as well as Hilux pickups and we did have customers buying them because little johnny or Mrs XYZ had crashed three Pugs and Fords into trees / other cars and dad / hubby wanted them to be "safe". Had to bit our lips to not suggest they get some fking driving lessons!! As for this case, that
(and he is a ) was clearly chasing that Mazda and just had absolutely no regard for anyone else. He needs to be locked up for as long as possible, and banned for a very very long time when he comes out. Poor family, dreadful for them. s3fella said:
IN a previous job we sold Land / range rovers as well as Hilux pickups and we did have customers buying them because little johnny or Mrs XYZ had crashed three Pugs and Fords into trees / other cars and dad / hubby wanted them to be "safe". Had to bit our lips to not suggest they get some fking driving lessons!!
In reality these sort of people should be removed from the road. At most they should only be allowed in an Austin mini covered in bubble wrap. To allow incompetent idiots behind the wheel of huge lumps of metal is a very scary thought. They might feel a bit safer from their own clumsy actions, but now the rest of the world is in twice as much danger. king driving lessons!! 
Still at least they're ok and that is all they care about I suppose.k-ink said:
News report:
"Andrew Nay's reckless actions had devastating consequences for our two beautiful daughters.
Katrina and Karlina were happy, active children and he has robbed them of that.
We will never be able to forgive him.
Every day they ask 'when will we start feeling our legs again?' They think it's going to get better and it's too hard to tell them.
– PARENTS OF KATRINA AND KARLINA RAIBA"
Jesus, that's horrific."Andrew Nay's reckless actions had devastating consequences for our two beautiful daughters.
Katrina and Karlina were happy, active children and he has robbed them of that.
We will never be able to forgive him.
Every day they ask 'when will we start feeling our legs again?' They think it's going to get better and it's too hard to tell them.
– PARENTS OF KATRINA AND KARLINA RAIBA"
The video is horrendous too - what the feck was he thinking? What a tool of a man.
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