Why you should give cyclists a wide berth when passing.
Discussion
Finlandia said:
Conscript said:
Finlandia said:
Conscript said:
walm said:
WinstonWolf said:
You forgot horses, I bet he hates horses using *his* road too 
He already mentioned them I think. It was a given. Everyone hates the jodphur-wearing brigade.How very dare they. [/D+ Pony Club badge and proud]
king shop on his bicycle...walm said:
spookly said:
I don't take a vehicle onto public road that I know cannot get up to the speed limit and will definitely inconvenience others.
So do you equally condemn:- Caravanists.
- Anyone with a trailer.
- Classic cars.
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit.
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types.
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work.
Or is it just people on really narrow leisure vehicles that even a sub-par driver can overtake without much hassle?
- Anyone with a trailer. - Not really on the same level is it... as above
- Classic cars. - Not even close to being as slow. Steam powered cars are faster than cyclists
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit. - Still nowhere near as slow as cyclists, but if they are capable of the speed limit then yes, it would be nice if they would speed up a bit
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car. - Bet it would still do the speed limit.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types. If they are crossing the road, or have to walk on it because of an absence of footpaths then fine
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work. Fine, they are crossing the road not staying on it.
You seem to struggling with the gist of this, maybe this will help:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Need to be on the road & getting in the way = perfectly fine [tractors, road repair crews, caravans, people crossing the road, some pedestrians, cyclists using roads for travel etc]
Don't *need* to be on the road & getting in the way = annoying [cycling as a hobby, horses]
Would you happily make a conscious choice to take something far slower than other road users onto a road, cause them inconvenience, and not even feel a tinge embarrassed? I wouldn't.
If I *needed* to then I would do my best to get out of the way, and pull over frequently to let traffic pass.
If I didn't *need* to then I would not do it at all.
HTH
Finlandia said:
Conscript said:
Finlandia said:
Conscript said:
walm said:
WinstonWolf said:
You forgot horses, I bet he hates horses using *his* road too
He already mentioned them I think. It was a given. Everyone hates the jodphur-wearing brigade.How very dare they. [/D+ Pony Club badge and proud]
Horses are far more rare on the road than cyclists, and around these parts they very sensibly stick to bridleways and only use roads that are quiet and seem to avoid where possible. They also usually get their horse somewhere out of the way to let traffic pass as soon as possible.
Hobby cyclists seem to do the opposite.
That might be why most people don't complain as much about horses.
spookly said:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Is slowing motorists down the only negative consequence of recreational road use you consider to be of any importance? Or merely the only one that personally inconveniences you? otolith said:
spookly said:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Is slowing motorists down the only negative consequence of recreational road use you consider to be of any importance? Or merely the only one that personally inconveniences you? Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
spookly said:
otolith said:
spookly said:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Is slowing motorists down the only negative consequence of recreational road use you consider to be of any importance? Or merely the only one that personally inconveniences you? Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
spookly said:
Yes. So long as they aren't getting in the way I really don't mind what they do with themselves.
Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
As we've said, the levels of congestion caused by us car drivers is biblical, as is the lost time and money. Any thoughts on your contribution to that, or is it all everyone elses fault?Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
spookly said:
otolith said:
spookly said:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Is slowing motorists down the only negative consequence of recreational road use you consider to be of any importance? Or merely the only one that personally inconveniences you? Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
yonex said:
popeyewhite said:
To be fair it inconveniences the vast majority of motorists.
The vast majority of cyclists also being car and/or motorcycle owners 
spookly said:
- Caravanists - Only if they do not pull over from time to time to let people pass, and they are nowhere near as slow as cyclists
- Anyone with a trailer. - Not really on the same level is it... as above
- Classic cars. - Not even close to being as slow. Steam powered cars are faster than cyclists
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit. - Still nowhere near as slow as cyclists, but if they are capable of the speed limit then yes, it would be nice if they would speed up a bit
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car. - Bet it would still do the speed limit.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types. If they are crossing the road, or have to walk on it because of an absence of footpaths then fine
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work. Fine, they are crossing the road not staying on it.
You seem to struggling with the gist of this, maybe this will help:
No - you're struggling. You're just not being rational here, IMO!- Anyone with a trailer. - Not really on the same level is it... as above
- Classic cars. - Not even close to being as slow. Steam powered cars are faster than cyclists
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit. - Still nowhere near as slow as cyclists, but if they are capable of the speed limit then yes, it would be nice if they would speed up a bit
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car. - Bet it would still do the speed limit.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types. If they are crossing the road, or have to walk on it because of an absence of footpaths then fine
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work. Fine, they are crossing the road not staying on it.
You seem to struggling with the gist of this, maybe this will help:
Every single one of my examples "Don't *need* to be on the road & getting in the way".
Caravanists, ramblers, people pressing the button on a crossing etc... are all holding up traffic because of their leisure choices, and all of them hold people up.
They inconvenience you, yet for no reason you let them off.
OK they aren't as slow a cyclists but I bet you are stuck behind them for far longer, if you were being honest about the true extent of your hold ups.
Like almost all anti-cyclists you are simply prejudiced and inconsistent in your argument.
Because we aren't all selfish gits, the vast majority of us are capable of SHARING the roads without popping a blood vessel.
You seem to be able to do it with slightly faster leisure vehicles such as caravanists or people with trailers, yet again, those far easier to overtake draw your ire.
It's plain odd.
I don't hate all the tourists using the tube while I am trying to commute - we share that limited resource like (mostly) civilised humans.
(Unless they stand on the left on the escalators, then all bets are off.)
I am not more important than them.
My journey isn't some sacred pilgrimage about to save the world.
We're all just trying to get along.
Oh and FYI - every cyclist I know tries to avoid busy roads where they hold people up. Again, just like the horse riders.
We always aim for the quiet roads.
No one wants an impatient driver who thinks their journey is more important up their arse!
heebeegeetee said:
spookly said:
Yes. So long as they aren't getting in the way I really don't mind what they do with themselves.
Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
As we've said, the levels of congestion caused by us car drivers is biblical, as is the lost time and money. Any thoughts on your contribution to that, or is it all everyone elses fault?Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
My contribution is not significant, as I work from home 4 days a week and drive to the office outside rush hour. If I ever have to travel for work outside that routine it is usually by train or plane.
I have on occasion gone out for a ride/drive for the fun of it, but never when roads are busy as that would be anything but fun.
I could go all green and further curtail my travel, get a greener car, not take long haul foreign holidays etc, but where would be the fun in that.
I suspect I'm already a lot 'greener' than someone who commutes into London or through the South East. On the 1 day a week I go into the office I'll usually do 75mph all the way there and back. Green enough for me.
WinstonWolf said:
spookly said:
otolith said:
spookly said:
Don't need to be on the road & not getting in the way = no problem [cars/motorbikes for leisure etc]
Is slowing motorists down the only negative consequence of recreational road use you consider to be of any importance? Or merely the only one that personally inconveniences you? Recreational road use by other vehicles - other than increased fuel use, wear on roads, pollution.... what is there to be bothered by?
Also, a self limiting argument? Nobody goes for a drive for the fun of it when roads are too busy. If the roads are too congested then people driving for the fun of it won't enjoy it and will go home.
I almost always avoid travel to the office during rush hour, let alone consider going for a fun 'ride/drive' when there is traffic.
So, my impact on congestion for travel or pleasure is very limited. I choose not to live somewhere that congestion is often bad, and choose not to join in when it does occur.
walm said:
spookly said:
- Caravanists - Only if they do not pull over from time to time to let people pass, and they are nowhere near as slow as cyclists
- Anyone with a trailer. - Not really on the same level is it... as above
- Classic cars. - Not even close to being as slow. Steam powered cars are faster than cyclists
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit. - Still nowhere near as slow as cyclists, but if they are capable of the speed limit then yes, it would be nice if they would speed up a bit
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car. - Bet it would still do the speed limit.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types. If they are crossing the road, or have to walk on it because of an absence of footpaths then fine
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work. Fine, they are crossing the road not staying on it.
You seem to struggling with the gist of this, maybe this will help:
No - you're struggling. You're just not being rational here, IMO!- Anyone with a trailer. - Not really on the same level is it... as above
- Classic cars. - Not even close to being as slow. Steam powered cars are faster than cyclists
- Leisure drivers who choose to go a little under the limit. - Still nowhere near as slow as cyclists, but if they are capable of the speed limit then yes, it would be nice if they would speed up a bit
- The horrendous Yaris, the garage lent me as a "courtesy" car. - Bet it would still do the speed limit.
- Pedestrians. Particularly, those bearded rambler-types. If they are crossing the road, or have to walk on it because of an absence of footpaths then fine
- People using zebra/pelican/pegasus crossings when not going to work. Fine, they are crossing the road not staying on it.
You seem to struggling with the gist of this, maybe this will help:
Every single one of my examples "Don't *need* to be on the road & getting in the way".
Caravanists, ramblers, people pressing the button on a crossing etc... are all holding up traffic because of their leisure choices, and all of them hold people up.
They inconvenience you, yet for no reason you let them off.
OK they aren't as slow a cyclists but I bet you are stuck behind them for far longer, if you were being honest about the true extent of your hold ups.
Like almost all anti-cyclists you are simply prejudiced and inconsistent in your argument.
Because we aren't all selfish gits, the vast majority of us are capable of SHARING the roads without popping a blood vessel.
You seem to be able to do it with slightly faster leisure vehicles such as caravanists or people with trailers, yet again, those far easier to overtake draw your ire.
It's plain odd.
I don't hate all the tourists using the tube while I am trying to commute - we share that limited resource like (mostly) civilised humans.
(Unless they stand on the left on the escalators, then all bets are off.)
I am not more important than them.
My journey isn't some sacred pilgrimage about to save the world.
We're all just trying to get along.
Oh and FYI - every cyclist I know tries to avoid busy roads where they hold people up. Again, just like the horse riders.
We always aim for the quiet roads.
No one wants an impatient driver who thinks their journey is more important up their arse!
None of those examples, with the exception of horses and cyclists, have any trouble maintaining the speed limit appropriate to the vehicle. Unless they are driven particularly antisocially slowly they will not ever slow you down by more than about 10mph off the speed limit.
A cyclist going up a hill is likely to drop below 10mph... in an NSL on a straight road with good visibility, but traffic coming the other way, that would impede the following traffic by 40mph+, and very likely there would not be an opportunity to overtake.
An HGV on the same hill would probably still make it up the hill doing over 40mph, as would a caravan, a car with a trailer etc.
Even on the flat parts a cyclist is probably doing... what?... maybe 25mph, still a rolling roadblock causing traffic speed to drop by 25mph+ assuming there is an HGV behind them.
So my point is perfectly rational.... cyclists will hold you up far more than any of your other examples. Even then , those causing tailbacks should get off the road and allow other to pass periodically.
If cyclists actually did pull over to let traffic past people might not find them quite so annoying, but I've never seen it happen.
Edited by spookly on Tuesday 23 August 15:32
Storer said:
Unfortunately there are cyclist out there (just as in every walk of life) that prove the Darwin Theory. We seem to be expected to preserve their ability to remain part of the gene pool in spite of their desire to remove themselves from it!
Strapping you feet onto a bicycle that will not stand up when stationary, then proceeding to ride on a public highway, fits with the Darwin Theory. You are not racing (illegal on a public highway in/on any other vehicle) so there is no need to be strapped on.
I'm pretty sure Darwinian Theory refers to how species develop through the natural selection of small, inherited variations that increase the individual's ability to compete, survive, and reproduce.Strapping you feet onto a bicycle that will not stand up when stationary, then proceeding to ride on a public highway, fits with the Darwin Theory. You are not racing (illegal on a public highway in/on any other vehicle) so there is no need to be strapped on.
It's not really applicable to cyclists unless you mean that they have developed more powerful legs and that gives them some sort of mating advantage that will be propagated onto future generations?
spookly said:
walm said:
spookly said:
I recently drove a 50mph a road on a journey that was about 20 miles. The journey took almost an hour and I suspect my average speed was down nearer 20mph.
You're obviously pretty sharp.I am very jealous of these roads where they are 50mph limits for 20 solid miles and you don't get any slow drivers or tractors or villages. Do you have a link to this driving/cycling nirvana?
Slow drivers... sometimes, very rarely below about 40mph though. Tractors, not often on that road, but they are doing their job rather than just holding up traffic for fun so they are not half as annoying. Tractors also seem to pull over and let traffic go by if they are going any long distance, which they rarely are.
As for slow drivers rarely below 40mph - come and live in the south west, 40mph's seen as suicidal by the blue rinse brigade of East Devon. I've also found, by and large, that the reason there's a long snake of cars behind isn't because I haven't pulled over, it's because Doris is convinced overtaking is somehow illegal so stays on my back wheel regardless of how wide the road is and how far into the distance she can see. Once you get that, well it's hardly the cyclist's fault no-one can overtake, same as when you get a snake behind a caravan or HGV and the first three cars are content to Bimble along for mild after mile after mile at 25mph.
walm said:
popeyewhite said:
Like me. I'm all three. But I'm still inconvenienced.
I'm still inconvenienced. For sure.But since I recognise that that world doesn't spin around an axis with me at the centre, I don't mind waiting patiently.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff