RE: Ford Focus RS vs. Honda Civic Type R - the video
Discussion
The RS being quoted as weighing 1600kg all over the internet is doing my head in.
The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
Splats said:
The RS being quoted as weighing 1600kg all over the internet is doing my head in.
The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
The E46 is not really comparable. However you look at it, the RS is a right porker.The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
RocketRS said:
HighwayStar said:
Jeez man, don't you think the person who wants these type of cars actually have the foresight to go out and see for themselves what they are all about? Some people just don't want an RS, no matter how good it is and want something different. We get you think it's the tits. I can see it's a good car and will most likely at least retain its value but I would never buy one.
Yes I do. And one input to their decision are the reviews they see. The comment section allows for a discussion of the review(s). Look, I'm not getting a commission for every RS sold. Whether you like or dislike; buy or don't buy either car is of no concern to me. I'm here to offer a perspective. And provide a fair critique in civil manner.
It's not like the CTR is 10secs of the pace, literally falls off the road in the wet and is a 2.5 star rated car eh?
Everyone knows what you think and others think, it's not like your crusade is needed because Ford are struggling to sell an obviously good car. I'd imagine people who do buy a car off one review aren't going to be your average PHs reader anyway and if they were they are more likely to buy the Ford anyway...
So, some people just prefer the Honda. And if, IF, the bought without ever seeing a FRS review or driving one...... So what? Get over it! It's not your money.
SidewaysSi said:
The E46 is not really comparable. However you look at it, the RS is a right porker.
It weighs about a drivers weight more than a CTR and has awd. Its not massively heavy for what it is and it certainly doesn't feel that weight.Why is the weight of an awd 5 door hatchback not comparable to the weight of an e46 m3 which I have never heard described as a "right porker" ?
Its just the same people trying to slate the car for ridiculoys reasons. Maybe try driving one.
rb5er said:
SidewaysSi said:
The E46 is not really comparable. However you look at it, the RS is a right porker.
It weighs about a drivers weight more than a CTR and has awd. Its not massively heavy for what it is and it certainly doesn't feel that weight.Why is the weight of an awd 5 door hatchback not comparable to the weight of an e46 m3 which I have never heard described as a "right porker" ?
Its just the same people trying to slate the car for ridiculoys reasons. Maybe try driving one.
I have driven an RS and found it pretty average to be honest. Falls into the modern, too capable and quite dull category.
rb5er said:
SidewaysSi said:
The E46 is not really comparable. However you look at it, the RS is a right porker.
It weighs about a drivers weight more than a CTR and has awd. Its not massively heavy for what it is and it certainly doesn't feel that weight.Why is the weight of an awd 5 door hatchback not comparable to the weight of an e46 m3 which I have never heard described as a "right porker" ?
Its just the same people trying to slate the car for ridiculoys reasons. Maybe try driving one.
SidewaysSi said:
Splats said:
The RS being quoted as weighing 1600kg all over the internet is doing my head in.
The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
The E46 is not really comparable. However you look at it, the RS is a right porker.The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
FRS power:weight - 226 bhp/tonne
However you look at it, the CTR is desperately underpowered.
Splats said:
The RS being quoted as weighing 1600kg all over the internet is doing my head in.
The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
It's 1599kgs EU. All that matters is to compare like for like - the CTR is 1382kgs DIN compared to your 1524kgs DIN, yielding a 142kg difference.The MK3 Focus RS weighs 1524kg
The extra 75kg to take it to the often mis-quoted 1599kg is the weight of an average driver. This is not included in most competitor literature and so the RS appears heavier relative to other hot hatches than it actually is. That said, even at 1524kg it's heavier than a Golf R and others on the MQB platform. The RS is basically the exact same weight as an E46 M3 which is hardly regarded as heavyweight.
Remember I mentionned the weight in response to the comment from Rocket RS
RocketRS said:
And that, among Hot Hatches, the RS has capabilities the Honda simply does not have.
The Honda has the capability of being 142kgs lighter. The Focus doesn't. This may be of no relevance to some. This might be important to others. Oh, and it's not relating to straight line performance btw.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 1st July 11:37
RocketRS said:
So? The GTR weighs two tons. You're not buying potatoes. There's a lot more that goes into a great vehicle than weight alone.
A good point, but 1600kg in a hatchback is very excessive. xRIEx said:
CTR power:weight - 219 bhp/tonne
FRS power:weight - 226 bhp/tonne
However you look at it, the CTR is desperately underpowered.
Desperately underpowered?! Slight exaggeration there.FRS power:weight - 226 bhp/tonne
However you look at it, the CTR is desperately underpowered.
Edited by AMGJocky on Friday 1st July 11:59
AMGJocky said:
RocketRS said:
So? The GTR weighs two tons. You're not buying potatoes. There's a lot more that goes into a great vehicle than weight alone.
A good point, but 1600kg in a hatchback is very excessive. xRIEx said:
CTR power:weight - 219 bhp/tonne
FRS power:weight - 226 bhp/tonne
However you look at it, the CTR is desperately underpowered.
Desperately underpowered?! Slight exaggeration there.FRS power:weight - 226 bhp/tonne
However you look at it, the CTR is desperately underpowered.
Edited by AMGJocky on Friday 1st July 11:59
My point being fanbois will argue to the death whatever point they can grab hold of.
My view is that, for around £30-35k, we have a fantastic choice of great cars. I don't give a toss which is 0.326s faster around a particular circuit on a sunny day with an ambient air temperature of 21.04C, I'll go for the one with the balance of looks, feel and fun that strikes a chord with me.
xRIEx said:
My view is that, for around £30-35k, we have a fantastic choice of great cars. I don't give a toss which is 0.326s faster around a particular circuit on a sunny day with an ambient air temperature of 21.04C, I'll go for the one with the balance of looks, feel and fun that strikes a chord with me.
I share this sentiment and all of those things are what I'm sure some CTR owners have felt, hence they've bought one. If I personally was looking around with a budget of £30-35k, there's no chance I'd buy a new 4 cylinder hatchback.HighwayStar said:
RocketRS said:
HighwayStar said:
Jeez man, don't you think the person who wants these type of cars actually have the foresight to go out and see for themselves what they are all about? Some people just don't want an RS, no matter how good it is and want something different. We get you think it's the tits. I can see it's a good car and will most likely at least retain its value but I would never buy one.
Yes I do. And one input to their decision are the reviews they see. The comment section allows for a discussion of the review(s). Look, I'm not getting a commission for every RS sold. Whether you like or dislike; buy or don't buy either car is of no concern to me. I'm here to offer a perspective. And provide a fair critique in civil manner.
It's not like the CTR is 10secs of the pace, literally falls off the road in the wet and is a 2.5 star rated car eh?
Everyone knows what you think and others think, it's not like your crusade is needed because Ford are struggling to sell an obviously good car. I'd imagine people who do buy a car off one review aren't going to be your average PHs reader anyway and if they were they are more likely to buy the Ford anyway...
So, some people just prefer the Honda. And if, IF, the bought without ever seeing a FRS review or driving one...... So what? Get over it! It's not your money.
Axionknight said:
Most of the figures I see for the FK2 put it at around 1380kg so that's a big driver. 140kg eh?
Yep a big driver or 2 littlens. Thats the weight of a propshaft, driveshaft and clutchpacks for you. Luckily all this extra weight is just a few inches of the floor so aiding a low cog. It could even be a contributor to why the car is so fantastic to drive.SidewaysSi said:
Different class of car, bigger engine etc. And yes, I personally found the M3 too heavy for my liking.
I have driven an RS and found it pretty average to be honest. Falls into the modern, too capable and quite dull category.
I think it's quite interesting that you make that comment, as the implication from the reports is that it's an exciting car, but that it's very capable, and therefore I do question if like so many modern cars it's so capable that anyone could drive it......surely it's one of the reasons many love old cars, the challenge!I have driven an RS and found it pretty average to be honest. Falls into the modern, too capable and quite dull category.
rb5er said:
Axionknight said:
Most of the figures I see for the FK2 put it at around 1380kg so that's a big driver. 140kg eh?
Yep a big driver or 2 littlens. Thats the weight of a propshaft, driveshaft and clutchpacks for you. Luckily all this extra weight is just a few inches of the floor so aiding a low cog. It could even be a contributor to why the car is so fantastic to drive.
Never seen two people, little or otherwise, drive one car before, apart from a few odds and sods contraptions.
Got your car yet? I hope so, maybe you'll drive off into the sunset and stop boring us all to death with you never ending dirge.
On a serious note, the Focus is a superb road choice if you must have 4wd at £34k inc MP, Nav, Cruise, Recaros (I assume no discounts are available)
If you prefer 2wd I can think of a couple of better choices that will also offer more track readiness:
- A M140i at £25k after discount based on the same spec bar the Recaros (but inc leather). Add a (warranty friendly) BMW diff and (warranty discreet) front M4 LCAs and you're away for £27.5k. And you can have it in 3 door, and you're not stuck with a council spoiler (jokes), and you can power oversteer if that's important to you (I don't get that bit).
- A Megane RS Cup-S at £18.5k after discount based on the same spec inc. leather Recaros. Add nothing and you're away. But you can only have it in 3 door.(better be quick though).
I have read several reviews that highlighted how quickly the Focus chewed its consumables on track, unsurprisingly.
I would have either of the above instead as I track my road cars and can't understand why you wouldn't track a performance car, but each to their own.
If you prefer 2wd I can think of a couple of better choices that will also offer more track readiness:
- A M140i at £25k after discount based on the same spec bar the Recaros (but inc leather). Add a (warranty friendly) BMW diff and (warranty discreet) front M4 LCAs and you're away for £27.5k. And you can have it in 3 door, and you're not stuck with a council spoiler (jokes), and you can power oversteer if that's important to you (I don't get that bit).
- A Megane RS Cup-S at £18.5k after discount based on the same spec inc. leather Recaros. Add nothing and you're away. But you can only have it in 3 door.(better be quick though).
I have read several reviews that highlighted how quickly the Focus chewed its consumables on track, unsurprisingly.
I would have either of the above instead as I track my road cars and can't understand why you wouldn't track a performance car, but each to their own.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff