Event now closed: WE NEED YOUR CAR at The Fast Car Festival
Discussion
I can only agree with you, I came on Saturday and found the PH stand as you described. We were left to our own devices, poor effort by PH and event organisers. I was with my father in law so we kept our selves busy watching the on track action (if that's what you want to call it) and being entertained at the extremes of modded cars on show in disbelief all day. Won't be bothering next time for sure. Even the smart car owners were better organised and looked more at home! (No offence to smart car owners intended).
In a word.....shoddy.
In a word.....shoddy.
As poorly organised as it was from PH I managed to have a good time at a show that that I'm definitely not into.
Met some very nice PHers and had fun on track with them on both days, only 5 of us on there on the Saturday!
We went for a Chinese Saturday night then checked out the "entertainment" afterwards. I'm not interested in DJ whatshisface but the bar was pretty nice.
Sunday I found everyone had moved and you could get to the infield by exiting the circuit and back in through another entrance which had a tunnel under the track.
Alot more PH guys on today's track session and it was good letting the Noble stretch it's legs with a few different types of cars!
All in all not a bad weekend but you guys on here made it so!
Met some very nice PHers and had fun on track with them on both days, only 5 of us on there on the Saturday!
We went for a Chinese Saturday night then checked out the "entertainment" afterwards. I'm not interested in DJ whatshisface but the bar was pretty nice.
Sunday I found everyone had moved and you could get to the infield by exiting the circuit and back in through another entrance which had a tunnel under the track.
Alot more PH guys on today's track session and it was good letting the Noble stretch it's legs with a few different types of cars!
All in all not a bad weekend but you guys on here made it so!
E21Mark, couldn't have put it better myself.
Fortunately a few of us who did turn up kept ourselves entertained as a group. (Zoobeef, LittleLewis, JayEmm, Woodsypedia etc)
But, and it is a significant but. The complete lack of anyone/anything from Pistonheads, no banners, flags, signs or any indication that we were representing Pistonheads other than a 2" square smilie on the show pass was poor at best, that there was no staffer was just a joke really.
Really would like to hear from someone at PH Towers about this, as to say we were "representing" Pistonheads, but with no support at all is an embarrassment. Not for us, the people who attended, but for whoever failed to do anything even approaching the merest thought about the tiniest possibility of doing any organisation or setup.
At a peak, we had 11 cars in this space, which, incidentally, was large enough for 30/40 cars in reality. Even spread out and parked right down the middle we filled maybe a third of the space.
Fortunately a few of us who did turn up kept ourselves entertained as a group. (Zoobeef, LittleLewis, JayEmm, Woodsypedia etc)
But, and it is a significant but. The complete lack of anyone/anything from Pistonheads, no banners, flags, signs or any indication that we were representing Pistonheads other than a 2" square smilie on the show pass was poor at best, that there was no staffer was just a joke really.
Really would like to hear from someone at PH Towers about this, as to say we were "representing" Pistonheads, but with no support at all is an embarrassment. Not for us, the people who attended, but for whoever failed to do anything even approaching the merest thought about the tiniest possibility of doing any organisation or setup.
At a peak, we had 11 cars in this space, which, incidentally, was large enough for 30/40 cars in reality. Even spread out and parked right down the middle we filled maybe a third of the space.
Edited by themanwithnoname on Sunday 31st July 22:14
Edited by themanwithnoname on Sunday 31st July 22:21
Wow, I initially offered one or more of my cars for this but I'm really glad I didn't take it any further - as it clashed with another event last weekend.
I've done a couple of Sunday Services, and they haven't been as well-organised (massive queues at entry...) although the venues continue to be as good as ever.
Anyone else have the feeling that PH events have not been the same since Garlick departed?
Could he be tempted back? We could have a whip round to buy him some extra loud trousers
I've done a couple of Sunday Services, and they haven't been as well-organised (massive queues at entry...) although the venues continue to be as good as ever.
Anyone else have the feeling that PH events have not been the same since Garlick departed?
Could he be tempted back? We could have a whip round to buy him some extra loud trousers
e21Mark said:
I'm just pissed off at the lack of communication and common courtesy. Some of us travelled a bloody long way, at considerable expense, but for what? Even now there has been no response or explanation for the piss poor organisation.
Hi Mark,Sorry to hear this - I've responded in the other post... but here is a copy of that response:
James Drake said:
Hi Mark,
Sorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
Sorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
I would like to echo the sentiments of my fellow PHers above.
I was told that I needed to be at this event on both days when my tickets came through, at all times there has been a conflict of communication, or just a lack of it.
On the first day, the PH stand was totally barren - no-one knew what it was, and until some of us took the initiative and removed the fencing surrounding us the punters weren't even paying any attention to the cars.
On day two, the PH stand had moved but nobody told us and I only found out by accident when I discovered my car being blocked in by other people who had been told this was now their stand.
That being said, there was an interesting variety of machinery there and I met some really great people - but PH have really, really let themselves down here. AS one of the internet's largest and best funded (ie. most commercialised) car communities, to not even have a poster up for the stand was terrible. And to expect the organisers to do it for you, then pass the buck? Shame on you.
I am a frequent member of Pistonheads East Anglia, the scoutmaster there (Darren/iluvmercs) is an absolute star and he alone does a better job at small little shows than this "massive" event that was supposed to be a representation of Pistonheads.
I suggest the next time Pistonheads puts on an event, they perhaps take a minute to appreciate the fantastic men and women that really make this site tick - ie. us lot!
I was told that I needed to be at this event on both days when my tickets came through, at all times there has been a conflict of communication, or just a lack of it.
On the first day, the PH stand was totally barren - no-one knew what it was, and until some of us took the initiative and removed the fencing surrounding us the punters weren't even paying any attention to the cars.
On day two, the PH stand had moved but nobody told us and I only found out by accident when I discovered my car being blocked in by other people who had been told this was now their stand.
That being said, there was an interesting variety of machinery there and I met some really great people - but PH have really, really let themselves down here. AS one of the internet's largest and best funded (ie. most commercialised) car communities, to not even have a poster up for the stand was terrible. And to expect the organisers to do it for you, then pass the buck? Shame on you.
I am a frequent member of Pistonheads East Anglia, the scoutmaster there (Darren/iluvmercs) is an absolute star and he alone does a better job at small little shows than this "massive" event that was supposed to be a representation of Pistonheads.
I suggest the next time Pistonheads puts on an event, they perhaps take a minute to appreciate the fantastic men and women that really make this site tick - ie. us lot!
Edited by jayemm89 on Monday 1st August 14:58
JD - the feedback from your members is pretty clear; a bit less Cameron esq spin and blaming the organisers and more sorry, rather than cancel I tried to sort it but didn't care as I was off to a wedding would aid your credibility IMHO.
Living 20mins away and keen to go on track, it peeves me to here of free spaces on stand and possibly track going begging for the sake of you & the organisers doing to the jobs you're paid to do.
From experience as a Marshal there, Doni management aren't well staffed nor interested in punters' enjoyment but in selling tickets and hospitality.
Living 20mins away and keen to go on track, it peeves me to here of free spaces on stand and possibly track going begging for the sake of you & the organisers doing to the jobs you're paid to do.
From experience as a Marshal there, Doni management aren't well staffed nor interested in punters' enjoyment but in selling tickets and hospitality.
James Drake said:
Hi Mark,
Sorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
Hi JamesSorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
Just to respond to the points you make.
1: This is exactly our point, nobody told us anything at all, the people on the ground ushering cars around knew a floorplan and that's about it. Had any of the information received said for example 'your onsite contact will be Jeff Jefferson, and PH will not be onsite until Sunday' we'd have been happy to check in, as it was, there was no knowledge, no communication, and no useful information either to us, or on the ground.
Passing the buck is pretty much the icing on the cake for me, as we weren't there to represent Donington Park, we weren't there to represent FastCar Magazine (shudder), we weren't there to represent Kelsey Media. We were there to represent Pistonheads. Pistonheads have dropped the ball here, the buck stops with Pistonheads, and this firmly lies in Pistonheads lap. We are your customer base, and we have been let down. We're not looking for excuses, we're looking for accountability.
2. This is just more excuses, surely there will have been emails etc which should be accessible by whomever took over from Ollie (it is, after all a 20 second job for your IT guys to set up). Again, we don't need excuses or buck passing. Having a ground map a couple of days beforehand is fine, no issues with that, and I understand why they wanted to separate the two - there was nowhere on the Saturday that would accommodate the "100+ cars for Pistonheads Sunday Service" that we heard so much about on the tannoy in the paddock, and parking 11 cars, infield with no signage, a walk across no-man's land on Saturday, with no signage, banners, flags etc. would have made it look like we were parking up some surprisingly decent looking, shiny monster truck fodder, out of the way for later.
From my point of view, there was no confusion at all, just a complete lack of interest, knowledge or input from whoever was meant to be doing their bit, except us, the people who travelled from all over - i.e. Bob from Aberdeen, and Mark from Cornwall as the two extremes that I'm aware of, agreeing to be on site for two full days to again, in Pistonheads' words 'Represent PH at the Fast Car Festival', and with that I'd tend to argue that 'Without a hitch' is a little ambitious.
Edit to add: Bob, apologies I completely missed you on Sunday, I did see that you found your way into the infield. Hope you got back safe and well?
Edited by themanwithnoname on Monday 1st August 16:43
James Drake said:
e21Mark said:
I'm just pissed off at the lack of communication and common courtesy. Some of us travelled a bloody long way, at considerable expense, but for what? Even now there has been no response or explanation for the piss poor organisation.
Hi Mark,Sorry to hear this - I've responded in the other post... but here is a copy of that response:
James Drake said:
Hi Mark,
Sorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
Sorry to hear about your negative experience... it all sounds very frustrating.
The bottom line with all of this is that there were 2 issues:
1) Despite what you may have been told on the day the show organisers were meant to be organising both branding for the "PH display area" and the display boards for each car. We had also told them that we wouldn't have any staff to man this area, even more so following Ollie's departure. All information was provided to them along with our logos etc. In other words, it is them that have dropped the ball and we're as disappointed to hear this as you.
2) Ollie had been liaising with the show organisers about this display, so when he left at short notice there was quite a lot of the catching up to do on our part. Essentially though we only received a site map that showed the PH SS area last Thursday, so their definition of "well in advance" is a strange one. Also, being completely honest we recommended to them that the PH display area was simply part of the SS, but it seems that they wanted to keep it separate - perhaps in an attempt to create more content for the event?
Anyway... apologies for the poor experience. It sounds like there was a lot of confusion surround the entire event but despite this it (mostly) went off without a hitch.
Regarding the merchandise, I'll happily sort that out for you - drop me an email to James.drake@haymarket.com and we can go from there.
Cheers
JD
The fact that you knew the SS would be on the infield adds insult to injury. You had 2 days in which you could have emailed us and let us know. At the very least you could have stuck a bloody post-it note on my windscreen, so that when I rocked up on Sunday and found my car abandoned, I at least knew why? I chose to leave my car because it was supposedly part of an organised PH stand, and wonder how you guys would have felt to find your cars just left in some random spot? Especially after spending hundreds of pounds and driving 6 hours for the privilege!
The final straw for me is missing the track time. Because no-one let me in on the whole infield thing, I was unable to move my car across. Instead, I got to watch everyone else instead,
Hi James, any chance of some merchandise coming my way? I was quite proud to have my old Subaru picked to go on display, to represent PistonHeads.
Very disappointed with the Saturday, but did meet some GREAT people. Camping was alright, pretty good set up, but quite loud.
Sunday was much better btw, some more nice cars and nice people.
Very disappointed with the Saturday, but did meet some GREAT people. Camping was alright, pretty good set up, but quite loud.
Sunday was much better btw, some more nice cars and nice people.
Had fun o Sunday with a group of us from sprint and trackday, track sessions were great and not too busy as many people didn't want to wait untill the end of the day.
And Noble guy, hats off to you again for your awareness when the Tamora had a little moment! 2nd session went without issue and allowed me to really get a lot more out of the car as my Confidence grew!
And Noble guy, hats off to you again for your awareness when the Tamora had a little moment! 2nd session went without issue and allowed me to really get a lot more out of the car as my Confidence grew!
This being my first attendance at a PH event I was pretty disappointed that we didn't really get to feel as though we were there for PH, more of a rag tag bunch of cars that happened to get inside. That being said the few of us that were there got on brilliantly and had a great weekend because of it, and the fact that it was so sparsely organised meant that my first time on track was very quiet and allowed me to get used to the experience without too much pressure, every cloud and what not.
The Sunday was a much better day and IMHO is what the Saturday should have been like, the guys that did get track time were all willing to give tips and pointers and everyone was courteous and fun plus we had some representation and banners which definitely helped to draw in more of a crowd. It felt more of a community meeting than a few mates who like their cars.
Overall I really enjoyed the weekend, but had it not been for the few of us sticking together and getting along so well it would have really put me off attending another event with PH, I'd be much more likely to try and arrange my own event with friends that I could rely on. PH could do with getting onto this now Ollie has left as it seems everyone has a similar opinion on how the weekend went, big props to all the guys who came for both days and toughed it out it really made a huge difference.
The Sunday was a much better day and IMHO is what the Saturday should have been like, the guys that did get track time were all willing to give tips and pointers and everyone was courteous and fun plus we had some representation and banners which definitely helped to draw in more of a crowd. It felt more of a community meeting than a few mates who like their cars.
Overall I really enjoyed the weekend, but had it not been for the few of us sticking together and getting along so well it would have really put me off attending another event with PH, I'd be much more likely to try and arrange my own event with friends that I could rely on. PH could do with getting onto this now Ollie has left as it seems everyone has a similar opinion on how the weekend went, big props to all the guys who came for both days and toughed it out it really made a huge difference.
I got place 99 of the 100 PH had on the SS thread!
I thought I had done well, but then I went along (arriving by 08.30 as instructed, which meant getting up around 05.00 given where I live) and I wasn't quite so convinced!
On the day PH were on the infield inside the Craner Curves, which may have been quite a good viewing place but there was easily room for another 100 cars!
Luckily I didn't ask for track time as the allocated time was at about 16.00 which made it a pretty long day, given the "requirement" to be there by 08.30!
I can quite understand the frustration of e21Mark (whose M3 looked absolutely fantastic BTW
) and am so glad I didn't apply for the weekend option!
Had a good look around, but too much slammed, stanced mediocrity for my liking - when did a wrapped Corsa with stupidly wide rims, stretched tyres and a 300 watt stereo playing cr*p music ever become a "Fast Car"? And what is drifting all about.
There were a few highlights - you don't often see 3 Escort Cosworths parked in a row, and another PHer had his Lotus Carlton there on another display, but sadly I didn't manage to catch up with him.
Ben was the only PH staffer there, and he was very helpful (he told me the way out!) but I think even he felt a bit abandoned!
Interesting event, but in it's present format I wouldn't rush to sign up next year.
I thought I had done well, but then I went along (arriving by 08.30 as instructed, which meant getting up around 05.00 given where I live) and I wasn't quite so convinced!
On the day PH were on the infield inside the Craner Curves, which may have been quite a good viewing place but there was easily room for another 100 cars!
Luckily I didn't ask for track time as the allocated time was at about 16.00 which made it a pretty long day, given the "requirement" to be there by 08.30!
I can quite understand the frustration of e21Mark (whose M3 looked absolutely fantastic BTW
) and am so glad I didn't apply for the weekend option!Had a good look around, but too much slammed, stanced mediocrity for my liking - when did a wrapped Corsa with stupidly wide rims, stretched tyres and a 300 watt stereo playing cr*p music ever become a "Fast Car"? And what is drifting all about.
There were a few highlights - you don't often see 3 Escort Cosworths parked in a row, and another PHer had his Lotus Carlton there on another display, but sadly I didn't manage to catch up with him.
Ben was the only PH staffer there, and he was very helpful (he told me the way out!) but I think even he felt a bit abandoned!
Interesting event, but in it's present format I wouldn't rush to sign up next year.
Morning all.
Just to echo the sentiment above. I drove down from Aberdeen for the weekend and was disappointed to see how things were organised on the Saturday, as with e21Mark and Zoobeef, I left my car at the circuit on Saturday and got back to it on Sunday to find everybody had moved. Luckily I managed to get round to the Sunday Service under the track via a tunnel.
I think that maybe the Fast Car Festival probably wasn't the best venue for our type of enthusiast either, there was a lot of big wheels and stereos...
At the end of the day everybody on here is Pistonheads, without us there would be no site, I understand that these things can and do happen but it does leave a sour taste in your mouth, especially when you've done an 11 hour journey to get down!
However, I did meet a lot of really nice folk and it was great to put some faces to some names. I will continue to support the website when I can, but I may think twice if I have to drive more than half the length of the country to get there.
Finally, is PH going to run an SS article with some pictures of our cars from the day?!
Just to echo the sentiment above. I drove down from Aberdeen for the weekend and was disappointed to see how things were organised on the Saturday, as with e21Mark and Zoobeef, I left my car at the circuit on Saturday and got back to it on Sunday to find everybody had moved. Luckily I managed to get round to the Sunday Service under the track via a tunnel.
I think that maybe the Fast Car Festival probably wasn't the best venue for our type of enthusiast either, there was a lot of big wheels and stereos...
At the end of the day everybody on here is Pistonheads, without us there would be no site, I understand that these things can and do happen but it does leave a sour taste in your mouth, especially when you've done an 11 hour journey to get down!
However, I did meet a lot of really nice folk and it was great to put some faces to some names. I will continue to support the website when I can, but I may think twice if I have to drive more than half the length of the country to get there.
Finally, is PH going to run an SS article with some pictures of our cars from the day?!
Hi everyone,
I can clearly see that you (rightly) want PH to stand up and take the blame for this monumental cock up. That's fine, and we're happy to do this - there are certainly many lessons that we've learnt from the weekend. So please do take this as a genuine apology - we can't really do or say much more than that.
One thing I would say though is that if you take a step back and consider all the events that we run (about 30 odd this year) you'll note that not a single other one has left people wanting, been a disaster or left people with a bad taste in their mouth. Ironically, the Sunday Service we ran at the very same event has had some great feedback and - whilst not perfect - almost everyone left happy.
The reason I mention this is that many of you seem to be insinuating that we don't know what we're doing. Given the fact that this is an isolated issue I hope that you can see that we clearly had several unusual and unexpected issues on this weekend that were unable to respond to due to being short staffed. One thing that does stick in my throat is the fact that some of you are insinuating that I'm being disingenuous about certain elements and passing the buck. All I can do is assure you that this isn't the case and we were genuinely let down too.
Anyway, that's all I can really say; I've apologised, I've agreed PH is ultimately to blame, I've agreed that we made mistakes and I've agreed that we need to learn from this. Oh, and I offered to compensate some of you with some goodies... and if that still isn't enough then I'm all out of ideas as there really isn't anything else I can say or do.
Best wishes
JD
I can clearly see that you (rightly) want PH to stand up and take the blame for this monumental cock up. That's fine, and we're happy to do this - there are certainly many lessons that we've learnt from the weekend. So please do take this as a genuine apology - we can't really do or say much more than that.
One thing I would say though is that if you take a step back and consider all the events that we run (about 30 odd this year) you'll note that not a single other one has left people wanting, been a disaster or left people with a bad taste in their mouth. Ironically, the Sunday Service we ran at the very same event has had some great feedback and - whilst not perfect - almost everyone left happy.
The reason I mention this is that many of you seem to be insinuating that we don't know what we're doing. Given the fact that this is an isolated issue I hope that you can see that we clearly had several unusual and unexpected issues on this weekend that were unable to respond to due to being short staffed. One thing that does stick in my throat is the fact that some of you are insinuating that I'm being disingenuous about certain elements and passing the buck. All I can do is assure you that this isn't the case and we were genuinely let down too.
Anyway, that's all I can really say; I've apologised, I've agreed PH is ultimately to blame, I've agreed that we made mistakes and I've agreed that we need to learn from this. Oh, and I offered to compensate some of you with some goodies... and if that still isn't enough then I'm all out of ideas as there really isn't anything else I can say or do.
Best wishes
JD
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff