RE: Peugeot 106 Rallye: Spotted
Discussion
My wife had an S1 106 Rally in red as a daily driver, M91KBC, from new. Built to special order with no sunroof as I banged my head in the demonstrator,
but central locking and a radio cassette/CD disk changer.
It was a fabulous car- only reliability issue was a failing TDC sensor, which made starting a bit hit and miss.
Far too easy to sell and the vehicle status check suggests it died in 2009.
but central locking and a radio cassette/CD disk changer.
It was a fabulous car- only reliability issue was a failing TDC sensor, which made starting a bit hit and miss.
Far too easy to sell and the vehicle status check suggests it died in 2009.
Always liked these and currently thinking of buying one, or another similar small lightweight and simple hatchback.
To anyone with previous experience what are your thoughts on S1 vs S2, and standard vs modified with tuned VTS engine or similar.
My current S1 Elise 111S is great but I only really use it in good weather, so I'm thinking of selling and getting something fun and cheapish that I'm more likely to use in all weather conditions. I'm a bit bored of modern cars and the detachment between car and drive resulting from the increased refinement, and awful steering systems, as well as the levels of performance which can rarely be exploited on the road.
To anyone with previous experience what are your thoughts on S1 vs S2, and standard vs modified with tuned VTS engine or similar.
My current S1 Elise 111S is great but I only really use it in good weather, so I'm thinking of selling and getting something fun and cheapish that I'm more likely to use in all weather conditions. I'm a bit bored of modern cars and the detachment between car and drive resulting from the increased refinement, and awful steering systems, as well as the levels of performance which can rarely be exploited on the road.
dollyboy said:
Always liked these and currently thinking of buying one, or another similar small lightweight and simple hatchback.
To anyone with previous experience what are your thoughts on S1 vs S2, and standard vs modified with tuned VTS engine or similar.
My current S1 Elise 111S is great but I only really use it in good weather, so I'm thinking of selling and getting something fun and cheapish that I'm more likely to use in all weather conditions. I'm a bit bored of modern cars and the detachment between car and drive resulting from the increased refinement, and awful steering systems, as well as the levels of performance which can rarely be exploited on the road.
I can certainly share my experiences owning a standard 1998 1.6 16V GTi and a standard 1994 1.3 8V Rallye.To anyone with previous experience what are your thoughts on S1 vs S2, and standard vs modified with tuned VTS engine or similar.
My current S1 Elise 111S is great but I only really use it in good weather, so I'm thinking of selling and getting something fun and cheapish that I'm more likely to use in all weather conditions. I'm a bit bored of modern cars and the detachment between car and drive resulting from the increased refinement, and awful steering systems, as well as the levels of performance which can rarely be exploited on the road.
The 1.6 16V is a bit more refined and coupled with the GTi gearbox, more suitable for day to day driving.
The 1.3 8V is totally bonkers. It's not as powerful as the GTi, but thanks to the closer gearbox ratios and reduced weight (almost matches the GTi in terms of bhp/ton) it's every bit as quick in the real world.
I would imagine a series 1 Rallye with a GTi/VTS engine and the original gearbox would be an absolute weapon to drive. However, there is something quite special about the the 1.3 8V engine (the trademark lumpy idle, aggressive cam and 7200rpm peak power) that means that I would still go for this over the 1.6 16V if you can live with the limitations (don't waste your time on motorways).
t4thomas said:
I can certainly share my experiences owning a standard 1998 1.6 16V GTi and a standard 1994 1.3 8V Rallye.
The 1.6 16V is a bit more refined and coupled with the GTi gearbox, more suitable for day to day driving.
The 1.3 8V is totally bonkers. It's not as powerful as the GTi, but thanks to the closer gearbox ratios and reduced weight (almost matches the GTi in terms of bhp/ton) it's every bit as quick in the real world.
I would imagine a series 1 Rallye with a GTi/VTS engine and the original gearbox would be an absolute weapon to drive. However, there is something quite special about the the 1.3 8V engine (the trademark lumpy idle, aggressive cam and 7200rpm peak power) that means that I would still go for this over the 1.6 16V if you can live with the limitations (don't waste your time on motorways).
Thanks for your thoughts. As I'm looking for a fun little car for driving B roads, or rather unclassified roads, around the Yorkshire Dales and nearby, it sounds as though the S1 would be the one to go for. I've heard previously how good the little 1.3 is, I guess its just a matter of trying to find one which still has the 1.3 and in good condition. Most of them look rough or have had the engine changed, I occasionally look at Rallye's for sale and there seems to be more S2's, even though I think they made less of them? I guess a lot of S1's won't be on the road anymore, or maybe people just won't want to sell them.The 1.6 16V is a bit more refined and coupled with the GTi gearbox, more suitable for day to day driving.
The 1.3 8V is totally bonkers. It's not as powerful as the GTi, but thanks to the closer gearbox ratios and reduced weight (almost matches the GTi in terms of bhp/ton) it's every bit as quick in the real world.
I would imagine a series 1 Rallye with a GTi/VTS engine and the original gearbox would be an absolute weapon to drive. However, there is something quite special about the the 1.3 8V engine (the trademark lumpy idle, aggressive cam and 7200rpm peak power) that means that I would still go for this over the 1.6 16V if you can live with the limitations (don't waste your time on motorways).
I'd quite like to do a few track days, so my only concern with the S1 would be how well it would perform on track and whether it would feel very underpowered with the 1.3. Which is why I was also considering cars like 172/182's, the default choice it would seem.
dollyboy said:
Thanks for your thoughts. As I'm looking for a fun little car for driving B roads, or rather unclassified roads, around the Yorkshire Dales and nearby, it sounds as though the S1 would be the one to go for. I've heard previously how good the little 1.3 is, I guess its just a matter of trying to find one which still has the 1.3 and in good condition. Most of them look rough or have had the engine changed, I occasionally look at Rallye's for sale and there seems to be more S2's, even though I think they made less of them? I guess a lot of S1's won't be on the road anymore, or maybe people just won't want to sell them.
I'd quite like to do a few track days, so my only concern with the S1 would be how well it would perform on track and whether it would feel very underpowered with the 1.3. Which is why I was also considering cars like 172/182's, the default choice it would seem.
As a series 1 owner, I am probably biased but I do think they are a bit more special than the series 2. In any case, I think they would both be great fun for spirited driving around the Dales and I wouldn't hesitate in buying a good example of either. If you're not using it daily, then the Rallye also has a bit more of a sense of occassion about it when compared with the GTi.I'd quite like to do a few track days, so my only concern with the S1 would be how well it would perform on track and whether it would feel very underpowered with the 1.3. Which is why I was also considering cars like 172/182's, the default choice it would seem.
As far as track days are concerned, I don't have any experiences to share.
I am planning a novice track day this summer, but my feeling is that the 1.3 8V could still be competitive on tracks without big straights! It'll wind it's way round to 100mph with relative easy once you're on the move, but things do get a bit lethargic after that.
In terms of tuning, the 1.6 8V series 2 may be a better candidate if you're considering track days; I bet shedweller's 158bhp example is awesome!
300bhp/ton said:
How heavy is the non-PAS one? I used to autotest my 106, it was a diesel non-PAS. It's only real failing was the steering was a tad heavy at autotest speeds and you couldn't spin the wheel round with the ball of your hand.
I'm guessing it feels more or less the same (as a standard Rallye) as without looking it up I'd think the rack is likely the same ratio and the standard steering wheels are similar diameter. The top mounts on the diesel would have been in their forward position (I assume?) which lightens it a noticeable amount (compared to mine which has solid spherical bearing top-mounts in the PAS castor position) and I'm running a 185 section tyre as per the GTi (175 OE) and I'd guess the Diesel had skinnier tyres over 5.5J wheels? I did run one of those steering wheel aids (the things you clamp on) for a short time to assist me with my car park antics but soon gave up as the steering was too heavy to use it at low speed - though due to the disc braked rear it wasn't really possible to do a decent 180 deg parking manoeuvre on the handbrake unless you were quite committed on the brakes approaching the target space. Fitting the lower brace had a huge effect on my car, can't recall what it did to the weight of the steering if anything but it increased precision no end and changed the handling balance / grip available - no more wet under-steer, just confidence inspiring turn in and added predictability, especially in the wet.TBH for autotest duty, steering feel is of secondary importance and I'd go for PAS - unless you're in a field, back in my teenage years I entered many a good autotest held in freshly harvested fields without feeling PAS would have improved the result - deffo an event format suited to MOT failures / bangers as something relatively important usually fell off before the end!
Cracking little car!
Nearly bought one 13 years ago in my 'yoof' but couldn't find a decent one so went for the 106 GTi instead. Which was less ££ but much more to insure.
The Rallye has more torque IRC from the 8v engine and was a lot lighter.
Do these have the tendency to lift off oversteer like the GTis do? If so great fun and probably easier to catch with non PAS.
Not sure I understand why people dropped the 16v engine in..... surely easier to rip everything out a GTi, cheaper too.
Nearly bought one 13 years ago in my 'yoof' but couldn't find a decent one so went for the 106 GTi instead. Which was less ££ but much more to insure.
The Rallye has more torque IRC from the 8v engine and was a lot lighter.
Do these have the tendency to lift off oversteer like the GTis do? If so great fun and probably easier to catch with non PAS.
Not sure I understand why people dropped the 16v engine in..... surely easier to rip everything out a GTi, cheaper too.
t4thomas said:
As a series 1 owner, I am probably biased but I do think they are a bit more special than the series 2. In any case, I think they would both be great fun for spirited driving around the Dales and I wouldn't hesitate in buying a good example of either. If you're not using it daily, then the Rallye also has a bit more of a sense of occassion about it when compared with the GTi.
As far as track days are concerned, I don't have any experiences to share.
I am planning a novice track day this summer, but my feeling is that the 1.3 8V could still be competitive on tracks without big straights! It'll wind it's way round to 100mph with relative easy once you're on the move, but things do get a bit lethargic after that.
In terms of tuning, the 1.6 8V series 2 may be a better candidate if you're considering track days; I bet shedweller's 158bhp example is awesome!
They do just fine on track, the brilliant adjustable chassis is very rewarding and fun to explore on track with standard power, coupled to uprated brakes and well thought out suspension mods it will be hugely fun.As far as track days are concerned, I don't have any experiences to share.
I am planning a novice track day this summer, but my feeling is that the 1.3 8V could still be competitive on tracks without big straights! It'll wind it's way round to 100mph with relative easy once you're on the move, but things do get a bit lethargic after that.
In terms of tuning, the 1.6 8V series 2 may be a better candidate if you're considering track days; I bet shedweller's 158bhp example is awesome!
But the straights with a S1 gearbox will always be long drawn out affair with (I think) a 118mph max on the limiter just cruise it - a lot of ground can be made up under braking.
Tuning the 1.6 8v? - I feel part of the character of the car is the 8v engine and the range at which torque is available....... Its all in the delivery.
From 4000rpm in any gear, mine goes like stink all the way to 8200rpm.
I had a S2 Rallye for 6 years, tuned the 8v with a big cam, head work, manifold, standalone ECU etc. Later dropped a 16v in with a big valve head, cams, ITB's etc etc. Honestly, the 8v engine is not a patch on the 16v and I don't know why people really bang on about it. If you want decent power from the 8v you need to cam it, and cam it pretty big too - and guess what cams do, shift the power band up! You can run equivalently milder cams in the 16v and have the tractability of the 8v, but with just a ton more power up top too. No brainer, and on the continent the Rallyes were 16v anyway.
Great cars though and still look good inside and out today. If I was building another 106 today though, I'd start with an early XSI pre-cat model and 16v it. No way would I pay Rallye prices if this article is in anyway indicative.
Great cars though and still look good inside and out today. If I was building another 106 today though, I'd start with an early XSI pre-cat model and 16v it. No way would I pay Rallye prices if this article is in anyway indicative.
shedweller said:
They do just fine on track, the brilliant adjustable chassis is very rewarding and fun to explore on track with standard power, coupled to uprated brakes and well thought out suspension mods it will be hugely fun.
But the straights with a S1 gearbox will always be long drawn out affair with (I think) a 118mph max on the limiter just cruise it - a lot of ground can be made up under braking.
Tuning the 1.6 8v? - I feel part of the character of the car is the 8v engine and the range at which torque is available....... Its all in the delivery.
From 4000rpm in any gear, mine goes like stink all the way to 8200rpm.
That's good to know, thanks, I suppose all the fun is in the corners anyway, unless you have massive power the straights are just the bit where you get to relax before the next one.But the straights with a S1 gearbox will always be long drawn out affair with (I think) a 118mph max on the limiter just cruise it - a lot of ground can be made up under braking.
Tuning the 1.6 8v? - I feel part of the character of the car is the 8v engine and the range at which torque is available....... Its all in the delivery.
From 4000rpm in any gear, mine goes like stink all the way to 8200rpm.
I think I'll get my Elise sold and start looking for a decent S1 Rallye, some good ones seem to come up for sale on the Rallye Register every so often and the prices are certainly a lot less than 6k, typically 2-4k I'd say. Unfortunately the money left over will probably be going towards a new kitchen
Then I just need to decide what to do with the mk2 golf vr6 I've had sat in a barn for the last 2 years.
I used to own a track spec s1 with a modified gri engine linked to the short s1 gearbox, was a real flying machine and flew to the 118mph limiter in no time, i'd love to see where its ended up!
I currently own a blue s2 rallye with the same miles as this, (pas and airbag model) and if this price is indictive on how they are going i'll be quite shocked. Fantastic handling cars and great for an occasional blast down the back roads. I also think they appeal due to low running costs and a ready supply of parts, whilst also have the limited edition rallye touches.
But at this price point, borderline decent 182 trophy money the appeal must be limited to a small number of people. I'll be intrigued to see if this sells, and if it does id be tempted to put mine in the classifieds!
I currently own a blue s2 rallye with the same miles as this, (pas and airbag model) and if this price is indictive on how they are going i'll be quite shocked. Fantastic handling cars and great for an occasional blast down the back roads. I also think they appeal due to low running costs and a ready supply of parts, whilst also have the limited edition rallye touches.
But at this price point, borderline decent 182 trophy money the appeal must be limited to a small number of people. I'll be intrigued to see if this sells, and if it does id be tempted to put mine in the classifieds!
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff