Cars types or manufacturers you would never purchase.

[av185]

RSK21 said:

av185 said:

Wouldn't waste my time either reading or watching any Top Gear drivel.

Try watching Ecoty....it may enlighten you as to the requirements and meaning of driving involvement v driving detachment.

I'm fully cognisant of ECOTY and agree it makes for informative reading and viewing.

I think the fact that it was an Alan Partridge quote in response to your extolling the virtues of the GT4 was lost on you

Ah ha.

Yes it was a whoosh parrot...I admit. But AP was, like his hideous Rover, waay before my time thankfully.

By coincidence, I did watch The Trip with Coogan again only last week and thought it rather good.

[SWoll]

av185 said:

SWoll said:

av185 said:

the E39 was the last of the proper 5 series......along with the E36. These cars, in M5 and M3 form were the last of the proper BMWs (although the e90 specifically and to a lesser extent the e92 M3 are still brilliant) before they morphed into their current meh ism.

What does that even mean? So tell me why the E46 M3 CSL and E60 V10 M5 weren't proper M cars? Or why the F10 isn't a proper BMW? I keep reading this kind of thing but have never seen the reasoning behind it.

Never owned a CSL unfortunately....but I have owned most M3s and M5s of which I rate the e46 having one of the last but the build quality is nowhere near the quality of the e36 hence my comment also applying to the e39.

The current run of fugly BMW M cars has lost the plot (ref numerous threads) as many have confirmed and from an enthusiastic driving involvement perspective (is this PH...I sometimes wonder?) these cars are waay too detached (not least down to their farty engines in the M3s case ) and very similar to the Audi RS whatever and C63....soporific and no soul. This is why cars like the GT4 have been so well received and still selling second hand at 50% premium...perfect mix of old school involvement with current 'tech'....but don't take my word for it just refer to this years Ecoty where it beat the GT3 RS and £380k Mclaren.

Had an E36 M3 Evo and was tempted by the E46 M3 but ended up in a 330i due to big miles and the additional refinement on offer. Not sure I agree about the build quality, although the driving position and overall environment was far better in the E36 IMHO.

What you think of the looks is subjective so won't bother discussing that, but all mainstream cars have become more sanitized and detached over the years due to the constant push towards reduced emmissions, better safety and improved MPG. I will say though that in my experience BMW still produce by far the best drivers cars in their segment (having tested Audi's and owned both C and E Class Mercedes). I do think the whole 'no soul' thing is very much overdone, much like the 'Nissan GTR isn't involving, it's just like a computergame' comments people who have never driven one trot out. I will caveat this by adding that I have just ordered the new XF as my next CC as it is a better driving experience than the outgoing 5 Series in my opinion.

As a Porsche fan you must appreciate that the same thing has been said about the 911 since it shifted from the air cooled 993. Funny how it still manages to smash the competition in pretty much every test though whilst apparently no having as much 'character' as it used to.

Edited by SWoll on Friday 2nd September 12:29

[av185]

Interesting area....this loss of character/sanitisation as cars progress technically. Indiosyncracies are all very well, and one can put up with them in a Sunday car going to the pub, but for normal driving many vehicles are flawed (witness Aventador....size, joke single clutch gearbox, poor clearance etc) and I find it amusing how they are often viewed through rose tinted spectacles. The 911 Turbo S is a devastatingly rapid car, but lacks the involvement and charisma of the driver focused GT Porsches.

Whilst cars have increased in size across the board, some like the 911 have grown but are still compact enough to chuck along that perfect B road whereas more detached (largely down to the gearbox and driver aids) Ferraris such as the fantastic 458 are simply to wide. This is also the trap that the BMW M cars have fallen into imo.

Talking of BMW, this cringy photo perhaps sums up the 'new breed' of aspiring M car wannabees, courtesy of the Crappy Chavplate thread....without being stereotypical, of course. :

[berlintaxi]

av185 said:

But AP was, like his hideous Rover, waay before my time thankfully.

Early 2000s, how old are you 15?

[SWoll]

berlintaxi said:

av185 said:

But AP was, like his hideous Rover, waay before my time thankfully.

Early 2000s, how old are you 15?

I thought the same. I'm 40 and can remember listening to the AP radio show back in the early/mid 90's.

[av185]

SWoll said:

berlintaxi said:

av185 said:

But AP was, like his hideous Rover, waay before my time thankfully.

Early 2000s, how old are you 15?

I thought the same. I'm 40 and can remember listening to the AP radio show back in the early/mid 90's.

Not far off you. :

Remember more about Coogan in Saxondale though which came later.......pure class.

[rambo19]

BMW.
AUDI.
LEXUS.

[djc206]

I would never own a Vauxhall, there is an exception and that is I would consider a Holden V8 but proper European Vauxhalls not a fking chance. Hateful things.

In all honesty I probably wouldn't buy another Audi any time soon. As fast as my RS4 is it's a bit numb and the saving grace NA V8 is going. Exception being the R8 V10 but I can't afford one.

As much as I know Porsche make fantastic cars they just do nothing for me. I have never looked at one and thought I would love to have that on the drive which I fully accept is ridiculous.

[RobM77]

djc206 said:

As much as I know Porsche make fantastic cars they just do nothing for me. I have never looked at one and thought I would love to have that on the drive which I fully accept is ridiculous.

Bizarrely, it's the opposite for me. I've always wanted a Porsche and love the way they look, love the history and the concept behind them (compact, well made, practical, fast), so I saved up and test drove one, but that was where the desire stopped sadly.

[djc206]

RobM77 said:

izarrely, it's the opposite for me. I've always wanted a Porsche and love the way they look, love the history and the concept behind them (compact, well made, practical, fast), so I saved up and test drove one, but that was where the desire stopped sadly.

Maybe a case of meeting your hero? Similarly I'd wanted an Aston Vantage for years, drove a V8 and was massively underwhelmed. I couldn't and still can't afford a V12 so that was that. Shame.