Tesla P100D 0-60 in 2.5s

Tesla P100D 0-60 in 2.5s

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Mr GrimNasty

8,172 posts

169 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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RobDickinson said:
Oh 315 mile range also...
Not if you keep it in insane mode and keep doing 0-60 flat out at every opportunity it won't, not anywhere near.

And the batteries and components have to be in the right temperature range which means (a) the performance isn't always immediately accessible and (b) use it a few times and the fun will be over for a while as the power is cut.

Try and do a hot lap of the Nürburgring and see how long before it overheats and pegs back the power. Even if it lasted the lap the rest of the car is so compromised despite the impressive 0-60 book time, you'd get slaughtered by a warm Fiesta - suddenly not so brilliant!


RobDickinson

Original Poster:

31,343 posts

253 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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Because Nürburgring is so relevant to a wafty luxobarge customer..

J4CKO

41,287 posts

199 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
quotequote all
Mr GrimNasty said:
RobDickinson said:
Oh 315 mile range also...
Not if you keep it in insane mode and keep doing 0-60 flat out at every opportunity it won't, not anywhere near.

And the batteries and components have to be in the right temperature range which means (a) the performance isn't always immediately accessible and (b) use it a few times and the fun will be over for a while as the power is cut.

Try and do a hot lap of the Nürburgring and see how long before it overheats and pegs back the power. Even if it lasted the lap the rest of the car is so compromised despite the impressive 0-60 book time, you'd get slaughtered by a warm Fiesta - suddenly not so brilliant!
Yeah, I did 12 full bore acceleration runs in my petrol V8 earlier....

Point being, I dont think owners will do it very often, so the rest of the time it can just amble up to sixty in a stately 4 seconds and still demolish pretty much every other car on the planet, I would imagine that doing that is actually a bit uncomfortable and you need somewhere to do it safely.



It is incredible that two tonnes of car can accelerate to sixty in 2.5 seconds, mind boggling that it can do that.

I think that they can still get faster, be interesting to see how traction limited they are, I think the key is 4wd and the greater control you can have with an Electric motor, you have to rev an IC engined car to get it making power, that generates a massive amount of kinetic energy that you have to feed to the tyres, then back it off if grip is exhausted and slow all that stuff down, the electric motor has much less reciprocating mass and it is a quicker loop between traction and applying/limiting power, or that is my theory, am sure Max Torque could explain it a lot better.

The fact they have take what, 3 or 4 tenths out by adding more juice suggests there is more to come, I think sub 2 sec is possible, I remember as a kid hearing that a rallycross 6R4 could do sixty in 1.9 sec and had to check I had heard it correctly, Top Fuel dragsters do it in 0.2, Red Victor in 1 sec (may be under 1 sec now)

I see no reason why it couldnt dip under 2 sec, I also cant see any reason why anyone would need that, I think 4 sec is probably the fastest anyone needs to get to sixty, I know someone with a McLaren, his wife doesnt like it as she says it is uncomfortable, even my old Merc makes my missus complain if I boot it.


One thing that concerns me is if someone does that old trick of mixing up accelerator and brake, you know that old chap who plonks his Kia up on top of a railing or other street furniture, say 1200 kilos, sixty in 12 secs, 80 bhp and 2wd and causes carnage, what happens if 2 tonnes of Tesla with all that performance potential gets out of control, that is massive amount of energy, could say it about any car but these may attract those who arent quite on their game as, after all its a scaled up mobility scooter biggrin

RobDickinson

Original Poster:

31,343 posts

253 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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Give it a few years and the steering wheel/pedals will be an optional extra biggrin

giveitfish

4,030 posts

213 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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Mr GrimNasty said:
the rest of the car is so compromised despite the impressive 0-60 book time, you'd get slaughtered by a warm Fiesta - suddenly not so brilliant!
No, they handle too - as well as you'd could reasonably expect from a big family car.

Have a look at this from Matt Farah - https://youtu.be/slvgVpVCm1U say from 12:30

Evanivitch

19,804 posts

121 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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Mr GrimNasty said:
Even if it lasted the lap the rest of the car is so compromised despite the impressive 0-60 book time, you'd get slaughtered by a warm Fiesta - suddenly not so brilliant!
Compromised how? It's a high-end saloon car, not a hot hatch.

The Surveyor

7,576 posts

236 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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RobDickinson said:
Because Nürburgring is so relevant to a wafty luxobarge customer..
But getting to 60mph from a standstill in 2.5 seconds is relevant....?

The big problem I have with such publicity seeking headline figures is that it is completely at odds with the thing that will help establish Tesla as a mainstream manufacurer. Electric vehicle sales are primarily driven by the desire for environmentally friendly transport, if that can be done in a good looking quality product, with added silence and comfort then Tesla are on to a real winner. The ludicrous mode blunts the economy, it compromises the range, therefore it's at odds with the Tesla USP.

its impressive, but it's still utterly pointless in an eco car in the same way that decent fuel economy is not the prime factor when buying a supercar.

Evanivitch

19,804 posts

121 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
quotequote all
The Surveyor said:
But getting to 60mph from a standstill in 2.5 seconds is relevant....?

The big problem I have with such publicity seeking headline figures is that it is completely at odds with the thing that will help establish Tesla as a mainstream manufacurer. Electric vehicle sales are primarily driven by the desire for environmentally friendly transport, if that can be done in a good looking quality product, with added silence and comfort then Tesla are on to a real winner. The ludicrous mode blunts the economy, it compromises the range, therefore it's at odds with the Tesla USP.

its impressive, but it's still utterly pointless in an eco car in the same way that decent fuel economy is not the prime factor when buying a supercar.
That's in complete ignorance of how Tesla have marketed from the beginning. They're not trying to sell white goods, they're trying to sell cars that auto fans will buy.

Also, releases like this are part of their marketing momentum, something they have to maintain with limited products.


Edited by Evanivitch on Wednesday 24th August 00:06

Mave

8,208 posts

214 months

Tuesday 23rd August 2016
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But the thing is, it destroys the negative commentary about electric cars. "I'd buy an electric car but they're sooo sloops"... Err, no they're not. "I'd buy an electric car but they only do 50 miles"... Think again. I borrowed a colleague's tesla s when I was working in Norway last year, and it changed my perceptions of what an electric car could be. Range + performance. Sure there were compromises, but isn't that just life? Fundamentally a credible alternative to a 5 series or A6.

RobDickinson

Original Poster:

31,343 posts

253 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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The Surveyor said:
But getting to 60mph from a standstill in 2.5 seconds is relevant....?
yes, to the market they are selling to. Why else is there big AMG mercs or M5's

The Surveyor said:
The ludicrous mode blunts the economy, it compromises the range, therefore it's at odds with the Tesla USP.
No it doesnt. The upside of a larger battery is more power available at peak for performance, more energy overall for extended range, and faster recharge times. There is no downside (other than cost and weight).

The 4WD tesla with the same battery (P85D vs P85) actually has more range than the 2wd.

Sure if you mash the fast pedal all day it wont go as far but thats your choice.

The Surveyor said:
its impressive, but it's still utterly pointless in an eco car in the same way that decent fuel economy is not the prime factor when buying a supercar.
Thats not tesla's plan, they build performance saloon cars to compete in markets with BMW etc. That they are EV and environmentally more friendly is a bonus to the purchaser, they exist so people can have a great, fast, car and still be green.



Impasse

15,099 posts

240 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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Meh. Another milk float.

s3fella

10,524 posts

186 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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"Tesla customers who have ordered a P90D Ludicrous, but not taken delivery, can upgrade to the 100 kWh pack for $10,000. Existing P90D Ludicrous owners can also upgrade to a 100 kWh pack, but for $20,000, as their used 90 kWh pack will have to be recycled"

So if you already paid for a battery, it costs twice as much for the new one as if you don't have one already due to recycling costs!

And the future of motoring lies in these batteries I presume? How fking ridiculous. Green my arse

ex1

2,729 posts

235 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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The Surveyor said:
Electric vehicle sales are primarily driven by the desire for environmentally friendly transport.
I think its changing. We've had a Nissan Leaf for some time and the majority of EV owners I've spoken to weren't especially motived by saving the planet. Cost and new tech seems to be the main motivators. Almost everything about them is better than the equivalent ICE and they are a fraction of the cost to run.

I come out every morning to a full tank of fuel. The instant linear torque is much more usable than any ICE car and its generally a much more enjoyable experience for 95% of my driving.

I get the equivalent to 250mpg, my annual service costs are £99 and I will never have to buy another exhaust, cam belt, fuel pump, clutch, oil etc, etc

We can debate the V8 but I see no reason it can't sit alongside EV and help save whats left of the oil for track days etc.

Tesla are taking things to another level and forcing a very reluctant automotive industry to change and improve. This can only be a good thing and I wish them the best of luck.




RobDickinson

Original Poster:

31,343 posts

253 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
quotequote all
s3fella said:
So if you already paid for a battery, it costs twice as much for the new one as if you don't have one already due to recycling costs!
If you drive a bmw V6 how much do you think it would cost to send it back to bmw and get them rip it out and put in a v8 compared to specifying a v8 in the first place?

otolith

55,899 posts

203 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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I wonder if we'd see the same comments were we talking about a new M5?

Skyrat

1,185 posts

189 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
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Cupramax said:
The Spruce goose said:
this is amazing the future is here.
The future will be here when its 50k, not £135k wink mighty impressive though.
Its already here. The model 3 out here next year. 0-60 sub 4 seconds, and under £30k. I'd say that qualifies

Impasse

15,099 posts

240 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
quotequote all
Skyrat said:
Its already here. The model 3 out here next year. 0-60 sub 4 seconds, and under £30k. I'd say that qualifies
Umm, it's not here yet.

s3fella

10,524 posts

186 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
quotequote all
ex1 said:
Almost everything about them is better than the equivalent ICE and they are a fraction of the cost to run.
Sorry, but that is just wishful thinking and just not true. My wife has a Zoe, and even with the £10k dealer contribution and £5k from the Govt, once the battery is leased as well as the car, it is borderline as to whether is is any cheaper at all than an equivalent ICE car, something like a Clio diesel.
With the discounts, the Zoe is still only £20 less to lease than the clio and with £80 battery lease on top, that is equal to some 650 miles a month of diesel costs, more than the 500 available on the battery lease.

As for tech, it has sat nav, yes, and it has extra features but this is all to do with range anxiety so not required on the clio diesel. And as for doing everything better than an ICE car, well on cold winters mornings the Zoe is pretty miserable if you have to do a long run.

Don't get me wrong, we like it, and it is a novelty for sure, but when it will be chopped against an ice car before New Year, it's just not worth the worry about range and potentially increased costs for charging when out and about that are due soon.
Itch scratched, good fun at times and a talking point, but if it is the future of motoring, I hope it is a flipping long way off.



Wills2

22,669 posts

174 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
quotequote all
otolith said:
I wonder if we'd see the same comments were we talking about a new M5?
No, that will get well and truly trashed, ugly, too big, looks bloated, stuck on ipad style screen, crass blingy thing that I'm not interested in, M have lost their way, M died after the S65 V10 etc etc...

Until it's down at £10k and it will be become the darling of PH.

ex1

2,729 posts

235 months

Wednesday 24th August 2016
quotequote all
s3fella said:
ex1 said:
Almost everything about them is better than the equivalent ICE and they are a fraction of the cost to run.
Sorry, but that is just wishful thinking and just not true. My wife has a Zoe, and even with the £10k dealer contribution and £5k from the Govt, once the battery is leased as well as the car, it is borderline as to whether is is any cheaper at all than an equivalent ICE car, something like a Clio diesel.
With the discounts, the Zoe is still only £20 less to lease than the clio and with £80 battery lease on top, that is equal to some 650 miles a month of diesel costs, more than the 500 available on the battery lease.

As for tech, it has sat nav, yes, and it has extra features but this is all to do with range anxiety so not required on the clio diesel. And as for doing everything better than an ICE car, well on cold winters mornings the Zoe is pretty miserable if you have to do a long run.

Don't get me wrong, we like it, and it is a novelty for sure, but when it will be chopped against an ice car before New Year, it's just not worth the worry about range and potentially increased costs for charging when out and about that are due soon.
Itch scratched, good fun at times and a talking point, but if it is the future of motoring, I hope it is a flipping long way off.
A monthly lease isn't the way to go.

We paid £8.5k for a 2013 leaf with no monthly payments and it does 70 miles even in winter. My partner does 300 miles a week and gets free tank of fuel at every service station in the uk. From here on in I can't see it depreciating much different to the golf tdi we had before it. It's already saved us around £1500 over the tdi and is worth around £750 less than we paid for it. I can't see a cheaper way to run a car. Helps to live in the right part of country where there is good infrastructure but that will come along with much better range. No doubt the next Leaf will have 200+ mile range and the rest will soon follow.