Fatal Tesla crash, software based issue?
Discussion
The Vambo said:
Jader1973 said:
But road layouts change all the time.
For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
Jesus H.For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
You have to have the slightest idea of how the fecker works before having a go at it.
Jader1973 said:
Report I read says the driver was formerly a Navy SEAL.
Tesla killed a veteran!!!
That won't go down well in the US. Trump will probably promise to shut them down as a result.
Not "just" a SEAL either, he was DEVGRU. Not been out long and these guys don't often stray far and often end up working in other "Special Activities"... given his specialism I would hope they do a most detailed investigation possible with full timeline of his day from the second he woke up too the time of the crash.Tesla killed a veteran!!!
That won't go down well in the US. Trump will probably promise to shut them down as a result.
98elise said:
The Vambo said:
Jader1973 said:
But road layouts change all the time.
For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
Jesus H.For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
You have to have the slightest idea of how the fecker works before having a go at it.
I'll give you two real world examples and you can explain how it works.
1) Monday morning, been raining so road is wet, driving in to low sun which makes seeing the white lines difficult, over the weekend they've realigned the lanes due to roadworks and moved everything half a lane to the right, so the road isn't where it has been for the last 6 months. You're doing 60 mph as you approach on Autopilot but on the approach there are dot matrix 50 mph signs, so the speed limit isn't the same either.
How does Autopilot react?
2) You're off someplace you've never been before so are using Nav. It takes you down a single track road with no lines and gravel shoulders to use when a car comes the other way (i.e. the road is 2 lanes wide but there is only a single lane of Tarmac down the centre.). A car comes from the other direction.
What does Autopilot do?
Thanks.
Edited by Jader1973 on Sunday 3rd July 00:28
Jader1973 said:
98elise said:
The Vambo said:
Jader1973 said:
But road layouts change all the time.
For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
Jesus H.For example, they are widening the freeway on my way to work. To do that they have realigned the lanes, and every few weeks they tweak it depending on what they are doing. It may not be the same on Monday as it was on Friday.
So, how does a car with a system that has been taught the road goes one way cope when the white lines go a different way? Does it ignore it? Are there mass Tesla pile ups for days while the system relearns?
People adapt instantly, until all cars from all manufacturers are connected to a network and therefore talk to each other autonomous driving can't work properly. That brings its own problems though, like what happens when the network goes down.
You have to have the slightest idea of how the fecker works before having a go at it.
Edited by Jader1973 on Sunday 3rd July 00:28
s off, i'm not your teacher. http://www.techinsider.io/how-teslas-autopilot-wor...
"There are plenty of things Tesla's Autopilot still shouldn't do, like driving in residential zones with street lights and stop signs. The system is intended for highway use only."
So no good in stop-start traffic where you'd probably find it really useful... but probably perfect on a track day when you'd definitely not want to be using it!
So no good in stop-start traffic where you'd probably find it really useful... but probably perfect on a track day when you'd definitely not want to be using it!
I cannot understand the point of this system if you have to physically remain in control of the car? If the instructions from the manufacturer are this, what is the bloody point? You'll remain completely wired and with your hands gripped, ready to take control at a split seconds notice. Surely that's more stressful than driving anyway, so completely and utterly pointless.
RowntreesCabana said:
I cannot understand the point of this system if you have to physically remain in control of the car? If the instructions from the manufacturer are this, what is the bloody point? You'll remain completely wired and with your hands gripped, ready to take control at a split seconds notice. Surely that's more stressful than driving anyway, so completely and utterly pointless.
It is in the same class as active cruise control, lane assist and predictive braking. To help the driver, not replace them.It would be helpful it it ware called something other than the unhelpful 'autopilot', which it certainly isn't.
eldar said:
RowntreesCabana said:
I cannot understand the point of this system if you have to physically remain in control of the car? If the instructions from the manufacturer are this, what is the bloody point? You'll remain completely wired and with your hands gripped, ready to take control at a split seconds notice. Surely that's more stressful than driving anyway, so completely and utterly pointless.
It is in the same class as active cruise control, lane assist and predictive braking. To help the driver, not replace them.It would be helpful it it ware called something other than the unhelpful 'autopilot', which it certainly isn't.
RowntreesCabana said:
I cannot understand the point of this system if you have to physically remain in control of the car? If the instructions from the manufacturer are this, what is the bloody point? You'll remain completely wired and with your hands gripped, ready to take control at a split seconds notice. Surely that's more stressful than driving anyway, so completely and utterly pointless.
For some maybehttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FIXtGi28R-o
I do a long commute around the M25. Is 2 hours each way of constant speed changes, sometimes stop and go for miles. Curise control would be nice, adaptive cruise would be great, and auto steering would be even better. I would just need to watch ahead rather than constantly operating the car.
Thats why I've ordered a Tesla
Edited by 98elise on Sunday 3rd July 09:55
98elise said:
For some maybe
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FIXtGi28R-o
I do a long commute around the M25. Is 2 hours each way of constant speed changes, sometimes stop and go for miles. Curise control would be nice, adaptive cruise would be great, and auto steering would be even better. I would just need to watch ahead rather than constantly operating the car.
Thats why I've ordered a Tesla
The difference though, as I've seen on a video linked earlier, is that the Tesla is capable of directing you into oncoming traffic in a split second (due to it thinking there was a hazzard in its lane). I could not feel relaxed driving this at all, I'd have to switch it off. Adaptive cruise is great, this however, too stressful.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FIXtGi28R-o
I do a long commute around the M25. Is 2 hours each way of constant speed changes, sometimes stop and go for miles. Curise control would be nice, adaptive cruise would be great, and auto steering would be even better. I would just need to watch ahead rather than constantly operating the car.
Thats why I've ordered a Tesla
Edited by 98elise on Sunday 3rd July 09:55
98elise said:
For some maybe
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FIXtGi28R-o
I do a long commute around the M25. Is 2 hours each way of constant speed changes, sometimes stop and go for miles. Curise control would be nice, adaptive cruise would be great, and auto steering would be even better. I would just need to watch ahead rather than constantly operating the car.
Thats why I've ordered a Tesla
That's the dangerous bit I feel, watching and not interacting will soon stop taxing the brain, your attention level will drop right off and you'll start feeling unengaged. You'll feel the tiredness and fatigue of the long day at work or the early start more as you've got less to focus your mind on. Before you know it you could be asleep at the wheel, but at least you probably wouldn't wake up before the crash.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FIXtGi28R-o
I do a long commute around the M25. Is 2 hours each way of constant speed changes, sometimes stop and go for miles. Curise control would be nice, adaptive cruise would be great, and auto steering would be even better. I would just need to watch ahead rather than constantly operating the car.
Thats why I've ordered a Tesla
Edited by 98elise on Sunday 3rd July 09:55
98elise said:
The Spruce goose said:
The roof was ripped off but it still carried on driving. i don't think i would ever use this system as it is seriously flawed.
As would any cruise control, and thats been around for decades.Some will want to use it, some not. I'm perfectly happy to use it.
This would appear to encourage the driver to let the car do the driving. Obviously there is no point if you need to sit at a fingers trigger to take control when it goes wrong.
The Spruce goose said:
1 death is too much
This might sound callous but its really not and if that logic was applied across the board, every single industry would stop production today and all innovation would be crushed.I wouldn't like to guess how many men died building the sewers never mind in the space race. Would you be happy to go back to slopping out every morning?
The Vambo said:
Well, to be fair, the linked article just says "lots of sensors". It doesn't explain whether (for example) if the autopilot is using general purpose scenario learning, or whether it is learning specific situations and roads. To make it relevant to this example, there are two ways of approaching this accident: do you teach it to somehow discriminate between big trucks and overhead signs, or do you teach it that there are no overhead signs here, so suppress that code until you are in a situation where there is a known sign? Both approaches have potential drawbacks.
rxe said:
The Vambo said:
Well, to be fair, the linked article just says "lots of sensors". It doesn't explain whether (for example) if the autopilot is using general purpose scenario learning, or whether it is learning specific situations and roads. To make it relevant to this example, there are two ways of approaching this accident: do you teach it to somehow discriminate between big trucks and overhead signs, or do you teach it that there are no overhead signs here, so suppress that code until you are in a situation where there is a known sign? Both approaches have potential drawbacks.
Next time ill do the dickish LMGTFY thing.
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