RE: Ford Mustang outsells Audi TT!
Discussion
Dave Hedgehog said:
996TT02 said:
Matt Bird said:
Not rational because it officially does 20mpg, is still quite big in the UK and something like a TT (dare I say it) probably covers more bases.
If you are into a somewhat non sensible car - and one with quite a few ponies - 20mpg or otherwise is not that relevant, it's still reasonable.As far as size goes - 4.78m for the Mustang, 4.63m for the BMW 4 series - 15cm in it - and no-one calls the BMW "still quite big in the UK".
Incidentally the BMW 6 series is 4.89m long - and not too many comments about "way too big for the UK" - despite it being 11cm longer than the Mustang.
All cars have been getting larger mostly due to safety regs and customer expectations so Euros are far from the tiddlers they once used to be, and Yanks don't need to get any larger.
Matt
PorkInsider said:
MustardCutter said:
I'm pretty sure I could come up with some criteria in the same vein as used to write this headline to show I can run faster than Usain Bolt.
Yup.It's piss-boiling click-bait, isn't it.
Formula: compare Mustang sales with TT sales. Include all Mustang sales and exclude all TT sales except for the very top model currently available.
I honestly think that PH's journalism is about as poor as any on the 'net.
They should just go with the 'Unbelievable moment when...' b
ks and be done with it, like all the other click-baiters.Granted, it's not the most serious stat-derived story in the world but it seemed an interesting one to draw people's attention to. I'd be very surprised if this many Mustangs continued to be sold, so let's celebrate it while we can.
And the TT RS is on sale in a few months, so that should redress the balance
Matt
Matt Bird said:
I meant as a sports car! Of course there are vehicles bigger than the Mustang around. I'm a big fan of the car but it does feel wide on smaller British roads and we tend to favour our 250hp+ sports cars to be more agile. Just my personal opinion. I hope it continues to do well, nice to see some variety.
Matt
It's almost exactly the same width as the Jaguar F-typeMatt
Is this not a British sports car?
chrispj said:
Devil2575 said:
No one has said to your face "it's only a Ford", but people do think like that. I work with a lot of young graduates and I've heard those exact words.
People are stupid, even graduates these days. Ignore them, who cares what they think if they are so superficial.Edited by Devil2575 on Friday 26th August 18:39
Easy. Because the Aston is so bloody boring, that's why.
Matt Bird said:
I meant as a sports car! Of course there are vehicles bigger than the Mustang around. I'm a big fan of the car but it does feel wide on smaller British roads and we tend to favour our 250hp+ sports cars to be more agile. Just my personal opinion. I hope it continues to do well, nice to see some variety.
Matt
M3 is hardly small, RS6 is the size of a ship Matt
The build quality is an issue, I don't mean the interior plastics, but the haphazard undersealing carried out in Zeebrugge by a sub contractor which leaves the majority of the underside still vulnerable, the bonnet that wobbles and shakes when you go over the legal limit, the leather seats that crack and craze after a few thousand miles, the iffy panel alignment etc. All of these problems are well documented on forums not made up. I wouldn't put up with this in a £10k Dacia.
Suspect most of those couple thousand Mustangs sold in the UK reside in Hertfordshire, which makes me kind of sad to live in Hertfordshire.
Furthermore, of the majority new UK Mustangs that reside in Hertfordshire (I've totally researched the numbers to back these assertions up), literally one of those is a V8.
The article makes a (valid) comparison to the TT. I dislike TTs and don't mind Mustangs, and yet somehow I have a greater sense of despair when seeing a Brit driving a non-V8 Mustang than I do seeing them driving a diesel TT.
Part of me thinks someone driving a non-V8 Mustang actually has a reasonable likelihood of being a less vile human being than a diesel TT driver. Another (not insignificant) part of me thinks said non-V8 Mustang driver should be executed by firing squad, perhaps infront of their family as a 'lesson' on the off-chance that they were considering one themselves.
Ofcourse, being a total hypocrite, I'd quite happily daily a non-V8 Mustang were one given to me, perhaps as the result of winning a competition or overcoming my disgust and fulfilling the sexual needs of a monied but lonely elderly widow.
Furthermore, of the majority new UK Mustangs that reside in Hertfordshire (I've totally researched the numbers to back these assertions up), literally one of those is a V8.
The article makes a (valid) comparison to the TT. I dislike TTs and don't mind Mustangs, and yet somehow I have a greater sense of despair when seeing a Brit driving a non-V8 Mustang than I do seeing them driving a diesel TT.
Part of me thinks someone driving a non-V8 Mustang actually has a reasonable likelihood of being a less vile human being than a diesel TT driver. Another (not insignificant) part of me thinks said non-V8 Mustang driver should be executed by firing squad, perhaps infront of their family as a 'lesson' on the off-chance that they were considering one themselves.
Ofcourse, being a total hypocrite, I'd quite happily daily a non-V8 Mustang were one given to me, perhaps as the result of winning a competition or overcoming my disgust and fulfilling the sexual needs of a monied but lonely elderly widow.
daveofedinburgh said:
Suspect most of those couple thousand Mustangs sold in the UK reside in Hertfordshire, which makes me kind of sad to live in Hertfordshire.
Furthermore, of the majority new UK Mustangs that reside in Hertfordshire (I've totally researched the numbers to back these assertions up), literally one of those is a V8.
The article makes a (valid) comparison to the TT. I dislike TTs and don't mind Mustangs, and yet somehow I have a greater sense of despair when seeing a Brit driving a non-V8 Mustang than I do seeing them driving a diesel TT.
Part of me thinks someone driving a non-V8 Mustang actually has a reasonable likelihood of being a less vile human being than a diesel TT driver. Another (not insignificant) part of me thinks said non-V8 Mustang driver should be executed by firing squad, perhaps infront of their family as a 'lesson' on the off-chance that they were considering one themselves.
Ofcourse, being a total hypocrite, I'd quite happily daily a non-V8 Mustang were one given to me, perhaps as the result of winning a competition or overcoming my disgust and fulfilling the sexual needs of a monied but lonely elderly widow.
Don't get this, the base engine is a slightly detained focus RS Unit, hardly a dollop of a lump and 70% of stang sold so far are v8 anyway Furthermore, of the majority new UK Mustangs that reside in Hertfordshire (I've totally researched the numbers to back these assertions up), literally one of those is a V8.
The article makes a (valid) comparison to the TT. I dislike TTs and don't mind Mustangs, and yet somehow I have a greater sense of despair when seeing a Brit driving a non-V8 Mustang than I do seeing them driving a diesel TT.
Part of me thinks someone driving a non-V8 Mustang actually has a reasonable likelihood of being a less vile human being than a diesel TT driver. Another (not insignificant) part of me thinks said non-V8 Mustang driver should be executed by firing squad, perhaps infront of their family as a 'lesson' on the off-chance that they were considering one themselves.
Ofcourse, being a total hypocrite, I'd quite happily daily a non-V8 Mustang were one given to me, perhaps as the result of winning a competition or overcoming my disgust and fulfilling the sexual needs of a monied but lonely elderly widow.
skyrover said:
Merc 450 said:
I have a 300+ hp diesel Audi A6 estate with 7 speed flappy paddles 0_60 in 5 seconds and 163mph top end, I would love the v8 mustang for the sound and the looks but on paper it's nowhere near as quick as the Audi. I wonder if the Mrs would let me keep the Audi for the Rottweiler and get a mustang for fun (doubt it
)
Mustang 0-60 and 1/4 mile times)EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 5.6 sec 14.0 sec @ 102 mph Car and Driver
EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 6.3 sec 14.5 sec @ 98 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.9 sec @ 112 mph Car and Driver
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.6 sec 12.9 sec @ 110 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.7 sec 13.2 sec @ 109.8 mph Road & Track
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 117 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.1 sec 12.4 sec @ 117.8 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.2 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.1 sec @ 119.6 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 119 mph Motor Week
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 117.9 mph Road & Track
It's quite a lot faster than your Audi
Edited by skyrover on Friday 26th August 22:53
What are the equivalent US mag figures for something similar to the Audi?
leef44 said:
LuS1fer said:
I can't really take you seriously. if you think you're not part of the problem because "it's just a Ford", there is no point arguing about it.
People LEASE BMWs rather than buy them.
I agree there must be an imagined status as none would sell on looks or performance, bar the M4.
Funnily enough, I do a lot of car shows and people do love and know their Mustangs and no matter how many times you mention it is a Ford, no-one seems to care nor does it alter their perception, nor do they care about any BMW (or even 911) parked next to it.
That said, the new Mustang is very Audi-ish and I have seen many and thought it an A5, from a distance. Shame.
By coupes, I didn't mean two door saloons like BMW make, it was always hard to tell them apart. I mean nobody ever called a 2 door Cortina a coupe, that was a German thing. If it hadn't been for the M3, I doubt anyone would notice.
Then we had the pseudo-coupe like the Scirocco which is just a hatchback.
You are of course right that most of these "aspirational" coupes have tractor engines and I shudder to think that Ford might suddenly come over all mainstream sales and plonk one in.
Americans have owned the sector because, not for one second have they contemplated fitting a diesel, not for one second have they lay down and rolled in laurels and let the product become stagnant. What is amazing is that the Mustang has continued to sell in huge numbers in the US, even when it was a crappy little base spec V6, even when they tried to replace it with the Probe, even when the base v8, in 2005, produced a reasonable 300hp, they evolved and increased the power and capacity. The Mustang single-handedly brought back the Challenger and the Camaro from the dead.
In Europe, the TT has sold from a high of around 38000 cars in 07 to 22000 cars in 2015. In 205, the Mustang only sold just under 5000 units in its first year.
However, in the US, the TT managed 1167 in the US while the Mustang sold 122,000 cars in 2015 (a high of 160,000 cars in 2006) which is not bad for a car with a base engine of 3.7 litres making 305hp. Even the Camaro only managed 77000 in the US in 2015.
By comparison, BMW sold 140,000 3 and 4 series cars in the US - that's for every model though - coupe, sedan, convertible etc.
Finally, it "owns the sector" in terms of what you get for your money - £37k gets you the square root of sod all in the BMW line-up.
I also think people fool themselves - i don't know of anyone who is impressed by anyone having a BMW or an Audi - they seem to fool themselves that others are impressed - but people generally assume they are leased or on PCP, regardless.
Agreed. It just feels so much cooler owning a V8 Mustang than a 2 litre diesel BMWPeople LEASE BMWs rather than buy them.
I agree there must be an imagined status as none would sell on looks or performance, bar the M4.
Funnily enough, I do a lot of car shows and people do love and know their Mustangs and no matter how many times you mention it is a Ford, no-one seems to care nor does it alter their perception, nor do they care about any BMW (or even 911) parked next to it.
That said, the new Mustang is very Audi-ish and I have seen many and thought it an A5, from a distance. Shame.
By coupes, I didn't mean two door saloons like BMW make, it was always hard to tell them apart. I mean nobody ever called a 2 door Cortina a coupe, that was a German thing. If it hadn't been for the M3, I doubt anyone would notice.
Then we had the pseudo-coupe like the Scirocco which is just a hatchback.
You are of course right that most of these "aspirational" coupes have tractor engines and I shudder to think that Ford might suddenly come over all mainstream sales and plonk one in.
Americans have owned the sector because, not for one second have they contemplated fitting a diesel, not for one second have they lay down and rolled in laurels and let the product become stagnant. What is amazing is that the Mustang has continued to sell in huge numbers in the US, even when it was a crappy little base spec V6, even when they tried to replace it with the Probe, even when the base v8, in 2005, produced a reasonable 300hp, they evolved and increased the power and capacity. The Mustang single-handedly brought back the Challenger and the Camaro from the dead.
In Europe, the TT has sold from a high of around 38000 cars in 07 to 22000 cars in 2015. In 205, the Mustang only sold just under 5000 units in its first year.
However, in the US, the TT managed 1167 in the US while the Mustang sold 122,000 cars in 2015 (a high of 160,000 cars in 2006) which is not bad for a car with a base engine of 3.7 litres making 305hp. Even the Camaro only managed 77000 in the US in 2015.
By comparison, BMW sold 140,000 3 and 4 series cars in the US - that's for every model though - coupe, sedan, convertible etc.
Finally, it "owns the sector" in terms of what you get for your money - £37k gets you the square root of sod all in the BMW line-up.
I also think people fool themselves - i don't know of anyone who is impressed by anyone having a BMW or an Audi - they seem to fool themselves that others are impressed - but people generally assume they are leased or on PCP, regardless.
(Bmw 3 SERIES 320d M Sport 4dr Step Auto Diesel Saloon £34k, with options can climb to £48k)
The other thing on the last bit is that if you are buying with your own cash, in reality, you can get a 140, 240 or even 340 for less than that 34k. Not a bent eight, but no slower and no hassles around pointless waiting lists either.
I did think about a V8 for a little while, but it doesn't work for me for not too dissimilar reasons.
DukeDickson said:
skyrover said:
Merc 450 said:
I have a 300+ hp diesel Audi A6 estate with 7 speed flappy paddles 0_60 in 5 seconds and 163mph top end, I would love the v8 mustang for the sound and the looks but on paper it's nowhere near as quick as the Audi. I wonder if the Mrs would let me keep the Audi for the Rottweiler and get a mustang for fun (doubt it)
Mustang 0-60 and 1/4 mile times)EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 5.6 sec 14.0 sec @ 102 mph Car and Driver
EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 6.3 sec 14.5 sec @ 98 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.9 sec @ 112 mph Car and Driver
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.6 sec 12.9 sec @ 110 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.7 sec 13.2 sec @ 109.8 mph Road & Track
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 117 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.1 sec 12.4 sec @ 117.8 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.2 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.1 sec @ 119.6 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 119 mph Motor Week
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 117.9 mph Road & Track
It's quite a lot faster than your Audi
Edited by skyrover on Friday 26th August 22:53
What are the equivalent US mag figures for something similar to the Audi?
3.0 TDI Prestige Quattro Sedan AWD 8A 5.4 sec 14.2 sec @ 94.8 mph Motor Trend
I had no intention or need for a second car and certainly not a new one.
Every time I crossed the giant car park at Westfield on the way to work I would play what car would I like. There were no winners, even if there were top model BMWs or Porsche around.
Nothing floated my boat.
Then the chance of a Mustang appeared.
I love mine and have enjoyed all 7000 miles in 7 months of ownership.
Every time I crossed the giant car park at Westfield on the way to work I would play what car would I like. There were no winners, even if there were top model BMWs or Porsche around.
Nothing floated my boat.
Then the chance of a Mustang appeared.
I love mine and have enjoyed all 7000 miles in 7 months of ownership.
DukeDickson said:
Most of the Germans aren't bought, they're company cars & whatever the wrongs are, a diesel TT, or a 2l petrol is probably a much better bet for 20k pa or more than either Mustang if you're paying the lease + tax & doing a fair few
I love all the statements on PH about how people buy/get certain cars. Are there really enough jobs that offer company cars to account for all the German diesel cars sold? Given that most new Audis and BMWs have a diesel engine I very much doubt it. I think many people on PH fail to recognise that for the majority of people the diesel version is the desirable engine choice. I know plenty of people who have diesel Audis and VWs that are not company cars. I drive a 1.8 Petrol and a 1.8 diesel and for the purpose of A to B driving the diesel is simply better.
There is hope for petrol heads!
I saw a few on hol in devon last month. 1 went past a car show we stopped to look at it was blue and def the v8, the other was red and in the show. The bonnet was down so it was obviously a 2.3 must of been embarrised to have a mustang with a eco engine in.
Think there great for the money and a nice alternative to euro 4 pot crap.
I saw a few on hol in devon last month. 1 went past a car show we stopped to look at it was blue and def the v8, the other was red and in the show. The bonnet was down so it was obviously a 2.3 must of been embarrised to have a mustang with a eco engine in.
Think there great for the money and a nice alternative to euro 4 pot crap.
skyrover said:
3.0 TDI Prestige Quattro Sedan AWD 8A 5.1 sec 13.9 sec @ 98 mph Car and Driver
3.0 TDI Prestige Quattro Sedan AWD 8A 5.4 sec 14.2 sec @ 94.8 mph Motor Trend
So similar performance to the ecoboost and not even close to a GT!3.0 TDI Prestige Quattro Sedan AWD 8A 5.4 sec 14.2 sec @ 94.8 mph Motor Trend
Though why performance of a diesel is being compared I have no idea, even if the GT was slower I'd still take the GT because diesel engines sound absolute crap, people say tractor for good reason. The V8 sounds amazing and the noise wins me over everytime.
Devil2575 said:
leef44 said:
Agreed. It just feels so much cooler owning a V8 Mustang than a 2 litre diesel BMW
(Bmw 3 SERIES 320d M Sport 4dr Step Auto Diesel Saloon £34k, with options can climb to £48k)
Yes but you can get a 340i M sport 4dr for £38k and a 330i M sport for £35k. So what about options, you can spec any car up if you tick lots of boxes on the order form. Also why pick the auto? Is the V8 Mustang you are comparing it too an auto?(Bmw 3 SERIES 320d M Sport 4dr Step Auto Diesel Saloon £34k, with options can climb to £48k)
Yes BMWs are more expensive than Fords, but to suggest that for the price of a V8 Mustang you'd be driving a 2 litre diesel is just rubbish.
I think I would still pay £4k more and go for a V8 Mustang with 410bhp. I think I could live with the badge
skyrover said:
Merc 450 said:
I have a 300+ hp diesel Audi A6 estate with 7 speed flappy paddles 0_60 in 5 seconds and 163mph top end, I would love the v8 mustang for the sound and the looks but on paper it's nowhere near as quick as the Audi. I wonder if the Mrs would let me keep the Audi for the Rottweiler and get a mustang for fun (doubt it)
Mustang 0-60 and 1/4 mile times)EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 5.6 sec 14.0 sec @ 102 mph Car and Driver
EcoBoost Premium Fastback RWD 6M 6.3 sec 14.5 sec @ 98 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.9 sec @ 112 mph Car and Driver
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.6 sec 12.9 sec @ 110 mph Motor Trend
GT Premium Fastback RWD 6M 4.7 sec 13.2 sec @ 109.8 mph Road & Track
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 117 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.3 sec 12.5 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350 Fastback RWD 6M 4.1 sec 12.4 sec @ 117.8 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.2 sec @ 119 mph Car and Driver
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 3.9 sec 12.1 sec @ 119.6 mph Motor Trend
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 119 mph Motor Week
Shelby GT350R Fastback RWD 6M 4.0 sec 12.3 sec @ 117.9 mph Road & Track
It's quite a lot faster than your Audi
Edited by skyrover on Friday 26th August 22:53
Wouldn't put me off though the audi is the ultimate q car (surprises everything it passes) i prefer the louder V8's like my old cerbera
Both would be the best plan and that grey one is the same colour as the Audi
Oh and if we are not comparing like with like Audi do the 530hp RS6 and the 330hp bi turbo diesel as well
Or if you haven't got a dog the 702hp RS7
Even my 300hp 3 litre oil burner sounds good with the exhaust turned up in flappy paddle mode
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