Cars types or manufacturers you would never purchase.

[culpz]

I like to keep an open mind with car manufacturers. There could be some surprises in the future and i don't want to have to eat my words at any point. Never say never.

However, so far to date, I've never really been interested in any Alfa Romeo, whether new or old. They don't do anything for me at all.

[neil1jnr]

kambites said:

There's no brands I wouldn't buy just because of the brand, although there's plenty which currently produce no cars which I'd ever buy.

You make the most sense, I am of the same opinion.

[Jim AK]

TurboHatchback said:

This thread really is a laughable indictment of modern consumer culture and peoples obsession with 'image'. I don't care what country a car was made in, what the badge on the bonnet is or what the neighbors might consequently think about my financial success or the size of my penis, I judge each car on its own individual merits.

I could pick a car type I would never buy, those stupid jacked up hatchback 'crossover' things. They offer not even a modicum of off-road ability but come with all the downsides of being tall and heavy and they universally look dreadful. They are cars for people who know nothing about cars and care not at all about driving, 100% image and 0% substance.

I'd agree with 80% being down to image & you're spot on with the 'jacked up hatchback' observation too, but for me with BMW & Mini it's based on real life issues, & after reading ashleyman's experience with VAG & his Golf R + those of friends & colleagues, with sales & service, I've added them to the list too.

As others have asked. How much of the 'hate' is based on image & not real life experience?

[Dannbodge]

Anything VAG, Citroen, Peugeot are the main ones.

[budgie smuggler]

av185 said:

I mean, does anyone driving the likes of an A4 diesel seriously think they are 'premium' when the equivalent Ford or Vauxhall is actually the better car. Comedy gold if only on delusion...

Yes they do.

Colleague actually said to me that her dream was to "have an Audi on the drive as then they'll know they've made it". Quite depressing dream to have I thought.

They actually have one now. Quite strangely they went from a top spec Focus Titanium with all the toys to a bottom spec diesel A6, which I thought was a bit of a weird way to go, but they seem happy with it.

[Rammy76]

I'd buy a car from any manufacturer based on the merits of the car.

Right now I probably have one of the most unfashionable cars you can buy (to the general public), a 2004 Volvo S60.

Most of my friends from within my social circle have gone 'premium' and continuously mock the old Volvo wondering why I don't buy something decent. Two of the guys in particular each bought a white 3 series BMW saloon, one has already had a new engine at 30000 miles due to timing chain failure, the other has niggling faults such as having to thump the dash to get the air conditioning working and recently had to have a new electric water pump and thermostat due to overheating issues.

I've never had any issues with my old car yet it doesn't have the right badge and it's old and only worth about a 20th of the BMWs in question. These guys can't see that I value reliability more than looking good in the drive and right now a lot of these 'premium' marques are anything but reliable these days.

I need a reliable, comfortable and economical car to cruise up and down the motorway that won't break the bank and right now my £1000 Volvo D5 has done that with ease for the last few years, I couldn't care less what badge it has!

[Tannedbaldhead]

Gary29 said:

VAG or Citroen

I was given a Citroën DS3 as a hire car on my last visit to Italy. I had ordered a five door Golf sized car and was given an Audi A3 as a replacement a couple of days later. Both cars were thoroughly decent drives and both interiors were nice places to be.

I just don't get the hate.

[Muddle238]

VAG - tedious styling, too common, no character
Vauxhall - too common, crap to drive
Jap/Korean - I just don't gel with these cars, I know they're supposedly reliable but it's often at the expense of styling or character
Ford - too common
BMW - tedious styling, too common

[SWoll]

Muddle238 said:

VAG - tedious styling, too common, no character
Vauxhall - too common, crap to drive
Jap/Korean - I just don't gel with these cars, I know they're supposedly reliable but it's often at the expense of styling or character
Ford - too common
BMW - tedious styling, too common

I've never understood why 'too common' factors into the decision making process as how does someone else having one possibly affect your enjoyment/experience of owning a product?

Generalising I know, but I think you'll usually find the reasons that many products aren't widely bought is because they are overpriced, not very good or a combination of both.

[designforlife]

No GM, No german, no French, no shopping hatchbacks.

[rayyan171]

jamieduff1981 said:

rayyan171 said:

Badge snobbery makes people blind. Volvo is a premium brand - we're sad that ours is going. The same can be applied to cars like the 12C and the R35 GT-R - both great cars but the GT-R is more capable and yet people go for the mclaren because of the badge because 'the gals luv the mclaren badge' compared to Nissan!

Edited by rayyan171 on Tuesday 30th August 22:53

Whilst I understand what you're getting at, I think the last analogy is a poor one. My life hasn't gone well enough to be ordering McLarens yet but of those I do know with high end cars like that, it's the pedigree and purity they want, not top trumps figures. Capability in a modern performance car is somewhat of a moot point for road use - they're all capable of doing hugely inappropriate things if the driver has no self discipline or brains, but to be honest I've yet to hear anyone who has actually driven a GTR for a period of time who wasn't simultaneously impressed and bored with it sooner or later. It's a one trick pony like all Nissan GTR models before it. It has lots of grip - that's all. Entertaining for a few goes of launch control then the novelty wears off. What you're left with is a fairly uninvolving car lacking in much design flair or aesthetic/ tactile appeal for many people.

I'd contest therefore that most people buying McLarens simply aren't interested in Nissan GTRs as an ownership proposition. Whilst the heritage and pedigree of a brand with strong racing credentials is undoubtedly appeal, it's got little to do with image-conscious badge appeal for anyone outside of London or Cheshire.

In other words, the weightings given to the many competing criteria for buying an expensive toy like a McLaren are very different to those applied to choosing a family car. Simply "doing the job" better isn't enough for someone spending money on something he/she doesn't really need - they actually have to want it.

What you're saying is correct. The GTR is seen as a car which can appeal hugely to the younger audience, but the older audience who actually have the chance to buy it see it as a car which simply handles well, is sore for their back and accelerates fast. The lack of heritage can't be said about the GT-R. The R34 is one influential car of all time. Don't forget the amount of racing heritage the R35 has, e.g the R390 GT1. That is a very memorable car of its era, so the racing heritage and pedigree is definitely there. Maybe mclaren might have a better heritage - boosted by the legend that is the F1/F1 GTR.

In terms of our Volvo, while it 'does the job', we wanted it because we got all the options on it, it was less boat-like to drive than the discovery, could actually be driven without a trip to the garage, is actually a much more pleasant car than the discovery/ land cruiser Amazon and didn't look like a shipping box (again, the discovery). I can definitely say we wanted it.

Besides, I'd rather have a P1 anyway

[neil1jnr]

Rammy76 said:

I'd buy a car from any manufacturer based on the merits of the car.

Right now I probably have one of the most unfashionable cars you can buy (to the general public), a 2004 Volvo S60.

I have a Mitsubishi Carisma diesel...

I echo what you say, some of my friends have went the 'premium' route, a 2L diesel Audi/BMW or worse yet the 1.5 diesel A180 'AMG'... It really is laughable as they see themselves as elevated above Ford, Seat etc even if you have a Cupra Leon, the A180 is better because of the badge it has.

I moved from a from a top spec ST3 Fiesta which I bought brand new and some just couldn't understand or conceive why I changed to the Carisma, it looks bland, is slow, boring to drive and has a dent on the front and a scrape on the side. It doesn't bother me at all. I get told I look like a 'foreigner', take that however you want, and that 'what if people see you in it'. It's mental.

I bought my house 6 months ago so it will be farewell to the Carisma that has cost me nothing in repairs and I am going for another Fiesta, albeit this time leased and only 140bhp. Oh why am I not moving up the car ladder I don't know

[lockhart flawse]

I buy what we need - exactly what we need. So we have had cars like Fiat Multiplas, a Nissan Note, a Citroen C1 and 2 Skoda Superb estates. None of these are or were cars I would have thought I would buy pre-family. Basically they are economical, roomy load luggers.

I would never buy an SUV or any type of crossover.

Never had a BMW, VW or an Audi and unlikely to buy one as you can get something 95% as good if not better for 80% of the price elsewhere. And I really dislike so-called premium brands. Tis all bks. A white or silver diesel A4 holds absolutely zero appeal or interest to me.

[SWoll]

lockhart flawse said:

I buy what we need - exactly what we need. So we have had cars like Fiat Multiplas, a Nissan Note, a Citroen C1 and 2 Skoda Superb estates. None of these are or were cars I would have thought I would buy pre-family. Basically they are economical, roomy load luggers.

I would never buy an SUV or any type of crossover.

Never had a BMW, VW or an Audi and unlikely to buy one as you can get something 95% as good if not better for 80% of the price elsewhere. And I really dislike so-called premium brands. Tis all bks. A white or silver diesel A4 holds absolutely zero appeal or interest to me.

I'm not sure how you can you possibly manage to judge something being 95% as good as the brands you mention and state 'premium' is all bks when you then admit to never having owned (or perhaps even driven) the cars in question?

Just comes across as weird 'reverse snobbery'.

[Muddle238]

SWoll said:

I've never understood why 'too common' factors into the decision making process as how does someone else having one possibly affect your enjoyment/experience of owning a product?

Generalising I know, but I think you'll usually find the reasons that many products aren't widely bought is because they are overpriced, not very good or a combination of both.

I find that by owning something slightly more bespoke/exclusive/rare, I therefore enjoy it more because it feels more special. I have always had an incentive to "preserve" my cars, I try to keep them clean, I don't scrape the alloys against pavements, I don't leave litter in them, I park away from others to protect against dings, I'm mechanically sympathetic and I get them serviced properly. This makes me more fond of my cars, I enjoy driving them but it's better when you don't see another one every five minutes. Then when you do see another one and the other driver waves or gives you a thumbs up, that's a pretty good feeling. You just don't get that with sales-rep Audi's and Beemers each powering their way to their next grey sales pitch in some office block. It's all about the ownership experience, as much as the car itself.

[SWoll]

Muddle238 said:

SWoll said:

I've never understood why 'too common' factors into the decision making process as how does someone else having one possibly affect your enjoyment/experience of owning a product?

Generalising I know, but I think you'll usually find the reasons that many products aren't widely bought is because they are overpriced, not very good or a combination of both.

I find that by owning something slightly more bespoke/exclusive/rare, I therefore enjoy it more because it feels more special. I have always had an incentive to "preserve" my cars, I try to keep them clean, I don't scrape the alloys against pavements, I don't leave litter in them, I park away from others to protect against dings, I'm mechanically sympathetic and I get them serviced properly. This makes me more fond of my cars, I enjoy driving them but it's better when you don't see another one every five minutes. Then when you do see another one and the other driver waves or gives you a thumbs up, that's a pretty good feeling. You just don't get that with sales-rep Audi's and Beemers each powering their way to their next grey sales pitch in some office block. It's all about the ownership experience, as much as the car itself.

So you would choose a car based on how often you see one on the road and some daft stereotypes rather than it's actual abilities? Fair enough, but seems completely irrational to me.

Out of interest what slightly more bespoke/exclusive/rare cars have you owned over the years?

[Wills2]

SWoll said:

Muddle238 said:

SWoll said:

I've never understood why 'too common' factors into the decision making process as how does someone else having one possibly affect your enjoyment/experience of owning a product?

Generalising I know, but I think you'll usually find the reasons that many products aren't widely bought is because they are overpriced, not very good or a combination of both.

I find that by owning something slightly more bespoke/exclusive/rare, I therefore enjoy it more because it feels more special. I have always had an incentive to "preserve" my cars, I try to keep them clean, I don't scrape the alloys against pavements, I don't leave litter in them, I park away from others to protect against dings, I'm mechanically sympathetic and I get them serviced properly. This makes me more fond of my cars, I enjoy driving them but it's better when you don't see another one every five minutes. Then when you do see another one and the other driver waves or gives you a thumbs up, that's a pretty good feeling. You just don't get that with sales-rep Audi's and Beemers each powering their way to their next grey sales pitch in some office block. It's all about the ownership experience, as much as the car itself.

So you would choose a car based on how often you see one on the road and some daft stereotypes rather than it's actual abilities? Fair enough, but seems completely irrational to me.

Out of interest what slightly more bespoke/exclusive/rare cars have you owned over the years?

By the looks of things a Citroen and Peugeot very bespoke/exclusive/rare....

[av185]

budgie smuggler said:

av185 said:

I mean, does anyone driving the likes of an A4 diesel seriously think they are 'premium' when the equivalent Ford or Vauxhall is actually the better car. Comedy gold if only on delusion...

Yes they do.

Colleague actually said to me that her dream was to "have an Audi on the drive as then they'll know they've made it". Quite depressing dream to have I thought.

.

Tragic indeed.

Interesting how someone who has an 'Aldi' on the drive to compare with all the other 'Aldis' on the Barratt estate seriously thinks they've 'made it'.:

The VAG marketing machine in terms of delusion over substance appears to be working well...

[SWoll]

Were you abused by a UR Quattro as a child or something?

You do seem to have a deep and irrational dislike for the brand, and that really can't be healthy. We get it, you don't like them, but plenty do. Quite why that seems to make you feel so superior is a mystery to me. Oh, and as people have pointed out before, the 'Aldi' thing wasn't funny the first time and is now just embarrassing.

Wills2 said:

By the looks of things a Citroen and Peugeot very bespoke/exclusive/rare....

Saw that, but as the 'my garage' for many posters isn't often updated I thought I'd ask.

Edited by SWoll on Thursday 1st September 10:18

[av185]

It would be interesting to learn exactly why some, including your learned self, rate Aldi , sorry Audi : above the likes of say Ford, Vauxhall et al......apart from possible delusions over the badge thing....and superiority...

As yet, no one has offered a plausible explanation...from a PH perspective at least.