Fatal Tesla crash, software based issue?
Discussion
London424 said:
Not in the crash that this thread was started about. The crash Elon refers to there is another one that happened more recently.RenOHH said:
London424 said:
Not in the crash that this thread was started about. The crash Elon refers to there is another one that happened more recently.hairyben said:
In a world of automonous cars wont the car needing to merge just communicate this and be allowed in by the closest automonous car?
Probably. Assuming the closest car is autonomous, speaks the same language, has the correct software level etc.
Otherwise the car needs to decide on its own.
swisstoni said:
Just had a terrible thought - autonomous cars with parameters stipulated by insurers. It's a brave, new, very low speed world ...
Not just that. It is a world without privacy. Your car will know exactly where you've been....and how long you were there for.Although that issue already exists with the systems in some cars today.
I thought these cars used radar as well as cameras, or is that just Mercedes? I'm sure the distronic plus in my car uses both.
By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
Edited by Lagerlout on Friday 15th July 01:02
Lagerlout said:
I thought these cars used radar as well as cameras, or is that just Mercedes? I'm sure the distronic plus in my car uses both.
By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
Trucks in America often don't have guard rails like UK trailers do along the sides so a radar at a low level may not have anything to detect as the container part of the trailer is higher up.By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
Edited by Lagerlout on Friday 15th July 01:02
Yep has radar, and as explained it cant point up forever because theres only a certain amount of things above that are of interest, on a road with rises/hills it must be tricky trying to work out whats needed and easily a truck without guard rails could cause a problem.
IMO any advanced self drive system needs more input, probably lidar to make it safer.
IMO any advanced self drive system needs more input, probably lidar to make it safer.
RobDickinson said:
Yep has radar, and as explained it cant point up forever because theres only a certain amount of things above that are of interest, on a road with rises/hills it must be tricky trying to work out whats needed and easily a truck without guard rails could cause a problem.
IMO any advanced self drive system needs more input, probably lidar to make it safer.
Musk now saying that Tesla is developing LIDAR-like functionality using the exiting radar hardware. This would make more sense from a cost point of view and could mean just a software upgrade on existing cars.IMO any advanced self drive system needs more input, probably lidar to make it safer.
Jader1973 said:
hairyben said:
In a world of automonous cars wont the car needing to merge just communicate this and be allowed in by the closest automonous car?
Probably. Assuming the closest car is autonomous, speaks the same language, has the correct software level etc.
Otherwise the car needs to decide on its own.
As for language I'm sure we'll work something out, I mean apple windows and android devices are all different but they can all use the same router and internet to view the same webpage can't they.
Jader1973 said:
Not just that. It is a world without privacy. Your car will know exactly where you've been....and how long you were there for.
Although that issue already exists with the systems in some cars today.
My goodness, what a terrible invasion of privacy, you car being able to track where it's been....whilst you have a smartphone with GPS, camera, microphone, and always-on Internet connection on or near your person 24/7.Although that issue already exists with the systems in some cars today.
You need some perspective dear chap.
greygoose said:
Lagerlout said:
I thought these cars used radar as well as cameras, or is that just Mercedes? I'm sure the distronic plus in my car uses both.
By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
Trucks in America often don't have guard rails like UK trailers do along the sides so a radar at a low level may not have anything to detect as the container part of the trailer is higher up.By that, I mean if it had radar it should have picked up the truck turning across it despite it being the same colour as the sky?
Edited by Lagerlout on Friday 15th July 01:02
The camera is high up on the roof but all it saw was a white slabby white sky looking thing- apparently allegedly etc
ETA oh the question was about radar
Jader1973 said:
Not just that. It is a world without privacy. Your car will know exactly where you've been....and how long you were there for.
Although that issue already exists with the systems in some cars today.
Man, you have no idea you chose to give up you privacy years ago.Although that issue already exists with the systems in some cars today.
The massive national ANPR system, the Facebook app on Iphones use the mic to tailor ads for you, Android records you constantly and you can play it back through your Google account, both OS's track you at all times, even if you disable location.
Tesco club card or similar tells them every preference you have, pets, dietary requirements and preferences, when your misses is leaking, Target the US grocery chain got a teenage girl into trouble as they figured out from previous purchases that she was pregnant before she had told her father and a million other companies that you provide information without thinking about it.
In reality privacy is way overrated.
Landlord said:
For those that cite Tesla calling it "Autopilot" is tantamount to culpability... are there any pilots on here who could clarify what "Autopilot" on an aircraft means to them? My assumption would be that they still expect to be "in control" and therefore responsible for the safety of the aircraft.
As with driving, it depends on the crew and the phase of flight. Some pilots will engage the AP a few seconds after take off, and let go of the controls. Some (hopefully most!) will keep their hands on the controls until a comfortable amount of altitude has been gained, the aircraft is clean and there are fewer turns happening. Some will maintain manual control for quite a while after take off (if the workload for the other crew member is low enough) to prevent skill-fade. In an aircraft with conventional controls, keeping your hands on the controls after AP engagement is very sensible because they will move with AP inputs, so you will feel anything that seems unusual or undesirable. In a fly-by-wire aircraft with no feedback, this won't happen, but it is still nice to be in a position to disconnect and fly manually should anything untoward happen when you're low.
In the aircraft I fly, the autopilot is better than me at flying the aircraft in pretty much every situation I can think of. However, you always have to bear in mind that, just as humans can get fixated on one wrong piece of data and cause an accident, the AP system is vulnerable to erroneous sensor inputs. A current example is the potential for the aircraft to enter a flight envelope protection mode because of an erroneous indication of high angle of attack. In very rare cases, the aircraft can be tricked into thinking it is about to stall, and commands the nose down to prevent this. This is a situation where the pilots need to have the bigger picture, disable the protection and recover manually.
In summary, even with incredibly capable automation, a decent crew will always be wary that they might need to intervene, and do so if they're at all unsure about what the AP is doing. Hopefully that answers your question.
Prawo Jazdy said:
In summary, even with incredibly capable automation, a decent crew will always be wary that they might need to intervene, and do so if they're at all unsure about what the AP is doing. Hopefully that answers your question.
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