RE: Lexus GS F: UK Review
Discussion
TNH said:
ITP said:
Cheap interior? Have you just been transported from a 1975 Toyota to the present day?
You have clearly never been in a modern Lexus as the interior quality is several notches above any of the rival offerings.
I'd agree. Even if its perceived quality it looks tacky and cheap. I've never understood why people say Lexus interiors are nice places to be.You have clearly never been in a modern Lexus as the interior quality is several notches above any of the rival offerings.
I'm quite impressed. The Germans are getting heat for being turbo, and here comes an NA player which, I would have thought, would appeal to the "purists". Good to see snobbery non-existent then...
The discussion of top trumps is laughable. If you really need to win at top trumps, then maybe you have bigger (or smaller problems) elsewhere, like in your trousers?
Drive the bloody thing. See for yourself, and forget what the lemmings in the pub think. Exercise your own brain. What I can tell you after many years of lexus ownership is that they're not an easy car to appreciate. Most road tests are done and dusted within short order. Lexus is a brand that takes awhile to appreciate. The feeling of quality, being built like a bank vault, i something that you dont immediately appreciate, but one day you wake up after 50 - 100,000 miles and you go "hey, I just realised, that car doesn't even have a squeal or rattle".
You wont get that from a short test drive. And the idiots at the pub only look at the power numbers.
Look deeper.
The discussion of top trumps is laughable. If you really need to win at top trumps, then maybe you have bigger (or smaller problems) elsewhere, like in your trousers?
Drive the bloody thing. See for yourself, and forget what the lemmings in the pub think. Exercise your own brain. What I can tell you after many years of lexus ownership is that they're not an easy car to appreciate. Most road tests are done and dusted within short order. Lexus is a brand that takes awhile to appreciate. The feeling of quality, being built like a bank vault, i something that you dont immediately appreciate, but one day you wake up after 50 - 100,000 miles and you go "hey, I just realised, that car doesn't even have a squeal or rattle".
You wont get that from a short test drive. And the idiots at the pub only look at the power numbers.
Look deeper.
I like the comparison to the f10 it pretty much sums up what I feel about them.
I think this is a great car, it's properly interesting and seems to have a proper character. I run an XFR and alright I'm biased, it's a bit different and has a character nothing like the BM/Audi/Mercs.. It's nice to have something different.
I think this is a great car, it's properly interesting and seems to have a proper character. I run an XFR and alright I'm biased, it's a bit different and has a character nothing like the BM/Audi/Mercs.. It's nice to have something different.
Toilet Duck said:
Dan, as you've driven all the cars in this sector (GS F/M5/AMG), what would you personally choose out the three and why?
Well, I have to confess a long-held enthusiasm for AMG product, hence the reference to the old 6.3 E63 in the copy. And I guess we're kind of between E-Class AMGs at the moment so there's not one to consider as an alternative. Based on this experience with the GS F I'd certainly have it over an M5 and I really enjoyed the revvy V8 thing and the simplicity of the properly honed chassis, the details like the brake pedal and steering feel and overall sense it's a car built by engineers who get what keen drivers want. I rather fear the Germans have got a little obsessed with horsepower and gizmos and lost sight of the more subtle feelgood factors you need to have in a car like this to make it worth the investment. All relative but it's also pretty solid value given that £69,995 price is all-in; that 30 Jahre M5 we tested was optioned to £113K and even with both (both!) extras boxed ticked the GS F is still cheaper than an M5's base price before options.
Before driving it I'd have probably discounted the Lexus. With some miles in it I'd very much consider it a contender of equal worth and with way more character and depth than I'd have ever credited in my previously German-centric outlook on this sector.
A very pleasant surprise, in other words.
Cheers,
Dan
The Rx450h, IS300h, RC300h and the GS are imo the best looking cars in their class. Not sure why people complain about the grill when you have blandness from the like of Audi, BMW and Porsche.
If I used a car more than the current 2k-5k per year miles I currently do, I would definitely look at one of the above.
Until then its still the 675LT to go and buy some milk.
If I used a car more than the current 2k-5k per year miles I currently do, I would definitely look at one of the above.
Until then its still the 675LT to go and buy some milk.
I can see the appeal with one of these.
Having gone from a 6.2 litre AMG (amazing engine response, great to rev, lots of character and rich noise) to a 5.5 litre AMG (twin turbo, terrible response, contrived noise, which gets no more interesting with revs, far too much torque for the amount of traction on offer) to a naturally aspirated Panamera GTS (similar to the 6.2 in many ways, just a little less grunt), I really don't want to go back to a turbo of any sort.
To make frequent, enjoyable use of 500bhp+ on the road is actually quite difficult and there are very few opportunities to really use the whole rev range, not to mention, very little reward from doing so. The performance has become largely academic and there's very little to interest the enthusiast IMHO.
I found the M5 characterless, the E63 AMG contrived and the RS6 a blunt (but impressive!) instrument.
Not sure about the looks or colours of the Lexus though...
Having gone from a 6.2 litre AMG (amazing engine response, great to rev, lots of character and rich noise) to a 5.5 litre AMG (twin turbo, terrible response, contrived noise, which gets no more interesting with revs, far too much torque for the amount of traction on offer) to a naturally aspirated Panamera GTS (similar to the 6.2 in many ways, just a little less grunt), I really don't want to go back to a turbo of any sort.
To make frequent, enjoyable use of 500bhp+ on the road is actually quite difficult and there are very few opportunities to really use the whole rev range, not to mention, very little reward from doing so. The performance has become largely academic and there's very little to interest the enthusiast IMHO.
I found the M5 characterless, the E63 AMG contrived and the RS6 a blunt (but impressive!) instrument.
Not sure about the looks or colours of the Lexus though...
vz-r_dave said:
RumbleOfThunder said:
Can we stop saying the M5 is characterless please? This is getting silly now. 
If someone has drove it and drove its biggest competitors surely they are entitled and somewhat qualified to give their opinion? Pace and character are not one and the same thing. at anything under licence losing speeds, the M5 didn't really excite me. The AMG was a bit better and the RS6 was somewhere in between.
Dan Trent said:
I rather fear the Germans have got a little obsessed with horsepower and gizmos and lost sight of the more subtle feelgood factors you need to have in a car like this to make it worth the investment.
This is what customers want unfortunately. Perfect example is the new performance pack for the RS6, add 30bhp bring it past the magic "600", add some new tech and suddenly they are back in demand...a very basic remap and a badge to brag about suddenly you are shifting units of a 4 year old car.The post Grand turismo generation now have money and they want numbers and tech.
It never ceases to amaze me the amount of German brand snobbery out there, and it is usually from people that have never even been in a premium jap car like Lexus.
As has been eluded to in the article and posts on this thread, its not just about numbers.
I've owned BMW's and Mercs (never an Audi, might as well have a Ford) and now own a Lexus GS450h.
I can honestly say the Lexus quality in all areas is exceptional, and ontop of that the service you get from the dealers is really special - they treat you like you've bought a Roller or Bentley! Go in a Merc or BM showroom and you are usually treated with mild contempt by a spiv in a shiny suit!
This all adds up to the whole experience and is probably why most Lexus owners stay with the brand.
Think about it, the German two have rested on their laurels where Lexus had to play catchup and beat them at their own game. This is why so much attention to detail and high quality goes into their products as they cant just trade on a badge.
Love my 450h, and would love this GS-F even more!
As has been eluded to in the article and posts on this thread, its not just about numbers.
I've owned BMW's and Mercs (never an Audi, might as well have a Ford) and now own a Lexus GS450h.
I can honestly say the Lexus quality in all areas is exceptional, and ontop of that the service you get from the dealers is really special - they treat you like you've bought a Roller or Bentley! Go in a Merc or BM showroom and you are usually treated with mild contempt by a spiv in a shiny suit!
This all adds up to the whole experience and is probably why most Lexus owners stay with the brand.
Think about it, the German two have rested on their laurels where Lexus had to play catchup and beat them at their own game. This is why so much attention to detail and high quality goes into their products as they cant just trade on a badge.
Love my 450h, and would love this GS-F even more!
Funny that turbo charging used to be what Toyota knew best back in the 90s. Fast forward 20 odd years and they've gone all N/A on us. Not complaining at all just find it weird that the Germans caught on when the Japanese gave up.
Anyway saw one of these driving down the A3 last week. Looked cool from far but very weird styling up close. Still wouldn't mind trying one in 2/3 years when its more than half the list price
.
Anyway saw one of these driving down the A3 last week. Looked cool from far but very weird styling up close. Still wouldn't mind trying one in 2/3 years when its more than half the list price
.Omar_RCF said:
MadDog1962 said:
Plenty grunt for the real world.
Quite likely to be easier to live with and more reliable than an M5.
However, the depreciation is really going to hurt unless you're absolutely stinking rich.
Yep. I got mine for 59k with only 5k miles and the RC for 45k with 8k miles. Quite likely to be easier to live with and more reliable than an M5.
However, the depreciation is really going to hurt unless you're absolutely stinking rich.
Can you give any impressions on the RC-F?
ISO51200 said:
Looks quite nice from the outside, but yet again a cheap interior lets it down
The interior on my IS-F was great and it looks like they've stepped up their game in terms of the control systems and have the electronic dash a la LFA. Mentioned this before but the solid aluminium paddles were absolute class and that's where your fingers spend most of their time!
Edited by SandyT on Tuesday 2nd August 21:01
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