How to deal with 17 year old driving dangerously?
Discussion
After the OP's response, if you don't take away his car away - on a semi-permanent basis (until his attitude changes) then you're directly responsible. He doesn't sound like a typical 17 year old at all. 17 isn't THAT young, he's not 14 for christ sake, like half the other posters seem to be hinting at.
He just sounds like a bit of a brat...
He just sounds like a bit of a brat...
Not read every post BUT, yea at 17 i was a bit of a pillock as well, Back in 64 all the boys had shiny scooters, i had a 46 Ford Anglia!!!! and the girls were round it like a honey pot. After all who wants to arrive at a dance looking like they had been in a wind tunnel, when they could step out of a car in their best clobber and not one hair of the beehive out of place???
It all came home to me one day when the hight road in Edmonton got flooded 12-18 inches, bow waves everywhere loved it, until i was doing the normal 35-40 down Fore Street, heading for the junction with the A406 my lights were red so i hit the brakes ,and serenly carried on at same speed the lights were still red and road was running out with the assorted artics crossing in frontof me, i had passed the rubber strip ( remember them?) still at 30 mph when the red/amber came on and sailed over stopping about 100yds the other side of the junction. got home, with my foor still hard on the brake and handbrake up casually asked dad what happens when you drive through deep water, to which i got full chapter and verse,and other things cornering etc ending with only a complete idiot doesnt check his brakes as soon as he clears it.....i grew up that day.
It all came home to me one day when the hight road in Edmonton got flooded 12-18 inches, bow waves everywhere loved it, until i was doing the normal 35-40 down Fore Street, heading for the junction with the A406 my lights were red so i hit the brakes ,and serenly carried on at same speed the lights were still red and road was running out with the assorted artics crossing in frontof me, i had passed the rubber strip ( remember them?) still at 30 mph when the red/amber came on and sailed over stopping about 100yds the other side of the junction. got home, with my foor still hard on the brake and handbrake up casually asked dad what happens when you drive through deep water, to which i got full chapter and verse,and other things cornering etc ending with only a complete idiot doesnt check his brakes as soon as he clears it.....i grew up that day.
Seeing as this is pistonheads, should we maybe start considering the possibility of constructing a Fritzl style basement to lock him in till he's grown up?
On a serious note, I would really look into having somebody from the emergency services talk to him if at all possible. I'm not sure about nowadays but it wasn't unusual for a fire station to have photographic records of crashes. It was part of my dad's job when he was in the service. Before I had a licence he showed me a few aftermath photos (no bodies), I can still remember vividly the image of a steering wheel melded into the dashboard so the steering column was the only protruding part in a fatal crash. The driver wasn't wearing a seatbelt and he obviously hammered into it so hard in a head on collision that the force was enough to deform the whole thing.
I was also told of the details of another crash where a guy in a BMW hit a lorry on a shallow s-bend. The impact was so bad that the truck lost a wheel and went straight into a field. He was possibly changing a cd at the time. Anyway, by the time my dad's crew cut him out he was dead. He was barely alive when they arrived and had clearly been so f
ked up by the crash he had no idea what was happening. The impact he knocked him through the car and into the back seat. When they had the car cut open and they lifted him out it was like he had no bones in his legs and everything was jelly, every bit of him was just smashed up so badly. Now that sounds horrible but that's not the worst part. The worst part was his mum was in the car behind and it fell to my dad to keep her out of the way while they were trying (utterly in vain) to save his life.
Maybe a few stories like that will make him reconsider.
On a serious note, I would really look into having somebody from the emergency services talk to him if at all possible. I'm not sure about nowadays but it wasn't unusual for a fire station to have photographic records of crashes. It was part of my dad's job when he was in the service. Before I had a licence he showed me a few aftermath photos (no bodies), I can still remember vividly the image of a steering wheel melded into the dashboard so the steering column was the only protruding part in a fatal crash. The driver wasn't wearing a seatbelt and he obviously hammered into it so hard in a head on collision that the force was enough to deform the whole thing.
I was also told of the details of another crash where a guy in a BMW hit a lorry on a shallow s-bend. The impact was so bad that the truck lost a wheel and went straight into a field. He was possibly changing a cd at the time. Anyway, by the time my dad's crew cut him out he was dead. He was barely alive when they arrived and had clearly been so f
ked up by the crash he had no idea what was happening. The impact he knocked him through the car and into the back seat. When they had the car cut open and they lifted him out it was like he had no bones in his legs and everything was jelly, every bit of him was just smashed up so badly. Now that sounds horrible but that's not the worst part. The worst part was his mum was in the car behind and it fell to my dad to keep her out of the way while they were trying (utterly in vain) to save his life.Maybe a few stories like that will make him reconsider.
rxe said:
Snipped a bit....
Problem is that he is 17 - that discussion was never going to end up with him saying "Yeah, dad, I'm a cock, I understand the error of my ways, I'll never do it again".
I'd suggest you do let him review the footage from your car - and let him critique your driving. I assume it will be somewhat more measured! You can have a sensible discussion about which rules to break, and which rules should be obeyed.
Black box may be worth it - my godson is a serious speed fiend, and will race bloody anything. Both his father and I were seriously concerned about him taking the wheel, but the black box has turned it into "how much discount can I get off the insurance" game. Getting one fitted and him having to pay the excess might be a route out.
Good points. No, he probably will not admit to a cock. But he will probably still realise (if he has any sense) that sometimes you just have to suck it up and obey other peoples rules. Maybe.....Problem is that he is 17 - that discussion was never going to end up with him saying "Yeah, dad, I'm a cock, I understand the error of my ways, I'll never do it again".
I'd suggest you do let him review the footage from your car - and let him critique your driving. I assume it will be somewhat more measured! You can have a sensible discussion about which rules to break, and which rules should be obeyed.
Black box may be worth it - my godson is a serious speed fiend, and will race bloody anything. Both his father and I were seriously concerned about him taking the wheel, but the black box has turned it into "how much discount can I get off the insurance" game. Getting one fitted and him having to pay the excess might be a route out.
The black box is an interesting one - why not take it further and give him a financial incentive - ie.
"ok, how about we let you drive again if you have a black box fitted. If the insurance goes up or gets cancelled we take the keys away again but if you manage to get a reduction on your insurance you can keep the difference". Might soften the blow...
aka_kerrly said:
I've only scanned through the topic but can't help but wonder why a kid who has a dashcam in their car drives like a knob.
Did the kid even know that the dashcam is fitted or was it installed on the sly?
Did the kid even know that the dashcam is fitted or was it installed on the sly?
FaceTube win points wiv da possee innit bruv, I knew i wasn't mature enough to drive so didn't bother until 21, i didn't need to anyway. I was assissted in my driving by being in a 90s floppy french hatchback
Feel for you OP, he sounds like a 17 year old all right.
And agree with HustleRussell, taking the keys away until he earns himself a bike / car? How is he going to earn anything sat at home in the middle of nowhere?
He's a teenager, he's looking for a reason to blame you, and an excuse to complain about how st his life is to gain some attention on social media.
I'd agree I think normally the military used to be the solution, but you probably don't want that
Can you send him off to go 'volunteer' in the third world for a month? Might help adjust his perceptions / issue with entitlement?
Really what you're asking for is a way to make him mature very rapidly...
EDIT:
Just to add, I really don't know how much pictures of car crashes will help, it's much like the pictures of rotten lungs on cigarette packets. People just don't think it'll happen to them, pictures happen to other people, they're special and they'll be fine.
And agree with HustleRussell, taking the keys away until he earns himself a bike / car? How is he going to earn anything sat at home in the middle of nowhere?
He's a teenager, he's looking for a reason to blame you, and an excuse to complain about how s
t his life is to gain some attention on social media.I'd agree I think normally the military used to be the solution, but you probably don't want that
Can you send him off to go 'volunteer' in the third world for a month? Might help adjust his perceptions / issue with entitlement? Really what you're asking for is a way to make him mature very rapidly...
EDIT:
Just to add, I really don't know how much pictures of car crashes will help, it's much like the pictures of rotten lungs on cigarette packets. People just don't think it'll happen to them, pictures happen to other people, they're special and they'll be fine.
Edited by SturdyHSV on Tuesday 27th September 10:57
SturdyHSV said:
Just to add, I really don't know how much pictures of car crashes will help, it's much like the pictures of rotten lungs on cigarette packets. People just don't think it'll happen to them, pictures happen to other people, they're special and they'll be fine.
especially if they are being forced to watch, they'll "watch" whatever video you give them on car crashes just to shut you up and not take anything else in.Edited by SturdyHSV on Tuesday 27th September 10:57
I agree its down to the technology these days, the car not the dashcam though. When I first passed all I could afford to buy and insure was a 950cc Fiesta. It would not go faster than 50mph and took 3 days to get up to that speed. If you went around a corner faster than 15mph it would crash, flip over, burst into flames etc... Oh and the brakes didn't work too well either.
Did I drive it badly - yes. Did I end up crashing it - yes. Did I get hurt or hurt anyone else - nope.
Did I drive it badly - yes. Did I end up crashing it - yes. Did I get hurt or hurt anyone else - nope.
SturdyHSV said:
Just to add, I really don't know how much pictures of car crashes will help, it's much like the pictures of rotten lungs on cigarette packets. People just don't think it'll happen to them, pictures happen to other people, they're special and they'll be fine.
I actually totally agree with you. I think it's very important to have the story as well as the pictures and while I don't think any strategy is likely to be 100% effective in this case I think that it's a very good way to 'crack the shell' so to speak. You might get through to him once he realises how much harm a car crash can cause to all involved.V10Ace said:
Nanook said:
OP, you're really asking a bunch of randoms on the internet how to raise your son? This'll go well.
This x 1000 Probably why the young man has issues in the first place. Janky parenting.
ks! give the man a break.... He has hit a situation he is not sure how to deal with and is asking for advice. He is a grown man who can make his own mind up what advice suites his situation and child. What is wrong with that? Are we not supposed to talk about these sort of things?Everyone is perfect until they are in the spotlight. Not that I am surprised that his parenting skills have come into question, this is pistonheads after all
I feel for you OP, the son is behaving the way you pray never happens, despite doing all the things you thought were right.
I know quite a few lads who grew up in the country and had the benefit of driving bangers in fields as youngsters before getting a license. In my experience it only taught them how to drive hard and fast and rag the arse of cars without any sense of boundaries. These chaps were far more precocious on the roads than their townie counterparts and were utter loonies mostly. Practically all of them had big accidents through misadventure. Luckily they didn’t kill or injure anyone too badly.
Don’t know what the OP can do to clip son’s wings, it’s are relying on over privileged brat seeing the light of day and I don’t think many 17 year olds whose heads are already turned are capable of an epiphany.
I know quite a few lads who grew up in the country and had the benefit of driving bangers in fields as youngsters before getting a license. In my experience it only taught them how to drive hard and fast and rag the arse of cars without any sense of boundaries. These chaps were far more precocious on the roads than their townie counterparts and were utter loonies mostly. Practically all of them had big accidents through misadventure. Luckily they didn’t kill or injure anyone too badly.
Don’t know what the OP can do to clip son’s wings, it’s are relying on over privileged brat seeing the light of day and I don’t think many 17 year olds whose heads are already turned are capable of an epiphany.
JuniorD said:
I feel for you OP, the son is behaving the way you pray never happens, despite doing all the things you thought were right.
I know quite a few lads who grew up in the country and had the benefit of driving bangers in fields as youngsters before getting a license. In my experience it only taught them how to drive hard and fast and rag the arse of cars without any sense of boundaries. These chaps were far more precocious on the roads than their townie counterparts and were utter loonies mostly. Practically all of them had big accidents through misadventure. Luckily they didn’t kill or injure anyone too badly.
Don’t know what the OP can do to clip son’s wings, it’s are relying on over privileged brat seeing the light of day and I don’t think many 17 year olds whose heads are already turned are capable of an epiphany.
To my embarrassment and shame, you have just described me and, also, the tragic girl I described in my first post. I learnt my lesson reversing a triumph dolomite out of the apex of a corner at about seventy in the wet. Fortunately, beech hedges make very forgiving crash barriersI know quite a few lads who grew up in the country and had the benefit of driving bangers in fields as youngsters before getting a license. In my experience it only taught them how to drive hard and fast and rag the arse of cars without any sense of boundaries. These chaps were far more precocious on the roads than their townie counterparts and were utter loonies mostly. Practically all of them had big accidents through misadventure. Luckily they didn’t kill or injure anyone too badly.
Don’t know what the OP can do to clip son’s wings, it’s are relying on over privileged brat seeing the light of day and I don’t think many 17 year olds whose heads are already turned are capable of an epiphany.
Many years ago I ended up taking a year out before going to uni, got a job, a loan, a hot-hatch and was unleashed on the road in a car with 3 times the power of my first banged up Fiesta.
I drove like a bit of an idiot, no speeding in carparks etc but country lanes, dual carriageways etc were often driven over the limit and I thought traffic lights were there to organise small races along with trying to 'race' other drivers of quick cars.
I ended up getting caught speeding on a dual carriageway they had recently changed from nsl to 40mph, I was going double the limit. Went to court, got bailed out by my dad who paid for a solicitor to come with me and ended up with 5 points and a fine but I kept my license.
Hot-hatch was sold and old estate borrowed inbetween me waiting for court which I kept driving for a few years afterwards as the novelty of driving like a tool almost completely worn off.
It took me years to want to drive anything quick again as I felt like an absoulute idiot, it was perhaps one of the most embarrasing things I have had to go through and really did cause me sleepless nights for a long time waiting for that court date.
Long story short, this may be what is coming for your son OP, that or maybe an accident (lets hope not) - Either way if he doesnt obtain some road manners for himself, the real world will come down on him instead.
One difference though, it was my car and my mess - I got help from my parents getting out of the crap but they didnt help me get into it, you will feel very guilty if your Son is involved in any kind of incident and you have not taken real steps to prevent his behavior. In your position I would cancel the insurance immediately and re-insure with a black box provider, let somebody else punish him for driving like a tit.
I drove like a bit of an idiot, no speeding in carparks etc but country lanes, dual carriageways etc were often driven over the limit and I thought traffic lights were there to organise small races along with trying to 'race' other drivers of quick cars.
I ended up getting caught speeding on a dual carriageway they had recently changed from nsl to 40mph, I was going double the limit. Went to court, got bailed out by my dad who paid for a solicitor to come with me and ended up with 5 points and a fine but I kept my license.
Hot-hatch was sold and old estate borrowed inbetween me waiting for court which I kept driving for a few years afterwards as the novelty of driving like a tool almost completely worn off.
It took me years to want to drive anything quick again as I felt like an absoulute idiot, it was perhaps one of the most embarrasing things I have had to go through and really did cause me sleepless nights for a long time waiting for that court date.
Long story short, this may be what is coming for your son OP, that or maybe an accident (lets hope not) - Either way if he doesnt obtain some road manners for himself, the real world will come down on him instead.
One difference though, it was my car and my mess - I got help from my parents getting out of the crap but they didnt help me get into it, you will feel very guilty if your Son is involved in any kind of incident and you have not taken real steps to prevent his behavior. In your position I would cancel the insurance immediately and re-insure with a black box provider, let somebody else punish him for driving like a tit.
Edited by Rick1.8t on Tuesday 27th September 12:41
OP - First of all let me say that I don't think that you and your wife are bad parents; we did something similar for our kids as they grew up - living out in the country can be restrictive and frustrating when you're a teenager.
Fortunately I haven't had the same experience as you when my son was 17 (he's 25 now) - I know that he drove like a tt sometime but never had any bad incidents or in trouble with the police - I was similar when I was his age.
Unfortunately, reading your post I think that the problem with your son goes deeper than poor driving; tbh he sounds like he's been really spoiled, is arrogant and has little respect for you.
As he is effectively a grown man now your options for disciplining him are limited (if you still want him to have some level of respect for you); if you remove all access to the car he will end up hating you - he might even steal it, or one of your other cars when he thinks he'll get away with it.
You could try letting him have access to the car but only on a 'reward' basis - draw up a list of chores/tasks for him to do and when he completes them to your satisfaction reward him with say an hours access - he can bank hours for an evening's use. Tell him that his driving may be reviewed on the dashcam when he returns, but when your confidence in his driving is restored (over time) that you will remove the dashcam.
Make him contribute towards the costs - insurance, petrol, maintenance, tax, etc - maybe he doesn't make much money but pro-rata it to his income; he needs to learn financial responsibility - if you continue to hand him everything on a plate with no level of sacrifice expected from him your situation will go from bad to worse.
You have my sympathies and best wishes - remember, this too shall pass, he will (to an extent) come through this phase, how quickly and well he does it is up to you and your wife.
Fortunately I haven't had the same experience as you when my son was 17 (he's 25 now) - I know that he drove like a t
t sometime but never had any bad incidents or in trouble with the police - I was similar when I was his age.Unfortunately, reading your post I think that the problem with your son goes deeper than poor driving; tbh he sounds like he's been really spoiled, is arrogant and has little respect for you.
As he is effectively a grown man now your options for disciplining him are limited (if you still want him to have some level of respect for you); if you remove all access to the car he will end up hating you - he might even steal it, or one of your other cars when he thinks he'll get away with it.
You could try letting him have access to the car but only on a 'reward' basis - draw up a list of chores/tasks for him to do and when he completes them to your satisfaction reward him with say an hours access - he can bank hours for an evening's use. Tell him that his driving may be reviewed on the dashcam when he returns, but when your confidence in his driving is restored (over time) that you will remove the dashcam.
Make him contribute towards the costs - insurance, petrol, maintenance, tax, etc - maybe he doesn't make much money but pro-rata it to his income; he needs to learn financial responsibility - if you continue to hand him everything on a plate with no level of sacrifice expected from him your situation will go from bad to worse.
You have my sympathies and best wishes - remember, this too shall pass, he will (to an extent) come through this phase, how quickly and well he does it is up to you and your wife.
There are some sobering threads on here, which you could put in font of him to help him wise up. Two immediately come to mind, the first is guy who lost his brother and sister in-law to a dangerous driver and has to deal with his very young nephew's trauma. The guy who ended up in prison because his dangerous (lethal?) driving.
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