The Best ///M/Barge/General Rant/Look at this/O/T(Vol XVIII)

[ferrisbueller]

TheRocket said:

ferrisbueller said:

There are only manuals.

Well spotted the deliberate mistake

Incidentally found this on tinterweb, not sure how true but a 575 manual would appear to be quite a rare beast

'550 production 3083, all three pedal cars. 575M production 2064 cars, 246 three pedal, all the rest F1.'

This is correct. I think RHD manuals is somewhere in the region of 60.

There are a handful of 599 manuals.

[barchetta_boy]

I would guess a 550 would disappoint in the chassis department, despite the wonderful engine. That's what I keep telling myself.

Every time I sell a car it goes up...

987 Boxtser Spyder - sold for 31k
964 C2 manual LSD - sold for 19k with 2k fee
79 928 manual race car 4.5k (just wanted it off the drive)


even my 12C which sold for 115k now looks cheap 3 months later. And I miss the colour.

First world problems!

[Cactussed]

The next question is....

If/when the current bubble eventually bursts, which of us is really prepared to put money where mouth is and go buy something?

[ferrisbueller]

barchetta_boy said:

I would guess a 550 would disappoint in the chassis department, despite the wonderful engine.

Why would you think that?

Autocar's driver's car of the year winners:

Porsche 944 S2 (1989), Mazda MX-5 (1990), Honda NSX (1991), Honda NSX (1992), Porsche 968 Clubsport (1993), Porsche 911 (993) Carrera (1994), Lotus Esprit S4S (1995), Lotus Elise (1996), Ferrari 550 Maranello (1997), Ferrari 550 Maranello (1998), Ferrari 360 Modena (1999), Porsche 911 (996) Turbo (2000), Lotus Elise Series 2 (2001), Lamborghini Murcielago (2002), Mazda MX-5 (2003), Noble M400 (2004), Porsche 911 (997) Carrera S (2005), Porsche Cayman S (2006), Audi R8 (2007), Nissan GT-R (2008), Lotus Evora (2009), Porsche 911 997 GT3 RS (2010), Porsche Cayman R (2011), Toyota GT86 (2012), Porsche 911 (991) GT3 (2013)

I believe the early 575s were felt to be a bit too soft.

[ferrisbueller]

Cactussed said:

The next question is....

If/when the current bubble eventually bursts, which of us is really prepared to put money where mouth is and go buy something?

There's a flipside to that.

I'd quite happily see the bubble continue, for a while at least.....

[Cheburator mk2]

E30 320iS - as low as £2k for a good one from Wayne in Norwich. £10k for a ropey one now
964 Turbo 3.3 - £18k for various LHD ones. £80k+ for the same car now

olly2n - a mate who was one of the top sales in OPC East London called me up in March 2010 and offered me a "red" 996GT3RS for £55k with all the bells and whistles that come with a OPC Approved car. With sprog N1 on the way I thought it was prudent to sink my money a little later on in a E61 M5 Touring... Doh! Doh! Doh!

[Cactussed]

I've only driven one at town speeds and whilst I enjoyed it, it felt utterly pointless. Half a squirt in first gear had you over the 30 limit and there was so much torque you constantly had to be careful with the right foot. Also, the engine felt slightly muted at low revs and boomy with the Tubi when squirting it? My 2c was that it needed some stock pipes and induction noise...

I imagine as a GT car and for long winding roads, it would be utterly epic.
For most situations, I prefer the 355.

Of course, one of each would be nice...

[jeremyc]

Cactussed said:

The next question is....

If/when the current bubble eventually bursts, which of us is really prepared to put money where mouth is and go buy something?

I've got a stack of needed purchases building up.

I'll start by having another of the aforementioned Beans please, and add a 550 and 355 for starters. Then there's the Carrera GT to get hold of ...

[TheRocket]

ferrisbueller said:

This is correct. I think RHD manuals is somewhere in the region of 60.

There are a handful of 599 manuals.

I wonder how many 599 owners were talked out of it by Ferrari salesmen telling them a it will be 'residual suicide' to spec manual, I'd sue

[braddo]

olly22n said:

In hindsight I should have just ponied up for Jeremys baked bean and be done with it.

Had it been RHD I would definitely have been chatting to Jeremy as well!

[ferrisbueller]

TheRocket said:

ferrisbueller said:

This is correct. I think RHD manuals is somewhere in the region of 60.

There are a handful of 599 manuals.

I wonder how many 599 owners were talked out of it by Ferrari salesmen telling them a it will be 'residual suicide' to spec manual, I'd sue

AFAIK, it wasn't an option. It was special order from the factory and even then we're talking single digits I believe.


A manual 575 Superamerica would be worth finding. I think there are less than 50. I recall one dealer couldn't shift one at 100k......ditto the 550 Barchetta.....

[ferrisbueller]

braddo said:

olly22n said:

In hindsight I should have just ponied up for Jeremys baked bean and be done with it.

Had it been RHD I would definitely have been chatting to Jeremy as well!

He'd have had no end of potential buyers.

Non-buyer's remorse here.

[jeremyc]

ferrisbueller said:

braddo said:

olly22n said:

In hindsight I should have just ponied up for Jeremys baked bean and be done with it.

Had it been RHD I would definitely have been chatting to Jeremy as well!

He'd have had no end of potential buyers.

Non-buyer's remorse here.

Do you feel lucky?

[Diesel Meister]

olly22n said:

I clicked that thinking - fk it. I mights just find the extra and grab one. Imagining £50k or so.

Nope, another £20k on top of the £20k i'm already short.

Dude - I referenced this exact car in an earlier post. It is a beaut but like you I'm somewhat short on the folding and in fact could probably only raise about half if I sold some body parts and mortgaged those remaining with a lender of ill-repute

996 GT3s seem to have settled in the £60-100k range, with RS models appearing for 50-100% more in some cases. Zanzibananas

Rocket - no problem. I think you can edit it by quoting my original post. I'll have a go at updating outside of office hours as it's a bit manic here atm!

EDIT: Eff it - Friday after all!

Diesel Meister said:

Model	Low?	High?	% Increase?
E24 M	???	???	???
E28 M5	£3k	£85k?	2733%!
E30 M3	£7k	£60k	757%!
E34 M5	£4.5k	£35k?	700%
E46 CSL	£20k	£60k?	200%
2.2S	???	???	???
3.2 CS	£25k	£75k?	200%
964 RS	£25k?	£200k?	700%
993 RS	£50k?	£300k?	500%
996 GT3	£25k	£70k	100%
F355	£45k?	£100k?	78%
550 M	£30k?	£100k?	200%
288 GTO	???	???	???
F40	???	???	???
F50	???	???	???

Some piffling updates - more later. Quite right on the CSL correction - i think I corrected the indicative prices but didn't update the percentage increase. Clearly a bit of hopeful man-mathemagics

EDIT 2:

I've upped the F355, 550 and E28 highs - astounding. although of course I remind everyone that this is a totoally unscientific bit of fun - gauging the widest point *might* give a vague (if caveated) idea of the state of the market, even if you're potentially comparing lemons (arf) and apples (heavily marked-up, if shiny).

The E30 M3 is a weird one. Back when the lows were £5k for tatty import, mint late model specials we re in the £20k+ range iirc (aside fro museum pieces / celeb provenance). I'm certain I've seen at least one E30 M3 go up for £80+, possibly one at £100k, though obviously no proof as to actual price paid. Accordingly I have arbitrarily reduced the high to £60k - pretty certain they have been sold for more but that's purely intuition rather than hard evidence!

Still, some potential (small) lotto-win jumps there and we've not really explored the hypercar market (CGTs were languishing for a while as were XJ220s, down to £90k at one stage iirc).

Edited by Diesel Meister on Friday 13th January 15:43

[Output Flange]

Sutts mentioned on the last (big-boy) page that the M5 high is £95k. Which is clearly bonkers.

[ferrisbueller]

I think 355s are gone over 100, as have 550s.

I'm dubious a standard E30 M3 has breached the 50k mark, never mind 100. Happy to be wrong though.

[ferrisbueller]

I may be missing something but on first glance this looks alright at 55k.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/b...

25k was getting on with it. 50k is stretching the point. 100k is, well, stupid?!

[Cactussed]

I've seen a graph of 246 dino values in the 1980s and 90s but can't find it now.
Showed a similar type of bubble...

[Output Flange]

::Anyone fancy an E34?::

[Diesel Meister]

ferris - yeah I remember a few hovering around the £45-55k range, good nick but not super low miles or owners. I definitely recall seeing them up for much more than that (certainly over £80k in some instances, for road cars). Whilst the sale price might differ from the asking in any given scenario, my suspicion is that the current frenzy (bubble!) leads to asking being achieved, if not better under the right circumstances (v. limited supply whether absolutely or at the given point in time; cheap cash / more money than sense; lack of alternatives due to yet more stratospheric rises etc.). Who knows...

cactussed - me too. Didn't they from under £50-60k at one point to ~£200kish or something? Now >£500k for pristine ones it would seem! Utterly. Nucking. Futs.

ETA:

flange - I would absolutely love an E34 M5. One of my favourite cars of all time. Not ideal DD material but I'd have a crack! The 3.6 is probably a good punt, although my only passenger ride was in a 3.8 so I'd be tempted by that.

I'm assuming these are still money pits (rust, M-general tax on parts and serving, S38 being a bit bespoke / maintenance sensitive)?

Edited by Diesel Meister on Friday 13th January 17:00