The Best ///M/Barge/General Rant/Look at this/O/T(Vol XVIII)
Discussion
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Moose, does the 997 or GT3 have this as well? Wondering if you noticed anything similar driving Kul's GT3. It's defo got the anti-stall when moving off, which I end up triggering now and then because the initial throttle response is so dull. Nice and sharp when in gear though.My right foot is still programmed to be very sensitive on the throttle after years of driving my old Alfa. On old cars like that you press the throttle even 2mm and you get instant response from the engine.
TheRocket said:
DM basis the above post you need to get this bought! Or thread purchase with some crowd funding how hard can it be ? 
I am sorely tempted. Main issue is having only one garage spot - that is too nice to sit al fresco like the slowlo!It would need to replace Emmy Lou or both her and the miniveedub...
/does sums
ferrisbueller said:
olly22n said:
ferrisbueller said:
Diesel Meister said:
Fugly
Not a fan of the 6 window. I love sierras however, and adore the bi-plane spoiler.
Ferris - I like sierras but that one, despite being otherwise "correctly" configured (as mentioned), is not pretty at all to my eyes 
Re. H&T / rev-matching, I find it depends on many parameters as to the precise technique. The objective is to get the right amount of revs to smooth the down change whilst simultaneous applying the brakes smoothly (whether maximum attack or travelling more sedately), you adjust accordingly.
I rate cars that make it intuitive and satisfying (986s and 996s are among the best for the combination of pedal placement / weighting / action / response, as well as a nice firm hi-set brake pedal, proportionate throttle / engine response and a nice noise.). I've finally got the hang in the slowlo - requires fairly meaningful stab (flex ankle, angle foot and push decisively from the knee), to get past what I consider to be ECU / emission related throttle torpor.
The funny thing is that the car will determine which bit of your right foot is actually contacting the throttle pedal and where - could be sole, could be edge, could be laces!
All fun and necessary unless you like to approach corners like a learner having an involuntary sneezing fit, locking the driving wheels and giving yourself whiplash with a clumsy down-change.
Re. H&T / rev-matching, I find it depends on many parameters as to the precise technique. The objective is to get the right amount of revs to smooth the down change whilst simultaneous applying the brakes smoothly (whether maximum attack or travelling more sedately), you adjust accordingly.
I rate cars that make it intuitive and satisfying (986s and 996s are among the best for the combination of pedal placement / weighting / action / response, as well as a nice firm hi-set brake pedal, proportionate throttle / engine response and a nice noise.). I've finally got the hang in the slowlo - requires fairly meaningful stab (flex ankle, angle foot and push decisively from the knee), to get past what I consider to be ECU / emission related throttle torpor.
The funny thing is that the car will determine which bit of your right foot is actually contacting the throttle pedal and where - could be sole, could be edge, could be laces!
All fun and necessary unless you like to approach corners like a learner having an involuntary sneezing fit, locking the driving wheels and giving yourself whiplash with a clumsy down-change.
olly22n said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Yeah. Ball of my big toe on the brake, outside of my foot on the throttle. Unorthodox but works for me! But Olly - I do almost exactly the same (and I learnt on a Metro).
It works perfectly on most cars - but I find it impossible in the Integrale - the throttle pedal is so high I haven't yet found a way to make it work. I was driving it a bit over winter and seriously thought about finding a mechanic to hack off the pedal and reattach it about 4 inches lower!!
Loads of great comments recently around M cars and other musings!
I went over to Alastair Bols a few weeks ago and enjoyed chatting to him re: 12c's. Just a pipe dream for me really but they are lovely cars. (I've not driven one yet). I know Joel rates them highly but for me they look like the perfect combination of usability and track-ready. If I'd been ready to buy he had a 36k miles early black car for under £100k which looked tempting...
The 12C is a really superb package, its only flaw is a bit of a lack of character in the engine, which is a flaw it shares with the 488 GTB, every M car since the E92 V8 and every current Porsche bar the GT3.
They are so mind-bendingly quick it just recalibrates everything... I had a really good test drive in an Aston V12 Vantage S manual and while that didn't feel slow, it certainly wasn't on the same level as the 12C. 600+bhp is a whole different ball game. (The V12 is amazing by the way, I was very tempted to buy it, but I thought since I've gone to the trouble of swapping my 12C for a spider I'll keep it for the summer)
The funny thing is, you tootle around in it for a bit and you think bloody hell this is quick, and then you find an opportunity to rev it out and it reveals a whole new layer of performance you'd forgotten about!
I think it looks better with every passing year.
Anyway - reason for posting was I can't get the hang of HnT in my Elise at all, and there is a car that really needs it, particularly as mine revs to 8k. It feels like I need to bend my knee to allow my foot to rotate right around my toe (if that makes sense) and the steering column prevents this. Maybe I just need to fit a steering wheel spacer
Joel
They are so mind-bendingly quick it just recalibrates everything... I had a really good test drive in an Aston V12 Vantage S manual and while that didn't feel slow, it certainly wasn't on the same level as the 12C. 600+bhp is a whole different ball game. (The V12 is amazing by the way, I was very tempted to buy it, but I thought since I've gone to the trouble of swapping my 12C for a spider I'll keep it for the summer)
The funny thing is, you tootle around in it for a bit and you think bloody hell this is quick, and then you find an opportunity to rev it out and it reveals a whole new layer of performance you'd forgotten about!
I think it looks better with every passing year.
Anyway - reason for posting was I can't get the hang of HnT in my Elise at all, and there is a car that really needs it, particularly as mine revs to 8k. It feels like I need to bend my knee to allow my foot to rotate right around my toe (if that makes sense) and the steering column prevents this. Maybe I just need to fit a steering wheel spacer
Joel
Joel - I never get tired of looking at that Spider
Some say the 12c is too generic but I have always liked its understatement. When you see / hear one amongst normal traffic it's not lacking in presence to me, even if it's not as dramatic / theatrical as some. I think it will continue to age well.olly22n said:
My elan is the same Joel, steering wheel gets in the way.
Re: Macca - I've being blasting around in my 987.1 cayman s recently and have concluded that it really is all the power and chassis you need for the road. I rarely deploy full throttle for more than a few seconds on my favourite roads.
I was musing about a 3.8 or 4.0 donk in a cayman, but it concluded it would be wasteful.
(for clarity - my roads are the b660, a607, b1176, b176 etc etc - which i would class as more on the tight and technical side of the b'road scale)
Re: Macca - I've being blasting around in my 987.1 cayman s recently and have concluded that it really is all the power and chassis you need for the road. I rarely deploy full throttle for more than a few seconds on my favourite roads.
I was musing about a 3.8 or 4.0 donk in a cayman, but it concluded it would be wasteful.
(for clarity - my roads are the b660, a607, b1176, b176 etc etc - which i would class as more on the tight and technical side of the b'road scale)
I thought this after a ride in J's S, directly after been flown down the same route in a 991 C4S. The Cayman S felt entirely quick enough thanks - useful edge over typical road traffic when needed and certainly enough accelerative force to hold one's interest when fully lit. Nice noise too. You are not helping current conundrum though!
Diesel Meister said:
Joel - I never get tired of looking at that Spider Some say the 12c is too generic but I have always liked its understatement. When you see / hear one amongst normal traffic it's not lacking in presence to me, even if it's not as dramatic / theatrical as some. I think it will continue to age well.
Some say the 12c is too generic but I have always liked its understatement. When you see / hear one amongst normal traffic it's not lacking in presence to me, even if it's not as dramatic / theatrical as some. I think it will continue to age well. to all of that.On H'n'T, I think I know what Olly means with the knee action, I did something similar in my Elise and Alfa. For me the full forefoot was on the brake pedal (especially in elise with no servo) so to H&T you would bend your knee up, rotate the foot and bring your heel down onto the throttle pedal; this was only possible if you had enough room under the steering column. I like to be close to the pedals but I think I had to sit slightly further back on track days to avoid banging my knee.
In a cateringtin it was different - I had to have half the forefoot on the brake and use the outside of the foot to blip the throttle, so there is no rotation of the foot (or kick from the knee).
This is kind of how I did it. But not quite as quick!! Talk of throttle response - check how responsive the engine is o a stab of throttle. The DBW throttle in my GT3 is miles away from being that sensitive to a throttle stab.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WSCpBQ0e34
Edit - technique can be a bit different with a top-hinged throttle where you have to bring your heel up higher, so more foot rotation and knee action.
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