RE: Ford Mustang outsells Audi TT!
Discussion
They are a lot cheaper in the US ,a 2016 model for £17,000 at a ford dealer
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang-V6-/152187724...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang-V6-/152187724...
Edited by leedsutd1 on Wednesday 24th August 16:29
Welshwonder said:
Krikkit said:
Hurrah! Good news for the used market too, another few years they'll be creeping down nicely into sensible money.
More than 400bhp for £35K? How much more sensible do you want?!
jamieduff1981 said:
tuffer said:
I don't see what all the fuss is about, every American car I have driven has been an utter turd or at least 10 years behind anything built in Europe. I can't believe people are falling over themselves to buy these things, the novelty will wear off quicker than the shine on the cheap plastic interior and they will be on the second hand market for peanuts.
That's only true if you prefer your cars engineered to remove any requirement for talent or opportunity for engagement, which admittedly, the Germans excel at. If you need your car to flatter your abilities, buy German.Best regards,
A TVR owner.
leef44 said:
+1
I've not driven one but love the idea of the simple mechanics and stonky V8 with American muscle car noise. Keeping it simple and selling at a lower price bracket. I think that's great news.
The fact that there are more of these sold than higher up model TT's is even better news. If this is what the consumer wants then this pushes the manufacturers more towards petrolhead-type cars.
I wish all the owners many enjoyable miles in their new Mustangs. If they (the cars) were a tad smaller (for our British roads) I would have bought one too.
Great that it is, I don't think the vast majority of people purchasing these are actually petrolheads. They see an affordable price tag, a very very good looking car and that's enough for most people. Superficial types will LOVE the Mustang. I can guarantee many of them don't know what oversteer means.I've not driven one but love the idea of the simple mechanics and stonky V8 with American muscle car noise. Keeping it simple and selling at a lower price bracket. I think that's great news.
The fact that there are more of these sold than higher up model TT's is even better news. If this is what the consumer wants then this pushes the manufacturers more towards petrolhead-type cars.
I wish all the owners many enjoyable miles in their new Mustangs. If they (the cars) were a tad smaller (for our British roads) I would have bought one too.
Not really a difficult choice over a TT and an F-type is vastly more expensive.
It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
Howebver, I still don't like this Mustang and still don't want a car I am likely to see every day.
It no longer has that special cachet that the imports had, it's just mainstream and no more "muscle car" than the last M3 was. they used to be big but modern cars have grown.
It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
Howebver, I still don't like this Mustang and still don't want a car I am likely to see every day.
It no longer has that special cachet that the imports had, it's just mainstream and no more "muscle car" than the last M3 was. they used to be big but modern cars have grown.
leedsutd1 said:
They are a lot cheaper in the US ,a 2016 model for £17,000 at a ford dealer
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang-V6-/152187724...
What's the point of that post?http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Mustang-V6-/152187724...
Edited by leedsutd1 on Wednesday 24th August 16:29
We know they are cheaper in America. It's a different country, different laws, currency, regulations, demand.
It's like posting a five bed Villa in Florida and saying houses are cheaper than in Watford.
Daft.
tuffer said:
I would take a TVR over a Mustang any day. I am not talking about the handling characteristics or driver aids, I am talking about the build quality. I have not driven this latest incarnation but I have driven enough US cars over the years on regular business trips to the USA to know what they are like and what to expect.
I think you may be selling it short in that regard then. This is a car made for the worldwide market, not like previous Mustangs that were grey imports, and as such, Ford has had to up the quality of things like the interior to suit European buyers who are used to German interior quality.It's not going to be 7-Series level, but I'm sure it exceeds the US-only models you may have driven before. I've heard no real complaints about the interior, something about the steering wheel not being that nice but apart from that..
Nothing wrong with the build quality on my 2005 Mustang.
I see far worse in European cars but then I'm actually more interested in engine and handling than whether the plastic is nice to touch.
The Mustang has got fairly good over the years and rental spec cars are not really a fair parameter as European rental cars are usually low spec tat too.
Bear in mind that if you had Germanic standards of quality, the car would be £10k more and these cars are designed down to a price, not up to an aspiration.
I see far worse in European cars but then I'm actually more interested in engine and handling than whether the plastic is nice to touch.
The Mustang has got fairly good over the years and rental spec cars are not really a fair parameter as European rental cars are usually low spec tat too.
Bear in mind that if you had Germanic standards of quality, the car would be £10k more and these cars are designed down to a price, not up to an aspiration.
LuS1fer said:
Not really a difficult choice over a TT and an F-type is vastly more expensive.
It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
It is but there is a big difference between the Capri and the Mustang. When the capri was new it wasn't competing with the likes of Audi and BMW. At the time the german brands were much more expensive and not anything like as mainstream as they are now. Owning a new Ford coupe back in the 70s and 80s was quite cool and was the kind of thing that might impress the neighbours, these days however nothing with a Blue oval on it is going to impress anyone except perhaps a petrolhead. This is the reason why cars like the Cougar and probe were such dismal failures. Coupes are all about image and Ford just doesn't have it.It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
For this reason I disagree competely with this comment:
AMGJocky said:
Great that it is, I don't think the vast majority of people purchasing these are actually petrolheads. They see an affordable price tag, a very very good looking car and that's enough for most people. Superficial types will LOVE the Mustang. I can guarantee many of them don't know what oversteer means.
I think that superficial types will want an Audi or a BMW and if they haven't got the money they'd rather buy a second hand one rather than a new Ford, possibly the reason why used Audi values are so strong. The fact that 70% of Mustangs sold are the V8 backs this up I think as well as the fact that many of the Audi TTs sold are diesels. Superficial people care about the badge and the image, not the driving experience.My two-pennies worth:
I have an Ecoboost auto, and although I'd dearly love a V8 it's not practical for me. I bought it as a 17 day old car on the 17th March with 1,800 miles and it's now clocked 11,600, so a sub-20mph car does not make sense because of the fuel bill (I average just over 2,000 miles a month). The build-quality is fine-as good as my last Audi, Subaru and Volvo, nothing's gone wrong and with the upgraded infotainment and parking sensors it has all the kit I'd ever want. It's comfortable, quiet, as fast as I'd reasonably want and the boot's big enough for my work stuff.
It does not compare to the Chimaera I had for 6 years or the M3 that followed it, but they were low milage weekend cars. The TVR was a laugh but tended to go wrong and build quality was crap. THe M3 was stunning, a better car than the Mustang, but it bloody well should have been (and although I bought it when 6 years old) its new price was £30,000 more than the Ford! And the Ford's 1st service was only £137, a lot less than the £450 annual bill for the TVR or what BMW would charge.
Mustangs are often called "muscle cars", so how do we comare a 315bhp 4 pot to a wheezy 200bhp 8 pot from not too long ago? 0-60 in just over 5 seconds is quick and only about 0.5 seconds slower than the new 5.0l. Two weeks ago I was away with friends in North Yorkshire and had a chance to compare the Mustang to my mate's TTs quattro. On the narrow twisting roads the TT would piss all over the Mustang, its smaller, lighter and much more agile and the Mustang by comparison is a barge. But on the motorway and decent A roads its first class. I get about 30mpg from it and the only gripe is parking it, but then the reversing camera makes up for that.
I bought the Mustang with my own money and given the same choice after 5 months of ownership I'd do it again.
I have an Ecoboost auto, and although I'd dearly love a V8 it's not practical for me. I bought it as a 17 day old car on the 17th March with 1,800 miles and it's now clocked 11,600, so a sub-20mph car does not make sense because of the fuel bill (I average just over 2,000 miles a month). The build-quality is fine-as good as my last Audi, Subaru and Volvo, nothing's gone wrong and with the upgraded infotainment and parking sensors it has all the kit I'd ever want. It's comfortable, quiet, as fast as I'd reasonably want and the boot's big enough for my work stuff.
It does not compare to the Chimaera I had for 6 years or the M3 that followed it, but they were low milage weekend cars. The TVR was a laugh but tended to go wrong and build quality was crap. THe M3 was stunning, a better car than the Mustang, but it bloody well should have been (and although I bought it when 6 years old) its new price was £30,000 more than the Ford! And the Ford's 1st service was only £137, a lot less than the £450 annual bill for the TVR or what BMW would charge.
Mustangs are often called "muscle cars", so how do we comare a 315bhp 4 pot to a wheezy 200bhp 8 pot from not too long ago? 0-60 in just over 5 seconds is quick and only about 0.5 seconds slower than the new 5.0l. Two weeks ago I was away with friends in North Yorkshire and had a chance to compare the Mustang to my mate's TTs quattro. On the narrow twisting roads the TT would piss all over the Mustang, its smaller, lighter and much more agile and the Mustang by comparison is a barge. But on the motorway and decent A roads its first class. I get about 30mpg from it and the only gripe is parking it, but then the reversing camera makes up for that.
I bought the Mustang with my own money and given the same choice after 5 months of ownership I'd do it again.
I pushed part of the dashboard into the back of the rest of the dashboard in my old mans Audi TT. All the writing on the buttons has worn off on said TT, the seat adjuster doesn't work either. It's been hugely unreliable also.
It's great that Ford are sending over these higher quality products.
It's great that Ford are sending over these higher quality products.
Devil2575 said:
LuS1fer said:
Not really a difficult choice over a TT and an F-type is vastly more expensive.
It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
It is but there is a big difference between the Capri and the Mustang. When the capri was new it wasn't competing with the likes of Audi and BMW. At the time the german brands were much more expensive and not anything like as mainstream as they are now. Owning a new Ford coupe back in the 70s and 80s was quite cool and was the kind of thing that might impress the neighbours, these days however nothing with a Blue oval on it is going to impress anyone except perhaps a petrolhead. This is the reason why cars like the Cougar and probe were such dismal failures. Coupes are all about image and Ford just doesn't have it.It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
For this reason I disagree completely with this comment:
Back in the 80s the Capri sold on great value.
A 1984 test had a 2.8i Special at £9500. By way of competition, we had
Alfa GTV 2000 - 9365 (GTV6 was 11700)
Audi GT Coupe at 9514
BMW didn't have much and a 323 was over £10k
Prelude Executive was 8500
Lancia Coupe Volumex 8315
RX7 - 10500
Starion 12499
Silvia ZX 9000
924 Coupe 11600 (944 was over £16k)
Fuego Turbo 9300
Supra 2.8i 11500
Scirocco Storm 9800
I understand your point about the current infatuation with German "quality" but think you may be part of the problem so far as that illusion goes. In 1984, the coupe was on the wane, in favour of hot hatches - a 5 GT Turbo was £6150 and a 205 GTI 6400 and a Golf GTI 8000.
However, your assertion that people are going to be more impressed by a BMW/audi over a Mustang is, frankly, hilarious.
The Cougar and Probe failed because coupes were becoming unpopular and were fairly humdrum appliances.
The tide has turned and coupes are now cool - the Americans have taken the sector and pretty much owned it with power hikes and improvements in handling.
As for "petrolheads", people still think Mustangs are expensive cars and still wildly overvalue them when out in public.
Devil2575 said:
LuS1fer said:
Not really a difficult choice over a TT and an F-type is vastly more expensive.
It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
It is but there is a big difference between the Capri and the Mustang. When the capri was new it wasn't competing with the likes of Audi and BMW. At the time the german brands were much more expensive and not anything like as mainstream as they are now. Owning a new Ford coupe back in the 70s and 80s was quite cool and was the kind of thing that might impress the neighbours, these days however nothing with a Blue oval on it is going to impress anyone except perhaps a petrolhead. This is the reason why cars like the Cougar and probe were such dismal failures. Coupes are all about image and Ford just doesn't have it.It's really a modern Capri 2.8i which also sold a lot despite it's architecture and lack of economy.
I've a feeling they might be trying to quietly position it as a sub-brand.
The reason that the Probe and Cougar weren't great sellers was that they weren't great cars, merely re-bodied Mondeos that were ultimately more compromised than the cars on which they were based.
What Ford could have done for the Euro market is to give us a new iteration of the Ford coupe you conveniently overlooked.
The Puma.
However, I understand the rationale that says build a RHD Mustang rather than design a Fiesta-based coupe from the ground up.
Especially as the new "Puma" would have little way of being as much better than an ST as the 1.7 VCT was better than a Zetec or Zetec S back in the day.
So Mustang it is, and may it be the car that "opens the door" for other manufacturers to sell their domestic models here.
I had hoped for rafts of Camaros and Corvettes when Chevy replaced Daewoo dealers... alas not.
Perhaps this time...
Evilex said:
I can't recall if the 'Stang actually has a blue oval on the boot lid at all? It has silver ponies...
I've a feeling they might be trying to quietly position it as a sub-brand.
The reason that the Probe and Cougar weren't great sellers was that they weren't great cars, merely re-bodied Mondeos that were ultimately more compromised than the cars on which they were based.
What Ford could have done for the Euro market is to give us a new iteration of the Ford coupe you conveniently overlooked.
The Puma.
However, I understand the rationale that says build a RHD Mustang rather than design a Fiesta-based coupe from the ground up.
Especially as the new "Puma" would have little way of being as much better than an ST as the 1.7 VCT was better than a Zetec or Zetec S back in the day.
So Mustang it is, and may it be the car that "opens the door" for other manufacturers to sell their domestic models here.
I had hoped for rafts of Camaros and Corvettes when Chevy replaced Daewoo dealers... alas not.
Perhaps this time...
The Capri was merely a rebodied Cortina and wasn't really a great car. Sure the big engined cars had oversteer on tap and plenty of power but the vast majority sold had small 4 pots.I've a feeling they might be trying to quietly position it as a sub-brand.
The reason that the Probe and Cougar weren't great sellers was that they weren't great cars, merely re-bodied Mondeos that were ultimately more compromised than the cars on which they were based.
What Ford could have done for the Euro market is to give us a new iteration of the Ford coupe you conveniently overlooked.
The Puma.
However, I understand the rationale that says build a RHD Mustang rather than design a Fiesta-based coupe from the ground up.
Especially as the new "Puma" would have little way of being as much better than an ST as the 1.7 VCT was better than a Zetec or Zetec S back in the day.
So Mustang it is, and may it be the car that "opens the door" for other manufacturers to sell their domestic models here.
I had hoped for rafts of Camaros and Corvettes when Chevy replaced Daewoo dealers... alas not.
Perhaps this time...
The Puma was a bit different in that it was cheap and so again not competing with the Germans but it still didn't stand the test of time did it. The Cougar and Probe after all came out when the 3 series was really taking off and for the same price as a V6 model you could get a 318 coupe. No contest in the badge stakes.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff