RE: First Shelby Cobra goes to auction
Discussion
chris_speed said:
So is this likely the car that Mr Shelby put a $50 bill on the scuttle, floored it and told the passenger 'if you can reach it, you can have it'?
I think this is a myth - at most it's going to generate 1G or so under acceleration so you'd have to pretty feeble not to be able to move.As I understand it, all models are Cobras, starting from the 260 (4.2 litre, narrow body), through 289 (4.7 litre, narrow body) up to 427 (7 litre, wide body). All were made predominantly at the Shelby American factory at LA airport with CSX chassis numbers. AC Thames Ditton produced concurrently for the UK and some European customers on COB chassis numbers. There was also an AC-only version called an AC 289 which had the 4.7 litre engine inside the wide body of the 7 litre. I also think this had the coil sprung suspension of the 7 litre car.
It would not have existed without Caroll Shelby, his close Ford contacts and the engineers in LA who developed it.
It would not have existed without Caroll Shelby, his close Ford contacts and the engineers in LA who developed it.
PHMatt said:
Surely that's "just" An AC Ace with a big engine in it?
Which in my books makes it a modified car rather than a production car.
And as stated, it's an British car, not an American car.
It's got a CSX chassis number.....not an AC chassis number.Which in my books makes it a modified car rather than a production car.
And as stated, it's an British car, not an American car.
It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
Here's the RM/Southey's video which explains more about the history, and the shabby interior (I love the backstory!).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2RDT8u4FXY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2RDT8u4FXY
t equals millions of dollars and the greedy auctioneers cash in. If it is so iconic why are they selling it?BrassMan said:
Odd. The chap who runs the tour at their museum claimed that it wasn't for sale at any price and claimed that an offer of $22 million hadn't been enough.
When I took the tour ten years ago, the figure was $30M! Then again, hyperbole is well stocked on the shelves at Shelby American. The thing is, why are they selling it? It held place of pride in their museum, it's the most storied example of one of the greatest motoring icons and the one piece that really set their museum apart from others. Its placement in their Las Vegas museum looked a lot like a shrine or and altar:
I can only guess that either the family needs to sell it to settle Carroll's estate...
...or...
... they think the bubble's about to burst as far as collector car values go!
LotusOmega375D said:
As I understand it, all models are Cobras, starting from the 260 (4.2 litre, narrow body), through 289 (4.7 litre, narrow body) up to 427 (7 litre, wide body). All were made predominantly at the Shelby American factory at LA airport with CSX chassis numbers. AC Thames Ditton produced concurrently for the UK and some European customers on COB chassis numbers. There was also an AC-only version called an AC 289 which had the 4.7 litre engine inside the wide body of the 7 litre. I also think this had the coil sprung suspension of the 7 litre car.
It would not have existed without Caroll Shelby, his close Ford contacts and the engineers in LA who developed it.
FWiW my understanding is that for the mk1's AC made the car complete (chassis, body etc) less engine and exported to Shelby who then fitted the engine - the CSX nomenclature on the chassis referring to "Shelby Export" whereas the UK bound cars had a COB chassis number. I'm not sure about the mk2's (289) in terms how much AC actually manufacured over here in Blighty but even with the mk3 (427) AC continued to make the chassis and export. This particular car has possibly the most AC input of any of the cars so IMHO we should probably say it's Anglo-American and let's not forget the input of Derek Hurlock and John Tojeiro to that exalted list without whom it definitely wouldn't have happenedIt would not have existed without Caroll Shelby, his close Ford contacts and the engineers in LA who developed it.
Incidentally with pedant mode on, it could be argued that the often referred to name "AC Cobra" is a misnomer as Ford owned the Cobra name which was licensed to Shelby but not AC hence their cars were called AC260 / AC289 / AC427
aeropilot said:
It's got a CSX chassis number.....not an AC chassis number.
It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
According to these pictures its the same car (one of the captions mentions the chassis number). Shelby asked AC to adapt the car to a Ford V8, as I understand it AC "borrowed" a V8 from Ford UK (where would they have got that from?), it was then removed and the car shipped the car to Shelby. It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
Shelby didn't have facilities so the car ended up at the shop of well known hot rodder and racer Dean Moon, where the engine and transmission was installed. Moon's company still exists today at the same location and the actual garage still exists, last year it housed Moon's '34 Coupe and one of his race cars.
Edited by Crafty_ on Friday 1st July 19:02
Second time within a week that I've read how recognizable the Miura is to non-car people on Pistonheads.
You can state it every day in every article, but it still won't be true. The Miura isn't even the most recognizable Lamborghini.
Personally, I can't imagine it coming close to breaking the top 100. Has a Miura ever been in a movie, even?
You can state it every day in every article, but it still won't be true. The Miura isn't even the most recognizable Lamborghini.
Personally, I can't imagine it coming close to breaking the top 100. Has a Miura ever been in a movie, even?
Crafty_ said:
aeropilot said:
It's got a CSX chassis number.....not an AC chassis number.
It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
According to these pictures its the same car (one of the captions mentions the chassis number). Shelby asked AC to adapt the car to a Ford V8, as I understand it AC "borrowed" a V8 from Ford UK (where would they have got that from?), it was then removed and the car shipped the car to Shelby. It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
Edited by Crafty_ on Friday 1st July 19:02
LotusOmega375D said:
Lovely video. Says it all really. Although not sure it had all independent suspension early on like the guy says. Also the motor was a 260 (4.2 litre).
Can't believe it's already 4 years since Shelby died.
All Cobras had independent suspension, as did the AC Ace. The Ace and early Cobras had a double wishbone set-up with transverse leaf springs. Later Cobras got a coil-sprung set-up.Can't believe it's already 4 years since Shelby died.
The car itself doesn't look like much but you can't argue with its historical significance.
Not only do I hope it goes to someone who doesn't restore it but I hope it goes to someone who will use it.
Crafty_ said:
aeropilot said:
It's got a CSX chassis number.....not an AC chassis number.
It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
According to these pictures its the same car (one of the captions mentions the chassis number). Shelby asked AC to adapt the car to a Ford V8, as I understand it AC "borrowed" a V8 from Ford UK (where would they have got that from?), it was then removed and the car shipped the car to Shelby. It's the first production Cobra.
It's American.
I don't believe from memory, that this is the Ace that they test fitted the first Ford V8 into (don't think that still exists?)
Shelby didn't have facilities so the car ended up at the shop of well known hot rodder and racer Dean Moon, where the engine and transmission was installed. Moon's company still exists today at the same location and the actual garage still exists, last year it housed Moon's '34 Coupe and one of his race cars.
So, this is the first. I knew it was built at Dean Moon's though, but didn't know Doyle Gammell worked on it in his youth, and only a year before he built his now legendary black chopped '32 3w coupe, now regarded as one of the most iconic '32 Fords of all time.
As for the engine, I'm sure I read that Ford shipped it over to AC? So, yes, it probably was delivered to Thames Ditton via Ford UK in that regard?
I found the pics on the Mooneyes site : http://www.mooneyesusa.net/2012/0502/first-cobra-c...
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