RE: Why Audi needs a diesel R8: PH Blog
Discussion
Adrian E said:
Porkymerc said:
So you are implying that we convert every goods delivery vehicle to a fuel that is not diesel?
I expect to see limitations on the Euro stage of HGV allowed into the LEZ being tightened in the next few years, or simply older vehicles being priced out of LEZs with additional pollution charges. There's no good practical alternative to a large HGV for moving goods by weight/volume but for the last mile there are alternatives, albeit they involve more vehicles and handling of goods.
Potentially we'll see more hybrid delivery vehicles, but the drop in payload resulting won't make them popular until there's no alternative
Dave Hedgehog said:
and i am sure the massive pre orders musk got has woken up a lot of car companies
absolutely...I'm not an electric car fan but I can't ignore there are many many folk who are sold by the idea. Not to mention that image and P.R play a big part in the marketplace and diesel is now a dirty word.. (excuse the blatant pun there)
I would imagine that the challenge for Tesla is mass production and supply. No doubt a company with the sheer size of VAG will be hoping to replicate Tesla's design brief but with the ability to churn them out into a huge existing dealership network and all their existing manufacturing tech..
Diesel just sounds like 'steam train' in that environment..
Adrian E said:
Porkymerc said:
So you are implying that we convert every goods delivery vehicle to a fuel that is not diesel?
I expect to see limitations on the Euro stage of HGV allowed into the LEZ being tightened in the next few years, or simply older vehicles being priced out of LEZs with additional pollution charges. There's no good practical alternative to a large HGV for moving goods by weight/volume but for the last mile there are alternatives, albeit they involve more vehicles and handling of goods.
Potentially we'll see more hybrid delivery vehicles, but the drop in payload resulting won't make them popular until there's no alternative
I agree they should do this because of all the negative comments on here.
Diesel has a lot going for it. It has a much higher calorific value than petrol. Its not diesels fault that hasn't been properly exploited yet, and it isn't diesels fault that the engines sound tappity, its simply the fault that the technology of trying to push diesel through a converted petrol engine design.
Diesel is less developed but will eventually be superior in every respect, probably including noise
I came out of an M5 two years ago and into a 335 diesel. The performance isn't that far different and in a lot of ways makes more sense already on our roads. I'm still a petrol head but even I probably wouldn't swap back to a petrol for normal driving anymore. Even if you put me on a track I would turn my nose up at any modern petrol for the pleasure of driving an old petrol car, and any modern petrol for my ride back home in favour of my diesel.
I'm pretty sold on them. If audi can move the diesel tech on further I'll be even more sold.
Diesel has a lot going for it. It has a much higher calorific value than petrol. Its not diesels fault that hasn't been properly exploited yet, and it isn't diesels fault that the engines sound tappity, its simply the fault that the technology of trying to push diesel through a converted petrol engine design.
Diesel is less developed but will eventually be superior in every respect, probably including noise
I came out of an M5 two years ago and into a 335 diesel. The performance isn't that far different and in a lot of ways makes more sense already on our roads. I'm still a petrol head but even I probably wouldn't swap back to a petrol for normal driving anymore. Even if you put me on a track I would turn my nose up at any modern petrol for the pleasure of driving an old petrol car, and any modern petrol for my ride back home in favour of my diesel.
I'm pretty sold on them. If audi can move the diesel tech on further I'll be even more sold.
julian64 said:
I agree they should do this because of all the negative comments on here.
Diesel has a lot going for it. It has a much higher calorific value than petrol. Its not diesels fault that hasn't been properly exploited yet, and it isn't diesels fault that the engines sound tappity, its simply the fault that the technology of trying to push diesel through a converted petrol engine design.
Diesel is less developed but will eventually be superior in every respect, probably including noise
I came out of an M5 two years ago and into a 335 diesel. The performance isn't that far different and in a lot of ways makes more sense already on our roads. I'm still a petrol head but even I probably wouldn't swap back to a petrol for normal driving anymore. Even if you put me on a track I would turn my nose up at any modern petrol for the pleasure of driving an old petrol car, and any modern petrol for my ride back home in favour of my diesel.
I'm pretty sold on them. If audi can move the diesel tech on further I'll be even more sold.
You came out of a naturally aspirated petrol and are comparing it to a turbocharged diesel. Trust me, the turbocharged V8 in the new M5/6 would leave something like a 600-700lbft diesel. Peak torque is also insanely low, but it just revs so much higher it makes more power. Diesel has a lot going for it. It has a much higher calorific value than petrol. Its not diesels fault that hasn't been properly exploited yet, and it isn't diesels fault that the engines sound tappity, its simply the fault that the technology of trying to push diesel through a converted petrol engine design.
Diesel is less developed but will eventually be superior in every respect, probably including noise
I came out of an M5 two years ago and into a 335 diesel. The performance isn't that far different and in a lot of ways makes more sense already on our roads. I'm still a petrol head but even I probably wouldn't swap back to a petrol for normal driving anymore. Even if you put me on a track I would turn my nose up at any modern petrol for the pleasure of driving an old petrol car, and any modern petrol for my ride back home in favour of my diesel.
I'm pretty sold on them. If audi can move the diesel tech on further I'll be even more sold.
E65Ross said:
You came out of a naturally aspirated petrol and are comparing it to a turbocharged diesel. Trust me, the turbocharged V8 in the new M5/6 would leave something like a 600-700lbft diesel. Peak torque is also insanely low, but it just revs so much higher it makes more power.
Of absolutely no use on the open road, and boring, too heavy, on a track.As powerful and impressive as the newer cars are on paper, they are all too impractical/boring to drive
julian64 said:
E65Ross said:
You came out of a naturally aspirated petrol and are comparing it to a turbocharged diesel. Trust me, the turbocharged V8 in the new M5/6 would leave something like a 600-700lbft diesel. Peak torque is also insanely low, but it just revs so much higher it makes more power.
Of absolutely no use on the open road, and boring, too heavy, on a track.As powerful and impressive as the newer cars are on paper, they are all too impractical/boring to drive
V8A*ndy said:
This is the proper R8 review
Yes it is. The Audi diesel is an immensely useless car. They haven't produced it because it won't have a market. Flagship cars are produced not so sell but to encourage brand loyaltyHowever the petrol head world is allergic to diesel and therefore it will be useless at encouraging brand loyalty
The only thing it can do is be so much better than the petrol that the motoring world turns on its head. Something BMW tried and failed to do. Anyone objectively looking at BMWs range would be mad to choose petrol but they still outsell diesel despite having worse performance in both power and fuel consumption.
people who buy petrol think of themselves as petrol heads, but I would suggest rarely actual go on track. If they did go on track they would little reason on any English track for 600 bph and still less for a heavy paddle shifting semi auto. More fun to be had and probably faster lap times in a stripped out old banger, and certainly manual.
So who are they selling the car to. Its not a track car and it will never have any pull with the vast majority of pretend petrolheads.
So hereby ends the review. Either produce it as a technical tour de force and I think the le mans has already shown that or sell it to people with a lot of money but absolutely no interest in what other people think of them, and I think there were three of those in this country at last count.
t idea. Really s
Anyone find the sound of diesel nice ? I always wonder because I do not.
To me the existence of Diesel, and all the more in the UK, is for taxing the population of workers. Force companies to push diesel company cars, and then increase the price of Diesel to reach the maximum price in the world.
To me the existence of Diesel, and all the more in the UK, is for taxing the population of workers. Force companies to push diesel company cars, and then increase the price of Diesel to reach the maximum price in the world.
Dave Hedgehog said:
Wills2 said:
Insane idea, I'm in LA at the moment and just about every car sounds great, who the hell would want a diesel supercar it's a total none starter.
top end audi diesels do sound very good thou, they have speakers in the exhausts to make them sound good Can't believe this thread slipped under my radar. A supercar running on heavy fuel oil; jesus wept. Imagine for a moment telling a fellow enthusiast you own a R8 to then proclaim its average economy figures and it produces a sound not dissimilar to a Massey Ferguson; you'd be as well tell them you enjoy Morris dancing and own a vagina.
Aside from the biggest problems, how on earth would one price it in the market. Slightly cheaper than the V10...buy a 2nd hand V10. Even cheaper again than the V10...buy a 2nd hand V8. Vastly cheaper than the V10...buy a TTRS if it had to be Audi coupe.
Aside from the biggest problems, how on earth would one price it in the market. Slightly cheaper than the V10...buy a 2nd hand V10. Even cheaper again than the V10...buy a 2nd hand V8. Vastly cheaper than the V10...buy a TTRS if it had to be Audi coupe.
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