RE: Aston Red Bull hypercar confirmed
Discussion
Undoubtedly it will be epic, but it will never be a "road" car. Frankly almost all the current hyper and some super cars aren't really road cars, because they exceed the limit in sub-4second essentially it is impossible to put your foot all the way down!
But that's not really the point is it? The point is to make the Best possible performance car and if that means LMP1 style with massive aero you can't use on the road well... doesn't mean it isn't the peak of what it is.
I have to say that the photos and specs had me remembering the Jaguar XJ220 launch :-) Anyone want to wager this eventually appears without a bespoke NA V12?
Surely a F1/LMP style hybrid package with a detuned motorsports V8 would achieve the weight, power and packaging Newey wants, arguable without the cahce AM needs!
I wonder if any of the Super/hyper car makers will ever make a true drivers car? At the moment they are leaving the door open to Lotus, Caterham, Ariel and Superbikes for people who want real world speed. Surely Ferrari et al could do a proper sub-700kg supercar? Until then I guess they are just want to go faster, not necessarily better...
But that's not really the point is it? The point is to make the Best possible performance car and if that means LMP1 style with massive aero you can't use on the road well... doesn't mean it isn't the peak of what it is.
I have to say that the photos and specs had me remembering the Jaguar XJ220 launch :-) Anyone want to wager this eventually appears without a bespoke NA V12?
Surely a F1/LMP style hybrid package with a detuned motorsports V8 would achieve the weight, power and packaging Newey wants, arguable without the cahce AM needs!
I wonder if any of the Super/hyper car makers will ever make a true drivers car? At the moment they are leaving the door open to Lotus, Caterham, Ariel and Superbikes for people who want real world speed. Surely Ferrari et al could do a proper sub-700kg supercar? Until then I guess they are just want to go faster, not necessarily better...
Lots of ground clearance and empty voids under the car...
I really dislike the "its looks JUST like..." posts
but I'm making an exception and calling this a Pagani vs Caparo love child.
And much like the new Superman fiulms are full of 'meh' thanks to Transformers
This is 'meh' (to me) thanks to the 'trinity' and Chiron.
I really dislike the "its looks JUST like..." posts
but I'm making an exception and calling this a Pagani vs Caparo love child.
And much like the new Superman fiulms are full of 'meh' thanks to Transformers
This is 'meh' (to me) thanks to the 'trinity' and Chiron.
I suppose it is always going to be the case due to packaging constraints, but it seems to owe quite a lot to the Audi Avus.
It does look rather fussy to my eyes, but overall I think I like it. Then again it looks a lot like stuff I used to draw in the early 90s
ETA: Aren't the wings on the AMRBthingywotsit going to be lift inducing with a shape like that?
It does look rather fussy to my eyes, but overall I think I like it. Then again it looks a lot like stuff I used to draw in the early 90s
ETA: Aren't the wings on the AMRBthingywotsit going to be lift inducing with a shape like that?
Edited by Zad on Tuesday 5th July 16:20
Looks incredible.. if the end product stays like this. Note the concept wording on this model.
No idea how all the packaging will work.
There are still quotes about being as fast an F1 car in race trim on Autocar. References to LMP1 were that it would be quicker.
But you also need to note that there are two versions. Road going and an even more extreme track only version with slicks and even more aero.
It's only the track version which is going to go F1/LMP1 time hunting. I'm sure the road going version won't be slow, but the headline grabbing will be achieved by the other version.
Look forward to seeing the finished article and whether these claims come true.
No idea how all the packaging will work.
There are still quotes about being as fast an F1 car in race trim on Autocar. References to LMP1 were that it would be quicker.
But you also need to note that there are two versions. Road going and an even more extreme track only version with slicks and even more aero.
It's only the track version which is going to go F1/LMP1 time hunting. I'm sure the road going version won't be slow, but the headline grabbing will be achieved by the other version.
Look forward to seeing the finished article and whether these claims come true.
NRS said:
Chris Stott said:
Max_Torque said:
Sorry, but my BULLSH*T radar is bonging off the scale!
"fits 2 adults, a V12, some hybrid stuff" and yet it looks to have a SIGNIFICANTLY smaller package envelope than a 918/P1/LaLa, due to the underfloor channels required and low roof line. Where exactly are you going to put all those oily bits to actually make it work?
"Quicker than an F1 car" er, seriously unlikely, even given free rein without regs, and as anyone who has driven a very quick single seater with massive aero will testify, they make TERRIBLE road cars. P1/918/LaLa all took significant performance compromises on-board in order to make the decent to drive on the road
Tyres - this is the big one, it won't be quicker than an F1 car on ROAD LEGAL tyres
Secret "Adrian Newey" sauce - yes he's a pretty dam good race car designer, but even he can't brake the laws of physics. A "practical" road car can never be F1 car low, which is what is required to make underfloor ground effect aero work. Low drag isn't enough, you need the massive ratio of downforce to mass that an F1 car has to pull high G.
Road Car Homologation - er, just looking at that styling buck (which is what it is) i can already see probably 20 issues that won't pass series homologation.
All of that, AND it's apparently going to weigh less than 1,000kg "fits 2 adults, a V12, some hybrid stuff" and yet it looks to have a SIGNIFICANTLY smaller package envelope than a 918/P1/LaLa, due to the underfloor channels required and low roof line. Where exactly are you going to put all those oily bits to actually make it work?
"Quicker than an F1 car" er, seriously unlikely, even given free rein without regs, and as anyone who has driven a very quick single seater with massive aero will testify, they make TERRIBLE road cars. P1/918/LaLa all took significant performance compromises on-board in order to make the decent to drive on the road
Tyres - this is the big one, it won't be quicker than an F1 car on ROAD LEGAL tyres
Secret "Adrian Newey" sauce - yes he's a pretty dam good race car designer, but even he can't brake the laws of physics. A "practical" road car can never be F1 car low, which is what is required to make underfloor ground effect aero work. Low drag isn't enough, you need the massive ratio of downforce to mass that an F1 car has to pull high G.
Road Car Homologation - er, just looking at that styling buck (which is what it is) i can already see probably 20 issues that won't pass series homologation.
Too much BS.
To get 1,000bhp or more it's going to need some sort of hybrid system, so it's going to weigh a lot more than 1,000kg.
Damn I seem to have accidentally logged into the What Car? forum not Pistonheads judging by many of the comments above
Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
The more I loo at this, the more I think 'publicity stunt'.
Aston have no money - they made a £70M loss in the 2014 tax year and they are heavily in debt (and paying ridiculous interest rates to service that debt). Even if they sell 100 units at £3M they will likely lose money on every one.
They need something like a Cayenne in their range to make some profit a lot more than they need this.
Aston have no money - they made a £70M loss in the 2014 tax year and they are heavily in debt (and paying ridiculous interest rates to service that debt). Even if they sell 100 units at £3M they will likely lose money on every one.
They need something like a Cayenne in their range to make some profit a lot more than they need this.
RobDown said:
Damn I seem to have accidentally logged into the What Car? forum not Pistonheads judging by many of the comments above
Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
Yeah, some comments do seem a bit odd as this is just a styling model.Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
How will it cope with the big shop at waitrose!
I'm sure the multi b/millionaire, on the invite only buyers list will have all these practical worries right at the top of their list.
If they pull off the tech and claims being made it will be incredible and to be applauded. It's virtually a prototype racer being made to be work as a road car.
The styling is obviously going to be aero led. Look at the details, the aero concepts for a hypercar are like nothing else.
Are people going to just keep plucking any supercar with a low profile roof line and say it looks the same! I can't recall another serious road car with this type of aero concept.
Edited by DS240 on Tuesday 5th July 17:07
RobDown said:
Damn I seem to have accidentally logged into the What Car? forum not Pistonheads judging by many of the comments above
Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
Yeah I mean it's only Adrian Newey in charge, what does he know compared to the PH experts. In fact he's probably in MK now logged on and picking up design ideas and tips Seriously guys; a car company wants to make a 900bhp, 900kg hypercar that might be as fast as an LMP1 and you're not in the least bit excited? Someone moaning that it wont make a good road car? Really, I mean really? Think you've all come to the wrong place
dom9 said:
The track only car will be faster than an LMP1, which seems pretty feasible.
I haven't read anything that isn't possible.
Does it? The 919 is about 875kg and 900hp. An LMP1 has bugger all room in the cabin, so front cross sectional area is minimised. I doubt this could match an LMP1 for weight, power:weight or CdA. (Eta: well, CdA without wings may be better, but then to the detriment of corner speed.)I haven't read anything that isn't possible.
Don't get me wrong, I like it and I'm glad they're doing it (although sceptical it will happen), but I think they're exaggerating its capabilities.
Edited by xRIEx on Tuesday 5th July 17:18
Edited by xRIEx on Tuesday 5th July 17:20
WestyCarl said:
Yeah I mean it's only Adrian Newey in charge, what does he know compared to the PH experts. In fact he's probably in MK now logged on and picking up design ideas and tips
There's a reason the UK is leading the world in automotive engineering, whether it is consumer or competition markets, that's all I'm saying. Ahem.In all seriousness though, there are quite a few professional engineers and designers on here, many of which work for "interesting" companies on equally "interesting" and rather important projects. Unfortunately they are rarely able to talk about them, so the rest of us have to make up for it
Chris Stott said:
The more I loo at this, the more I think 'publicity stunt'.
Aston have no money - they made a £70M loss in the 2014 tax year and they are heavily in debt (and paying ridiculous interest rates to service that debt). Even if they sell 100 units at £3M they will likely lose money on every one.
They need something like a Cayenne in their range to make some profit a lot more than they need this.
They have 2000 DB11 orders. The new Vantage comes next year and will sell. The DBX is in development and will sell. They are going to be fine.Aston have no money - they made a £70M loss in the 2014 tax year and they are heavily in debt (and paying ridiculous interest rates to service that debt). Even if they sell 100 units at £3M they will likely lose money on every one.
They need something like a Cayenne in their range to make some profit a lot more than they need this.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff