Nasty situation - not easy to avoid?
Discussion
jmorgan said:
Some comments on the youtube clip are say not at fault.
Oh well.
The way he cheerfully agreed for the clip to be used on IdiotUKDriversExposed Facebook page must indicate that he thinks it was the driver ahead that was the idiot. There's too many comments on their page to read them but a quick scan indicates that most people don't think it's the camera car drivers fault. Oh well.
Don't know how to link directly to the item, but it was posted 3rd Sept.
Maybe this: https://www.facebook.com/143233165824638/videos/72...
Edited by Sheepshanks on Sunday 25th September 15:46
Crashes like this serve to show how far car safety has come. First proper accident I ever saw was someone coming on to the M25 at 100mph, cut straight to the outside lane and got punted into the central reservation by a Sprinter van. The driver didn't even hang up his phone before getting out of the car... 
Looking at the Youtube poster's comments... he seems to take umbrage with his insurers for putting it down as a fault claim. How on earth does he think he is not at fault?! Driving with a half-second gap and not looking beyond the car in front is stupid. Does he think it was the Skoda driver's fault? Or perhaps it was the guy in a stationary Renault who had the audacity to be where he ended up?
The poor sod in the Renault will be paying for this stupidity for the next 5 years, and he is the only one who really couldn't have done anything to avoid the collision (save for staying at home that day).
Looking at the Youtube poster's comments... he seems to take umbrage with his insurers for putting it down as a fault claim. How on earth does he think he is not at fault?! Driving with a half-second gap and not looking beyond the car in front is stupid. Does he think it was the Skoda driver's fault? Or perhaps it was the guy in a stationary Renault who had the audacity to be where he ended up?
The poor sod in the Renault will be paying for this stupidity for the next 5 years, and he is the only one who really couldn't have done anything to avoid the collision (save for staying at home that day).
thepeoplespal said:
Fort Jefferson said:
I think the camera car should be applauded for making the best out of a bad job.
This. Could have been very nasty and while cars were damaged there didn't look to be too much damage to either humans or the vehicles themselves. It certainly could have been a whole lot worse.You simply cannot leave a big enough gap on a modern motorway, its impossible.
Good driving to minimise the damage
Mandat said:
EazyDuz said:
I said what happened in the video.
I.e. You are in the same situation as the camera car from the point the video starts and go from there. Then it is unavoidable
That was completely avoidable, if only the drivers concerned were driving using the minimum of appropriate observation and anticipation skills. I.e. You are in the same situation as the camera car from the point the video starts and go from there. Then it is unavoidable
In my opinion both drivers are at fault (Skoda and camera car) and it looks like the Skoda narrowly avoided being rear-ended by the white van, or possibly was rear-ended.
The later views showed a neat line of cars which hadn't crashed into each other, although in terms of avoiding injury it looked like a good save - however it looked to me like the driver swerved rather than braking when it all went tits up.
I somehow managed to avoid colliding with a car which did the opposite a few weeks back - swerved in front of me avoiding the car in front of them. I think I locked up all 4 wheels on the caravan and was amazed at how well composed everything remained and how sharply the combination managed to stop; with hindsight I think I'd seen it unfolding just in time and was already losing speed for an extra few metres.
The later views showed a neat line of cars which hadn't crashed into each other, although in terms of avoiding injury it looked like a good save - however it looked to me like the driver swerved rather than braking when it all went tits up.
I somehow managed to avoid colliding with a car which did the opposite a few weeks back - swerved in front of me avoiding the car in front of them. I think I locked up all 4 wheels on the caravan and was amazed at how well composed everything remained and how sharply the combination managed to stop; with hindsight I think I'd seen it unfolding just in time and was already losing speed for an extra few metres.
hstewie said:
I reckon 99+% of people would've been caught-out in that situation, PHers included.Similar thing happened to me years ago but I landed without hitting anything by chance in a wider bit of centre res where there used to be a crossover gap so it was surfaced. I stopped alongside the second car from the back of the queue just in time to see them get pushed together by the car behind me hitting the back of the queue.
swerni said:
But once in that situation
The situation which is in the video, which is exactly what i said in both quotes...As soon as you start talking about anything before the video it all becomes moot. You could leave the house 10 seconds earlier and avoid the whole thing for example. But if you were plonked in the recording car at that exact moment in time having no idea what is about to unfold, it then becomes unavoidable.
Had very similar happen to me. Following a van so my view ahead obscured, he carried out the escape manoeuvre, leaving stationary traffic.
I had a bit of a gap and also managed to follow with an escape to an adjacent lane. I was in an Esapce and was impressed at how composed it was with such a manoeuvre.
I had a bit of a gap and also managed to follow with an escape to an adjacent lane. I was in an Esapce and was impressed at how composed it was with such a manoeuvre.
EazyDuz said:
swerni said:
But once in that situation
The situation which is in the video, which is exactly what i said in both quotes...As soon as you start talking about anything before the video it all becomes moot. You could leave the house 10 seconds earlier and avoid the whole thing for example. But if you were plonked in the recording car at that exact moment in time having no idea what is about to unfold, it then becomes unavoidable.
The video shows that the cam car travels for 20 seconds, before the Skoda takes evasive action to avoid the Polo at the back of the queue.
Even at 60mph, that's at last 1/3 of a mile that they have traveled, in which the cam car would have had adequate time and distance to have observed the slowing (and then stationery) traffic up ahead.
Edited by Mandat on Sunday 25th September 17:33
I was involved in a very similar situation. Outside flowing reasonably well when the brake lights started coming on in front of me and the car in front started an emergency stop. I managed to stop my car well short of the car ahead of me. While I was sitting there quietly congratulating myself I saw the car behind me bearing down at a great rate of knots. He made the perfect emergency lane change into the centre lane. Unfortunately the car behind him was still doing 70mph and 3 or 4 car lengths behind me. The impact shoved my car into the car in front and that one into the one into yet another writing off all three cars.
Quite honestly I don't blame him or the driver in this clip. Sometimes events conspire to take your wriggle room (and the 2 second rule) away.
Quite honestly I don't blame him or the driver in this clip. Sometimes events conspire to take your wriggle room (and the 2 second rule) away.
People just don't pay attention or give enough space I had car in front suddenly stop when down B road, I stopped in time and looked in mirror to see a car skidding towards me but luckily I left enough space to pull out into a left turn lane as she ended up stopping in the space i was in and she didn't even realise I saved her from a crash as she had go at me for suddenly stopping.
Mandat said:
If we are to go by only what is shown in the video, then the incident was still avoidable, IMHO.
The video shows that the cam car travels for 20 seconds, before the Skoda takes evasive action to avoid the Polo at the back of the queue.
Even at 60mph, that's at last 1/3 of a mile that they have traveled, in which the cam car would have had adequate time and distance to have observed the slowing (and then stationery) traffic up ahead.
But how can the cam car driver see well enough through the Skoda to see the slowing traffic in front of it? You can't see it in the video, in fact the rear window has quite a big reflection of the sky on it, so you wouldn't see and therefore anticipate the slowed traffic in front of the Skoda.The video shows that the cam car travels for 20 seconds, before the Skoda takes evasive action to avoid the Polo at the back of the queue.
Even at 60mph, that's at last 1/3 of a mile that they have traveled, in which the cam car would have had adequate time and distance to have observed the slowing (and then stationery) traffic up ahead.
Edited by Mandat on Sunday 25th September 17:33
the pips said:
I was involved in a very similar situation. Outside flowing reasonably well when the brake lights started coming on in front of me and the car in front started an emergency stop. I managed to stop my car well short of the car ahead of me. While I was sitting there quietly congratulating myself I saw the car behind me bearing down at a great rate of knots. He made the perfect emergency lane change into the centre lane. Unfortunately the car behind him was still doing 70mph and 3 or 4 car lengths behind me. The impact shoved my car into the car in front and that one into the one into yet another writing off all three cars.
Quite honestly I don't blame him or the driver in this clip. Sometimes events conspire to take your wriggle room (and the 2 second rule) away.
Sounds very like the scenario in this video - except the Skoda didn't quite miss the Polo (you), and the car behind just went down next instead of slapping straight into you. Certainly still two cars with drivers who weren't looking anywhere NEAR far enough ahead, and entirely to blame.Quite honestly I don't blame him or the driver in this clip. Sometimes events conspire to take your wriggle room (and the 2 second rule) away.
EazyDuz said:
Mandat said:
If we are to go by only what is shown in the video, then the incident was still avoidable, IMHO.
The video shows that the cam car travels for 20 seconds, before the Skoda takes evasive action to avoid the Polo at the back of the queue.
Even at 60mph, that's at last 1/3 of a mile that they have traveled, in which the cam car would have had adequate time and distance to have observed the slowing (and then stationery) traffic up ahead.
But how can the cam car driver see well enough through the Skoda to see the slowing traffic in front of it? You can't see it in the video, in fact the rear window has quite a big reflection of the sky on it, so you wouldn't see and therefore anticipate the slowed traffic in front of the Skoda.The video shows that the cam car travels for 20 seconds, before the Skoda takes evasive action to avoid the Polo at the back of the queue.
Even at 60mph, that's at last 1/3 of a mile that they have traveled, in which the cam car would have had adequate time and distance to have observed the slowing (and then stationery) traffic up ahead.
Edited by Mandat on Sunday 25th September 17:33
Secondly, proper observation and anticipation is basic driving. Drivers should be looking at what is happening a few cars ahead, and no just at the rear of the car in front.
If the cam car cannot easily see through the Skoda, then he can easily adjust his road positioning to see better down the inside or outside of the Skoda, at what is happening in front. He had plenty of time and distance to do so, but failed miserably.
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