Company Vehicle Insurance

[Some Guy]

Hello, like to pick peoples brains on this.

I have recently started a new job and when required, get provided with a rental car for business use. The rental car is provided without insurance, as the company has its own insurance. I have asked to see a copy of this and be shown where my name is mentioned (or is it a blanket all employees policy?). I have been fobbed off with "its at head office" and you should trust us. All I have, is an email from the office administrator stating I am covered and I am not sure how that would hold up in court?

I did have to completer a "Riskmaster" assessment, but that seemed focussed on can I spot hazards and seems like an arse covering exercise for the company and was very much one sided. Does anyone know if Riskmaster actually assess the company, or just the drivers? Thanks.

[Super Slo Mo]

Our company policy is any 'any driver' one, with age restrictions.
I wouldn't worry about it, the rental company won't let the car go out if it's not covered and anyway, the email you have puts you in a position where you can reasonably consider the cover to be in place, which is about all you require.

[dacouch]

The Road Trafficn Act has a specific exemption for drivers using a company vehicle providing you don't have reasonable suspecions that the vehicle is uninsured

"(3)A person charged with using a motor vehicle in contravention of this section shall not be convicted if he proves—

(a)that the vehicle did not belong to him and was not in his possession under a contract of hiring or of loan,

(b)that he was using the vehicle in the course of his employment, and

(c)that he neither knew nor had reason to believe that there was not in force in relation to the vehicle such a policy of insurance or security as is mentioned in subsection (1) above."

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/sectio...

[BertBert]

Even if you are not at risk of prosecution under the RTA, what would happen if you has an accident that was your fault and didn't have insurance? Could you end up being personally liable?
Bert

[TwigtheWonderkid]

Super Slo Mo said:

I wouldn't worry about it, the rental company won't let the car go out if it's not covered and anyway,

Correct. The rental firm must have a copy of your company fleet insurance cert.

[elanfan]

Tell your employer you've been stopped by the Police and been given a producer?

[sebhaque]

Super Slo Mo said:

Our company policy is any 'any driver' one, with age restrictions.

I think it's the same for most corporate hire car policies. Amusingly I started getting hire cars at 18 through work (for business use) and wouldn't have been able to hire the same car privately for a good 7 years.

If you have a corporate policy then you have nothing to worry about. I would expect your company's HR department to provide a copy of the insurance note for your records if you ask for it, but I've certainly never bothered.

I travel a lot with work and tend to have a few hire cars on my drive a month. A little while ago, the rental company hired a new start who claimed there was damage on every vehicle that came back to the depot. I, and a lot of other employees, complained as this was obviously untrue, and no charges came back to us. She didn't last more than a fortnight.

The company I work for has an agreement that all hire cars are dropped off and picked up from a residence of our choice. One time, my rental ended at 11pm on a Thursday night in a busy area near Heathrow airport, but the car was not picked up until at least 2pm on the following Monday. While I'd parked the car in a decent empty spot on the road, because of the HGV traffic in the area, someone had managed to drive into it and scuff the front wing. The rental company came back to me and said I was liable for the damage. I reminded them that in the same way they would happily charge me if I overran my rental by 15 minutes, the minute my rental ended meant I ceased to be responsible for the vehicle. They never followed up on the charge to repair it, since they'd taken over 100 hours to pick the car up. For reference, I had booked the hire car for 6 hours.

The other thing our company does is require us to return the vehicles to the rental company with a full tank of fuel. Refilling the car is billed to the company, but if we return the car without a full tank, the cost is passed on to us. It's worth checking where the rental car came from and bearing the distance in mind. I fell foul of this when I moved house, as the rental company was originally about 3 miles away, and then became 20 miles away. Normally I could get away with filling the car up on the way home and detouring to get some dinner, but now I have to let my takeaway go cold while I fill the car up right before I leave it outside my drive. We're kindly charged about £2.43 + VAT per litre for fuel.

I know you (OP) mentioned this was new to you, so for your information you might like to know.

[Some Guy]

Thanks for the replys chaps. Feel a bit more confident now. Cheers.

[al29108]

sebhaque said:

I reminded them that in the same way they would happily charge me if I overran my rental by 15 minutes, the minute my rental ended meant I ceased to be responsible for the vehicle.

As it was said for info - i'll add this to it...

Having worked for one of the major rental companies in the UK, in 99% of cases this is incorrect. Part of the Service Level Agreement that the company accepts when they ask for delivery and collection to be available is that reasonable time is allowed for the collection of the vehicle. This is typically around 4 hours but can be upto a couple of days depending on the location, particularly if very rural. You are correct that if they do not collect within the contracted period then you are not responsible for any new damage found on the vehicle.

The company/renter is also responsible for any parking charges during that period as well.

[CYMR0]

BertBert said:

Even if you are not at risk of prosecution under the RTA, what would happen if you has an accident that was your fault and didn't have insurance? Could you end up being personally liable?
Bert

In theory, yes, but you have to go a long way there:

1. The employer has to be so lax that they don't bother getting insurance;
2. The rental company is just as lax and doesn't check;
3. OP has a fault claim;
4. The claimant/their insurer decide not to go after the employer, with deep pockets, who is vicariously liable, and goes after (comparatively) skint OP instead.

So you require four separate things to go wrong, the last one basically being the insolvency of the employer.

[TwigtheWonderkid]

CYMR0 said:

BertBert said:

Even if you are not at risk of prosecution under the RTA, what would happen if you has an accident that was your fault and didn't have insurance? Could you end up being personally liable?
Bert

In theory, yes, but you have to go a long way there:

1. The employer has to be so lax that they don't bother getting insurance;
2. The rental company is just as lax and doesn't check;
3. OP has a fault claim;
4. The claimant/their insurer decide not to go after the employer, with deep pockets, who is vicariously liable, and goes after (comparatively) skint OP instead.

So you require four separate things to go wrong, the last one basically being the insolvency of the employer.

And self drive hire firm's insurance usually includes contingency cover. Contingency cover is, in it's simplest form, insurance against the failure of insurance.

So the self drive hire firm have insurance, but that insurance doesn't apply if the hirer puts the car on their own insurance, but if the hirer's own insurance doesn't provide cover for whatever reason, the contingency cover applies and the hire firm's cover kicks in.

[CYMR0]

TwigtheWonderkid said:

the contingency cover applies and the hire firm's cover kicks in.

Couldn't that contingency cover assert a right to recover against the driver due to breach of contract?

Or is it effectively like a normal policy, just one where the hire company agrees with its insurer that it will always seek other cover first (and adjusts its customer prices accordingly).

[TwigtheWonderkid]

CYMR0 said:

TwigtheWonderkid said:

the contingency cover applies and the hire firm's cover kicks in.

Couldn't that contingency cover assert a right to recover against the driver due to breach of contract?

Or is it effectively like a normal policy, just one where the hire company agrees with its insurer that it will always seek other cover first (and adjusts its customer prices accordingly).

Yes, contingency cover would normally have terms where the hire co have to carry out certain checks before allowing the car out on COI (customers own insurance). But if those checks were done, then the cover would apply. Whether they chose to pursue the hirer or not is another matter.