BMW dealer...

[icepop]

MDMA . said:

Fox- said:

Monkeylegend said:

Over 2 million new car registrations so far this year, car salesmen must be doing something right.

Yes, because if it were not for those salesmen none of those cars would have been purchased.

Never once has the salesman been the difference between me buying or not buying.

1.1m of those sales are fleet though. Private sales are actually down this year to last.

On top of that,according to the BBC this morning, it appears that 20% of those 0.9 million private cars, are pre-reg cars !

[andymc]

RobM77 said:

andymc said:

with all respect hairy arsed broad chested PH'ers are in the minority of buyers, you could always go next door buy the veyron and drive past him on the way out scoffing how you cost him £75 in commission

I'm not sure whether that's aimed at me, but I fully expect a salesman to earn commission and a dealership to make profit! My basic problem with their salesmen is that they usually know virtually nothing about the cars they're selling, so you can't ask them basic questions. I'm not talking about technical details, just practical things. Furthermore, I've known them lie when faced with questions they can't answer on a number of occasions. There's also the general attitude, as described by the OP.

no not you all pal, just most buyers aren't clued in hence the lack of product knowledge

[RobM77]

KTF said:

RobM77 said:

benjijames28 said:

If you are a salesman you should be an expert on the products your selling.

This is what a BMW salesman once said to me after mis-selling me a car:

BMW Salesman said:

I shouldn't be expected to know everything about the cars I'm selling

The guy in question didn't know the answer to a simple question and lied instead of admitting this and just asking someone. He then offered me £7k less than what I'd just paid for my car to trade it in for another car that did have the feature I wanted.

Whats the back story for this then?

I took up a sport that meant I needed roofbars for my car at about the same time I was changing my E36 328i coupé. I was at my local BMW dealer and saw a car that had somehow passed me by in the magazine reviews etc: a Z4 Coupé. I asked the salesman if, because it was a coupé rather than the much more common roadster, whether you could get roof bars for it and he said yes. I test drove the car, loved it, and arranged to buy it on the spot along with a set of roof bars, which apparently weren't in stock at the time. I sold my 328i to a friendly PHer, got the Z4C, and a few conversations with parts later it transpired that the roof bars didn't exist. As I know now, but not at the time, newer BMWs have screw in roof bars that screw into captive nuts under little hatches on the car's roof (have a look at a 3 or 5 series) and the Z4 Coupé doesn't have these and has no roof bars available for it. This is where the above quote comes in - when I found this out I asked the dealer if he was aware of this, and he said "no, I shouldn't be expected to know everything about the cars I'm selling". I tried to tidy up the situation by negotiating a swap for a 130i they had in stock at the time, but the deal was a standard trade in and purchase, losing me about £7k IIRC (Z4C cost me £22k and the 130i was up for £20k I think).

It's not just this though, it's other things over the years. I've owned 5 BMWs (that'll be 6 in three weeks!) and the sort of crap I've heard when buying them or test driving them at dealers is ridiculous. The salesman I bought my 330ci from swore blind that it had an LSD as standard. Unlike the roof bars, this is something talked about in Evo, Autocar etc and something I took an interest in, so I knew full well he was talking bks! When it comes to mundane details though not mentioned in car magazines, I rely on BMW to tell me. I've learnt my lesson of course, and nowadays I'm not as trusting - I ask on PH, research on the web, etc.

Oh, and back to that 330ci - quite literally as I was about to sign for the car the BMW salesman told me it was an EU import. That wasn't on the advert and I had never been told this. I had no idea what ramifications that had, but went ahead anyway. Sadly the car had no end of problems and spent the next few months in and out of the dealer. I ended up selling the stupid thing a few months later and when the Lotus salesman I was trading in with rung the BMW dealer to ask about trade in, they offered him a pittance for it (by far the lowest trade in Lotus were offered for my car) "because it was an import". I'd bought the car for £16k, done very few miles in it over 3 months and they offered me £7k I think! Lotus got £11k for it in the end if I remember rightly.

I could go on...

[V8 FOU]

Very little experience of new car buying. But when I went with the OH to a Honda dealer the salesman kept speaking to me, even though it was obvious that the OH was buying a car for herself. At one point asked me if I would like to see the engine? " I would assume at that price it's got one" I replied. Left the OH to talk to him...

[Butter Face]

Can we just wrap this up now to save 50 pages.

Some people are good at their job
Some people aren't
Some people lie
Most people don't
Some people like to wear expensive suits
Some people don't
Some people think they're amazing
Most people just want to do a job and go home

Transpose to any job/industry/whatever and that's really it.

Or we can have another 46 pages of one sided anecdotes, jibes about shiny suits and posturing.

[andymc]

i'd like more anecdotes

[SuperchargedVR6]

BigLion said:

Car salesman in the bmw dealership I went to today. Truly a fascinating breed of animal and a unique species.

Whilst waiting to pick up my car from the service I observed some behaviour that David Attenborough would have been proud to have narrated on.

The strong purposeful walks, to own the space.

The strong and unrelenting eye contact.

The marking of territory with strong aftershave.

The unnecessary loud communication to show confidence.

Then the mating ritual ahead of a car purchase - a bit like a peacock showing off its feathers - one salesman had a cravat and the others had things like matching hankies in their pockets.

Honestly, they all looked like such prize plums - for goodness sake do dealers think people are in the 80s still. Yes, dress smart but don't go to such a stupid extreme and behave like Gorillas. People are buying a car, not a taking a princesses hand in marriage.

Thank god the service department were sane, otherwise I would have never returned to that place of pretentiousness ever again !!!!

I bet if you were to purchase a car from said chap, you'd also get the alpha male car crusher hand shake to seal the deal.

Oh and in some BMW & VAG dealers I've frequented recently, you can add orange spray tan and over worked-out upper body to that list of traits, too.

[Butter Face]

andymc said:

i'd like more anecdotes

Did you hear that one about the rich bloke dressed in a potato sack that went to buy a Mercedes for cash?

[Ultrafunkula]

Butter Face said:

Did you hear that one about the rich bloke dressed in a potato sack that went to buy a Mercedes for cash?

Er did he get sold a spud?

[Ninja59]

My BMW dealer started on poor ground not approached by anyone or anything.

It got better though and genuinely I like the guy who discussed the options and costs etc. tried looking for the right car, but could not so I ended up buying the one I test drove originally over my budget, but I adjusted it and everything turned out well.

I have had the "odd" problem with BMW service side when one of the tyres got a bulge not long into ownership, minor issues but something I would prefer to avoid. Eventually me and the service manager are on first name terms and everything tends to go smoothly. I have a bit of a reputation as "one of those customers" that is anal though...and yes I do check most of the work carried out when it has been in (where possible).

Which as it is in today for it's Winter wheel swap (being lazy) means the torque wrench will be out soon. Possibly a quick nose under the engine bay as well.

[Deerfoot]

Butter Face said:

Can we just wrap this up now to save 50 pages.

Some people are good at their job
Some people aren't
Some people lie
Most people don't
Some people like to wear expensive suits
Some people don't
Some people think they're amazing
Most people just want to do a job and go home

Transpose to any job/industry/whatever and that's really it.

Or we can have another 46 pages of one sided anecdotes, jibes about shiny suits and posturing.

Absolutely this.

[Butter Face]

Ultrafunkula said:

Butter Face said:

Did you hear that one about the rich bloke dressed in a potato sack that went to buy a Mercedes for cash?

Er did he get sold a spud?

Nah, he bought 74 BMWs instead. Then he parked them on the Merc dealers forecourt, bought the business, fired the Merc salesman for looking down on him because he was wearing a potato sack then set fire to the whole lot.

And that man was Winston Churchill.


The car salesman, not the rich guy.

1. truestory

[MajorMantra]

Butter Face said:

you walked out? Why?

He may have started the day before, he may be learning the range. You had a service question to ask, he was going to find you someone. That dealer may have had a master tech with 20 years experience and a garage full of M Models.


It's been a while since we had a thread like this, more pages of generalising, slagging off and fantastic anecdotes please. Can't wait for the one with the old guy who was wearing a bin bag to buy a rolls Royce with cash and a salesman in a shiny suit ignored him so he bought ten bentleys and the salesman got fired and lost his house etc etc etc.

Quoted for truth.

Some day I hope to be in a position to buy a new car just so that I can massage my ego by being a condescending prick to hapless sales people.

There's a running theme in these threads of "testing" sales people on their knowledge. Granted, there are plenty of knobs selling cars (and indeed in every other walk of life) but the apparent need of some posters to assert their status as automotive experts by catching out those on the sales floor says more about them than it does about the dealers.

[HJMS123]

andymc said:

no not you all pal, just most buyers aren't clued in hence the lack of product knowledge

So a sales person shouldn't have that much technical/product knowledge because most buyers don't? Please tell me you don't work anywhere near a sales team.

[iSore]

I was a BMW sales drone back in 2009/10. Judging by the responses here I should have stuck at it. I was early 40's then so far from being a slippery young oik in a suit I was a 'mature' sort who took pride in my job. To quote someone else "I'm not selling you a car, but you might like to buy one from me".

Trouble is though, the pay is so poor now that most of my colleagues are now doing something else or have moved up into management. That's left a black hole to be filled with 24 year olds straight from tele sales, lured by the implied prestige of 25 grand a year, company A3 and a Next suit. I too find these sorts almost intimidating but as I know how st their lot can be, I feel more pity than anything else.

My local Sytner emporium has some excellent sales staff though.

It's not an easy job, and there are enough smartarse punters to take the shine off. But remember this: go into an Audi/Merc/BMW dealer acting the big/clever guy and don't buy, it's not a problem for the salesman - because there is a long. seemingly limitless stream of buyers who will, an hour or so after you have marched out feeling superior and clever.

[boz1]

BigLion said:

Car salesman in the bmw dealership I went to today. Truly a fascinating breed of animal and a unique species.

Whilst waiting to pick up my car from the service I observed some behaviour that David Attenborough would have been proud to have narrated on.

The strong purposeful walks, to own the space.

The strong and unrelenting eye contact.

The marking of territory with strong aftershave.

The unnecessary loud communication to show confidence.

Then the mating ritual ahead of a car purchase - a bit like a peacock showing off its feathers - one salesman had a cravat and the others had things like matching hankies in their pockets.

Honestly, they all looked like such prize plums - for goodness sake do dealers think people are in the 80s still. Yes, dress smart but don't go to such a stupid extreme and behave like Gorillas. People are buying a car, not a taking a princesses hand in marriage.

Thank god the service department were sane, otherwise I would have never returned to that place of pretentiousness ever again !!!!

You are of course completely right and we can thank The Apprentice for helping create a warped perception of what "business" involves. The popular perception now seems to be some wide-boy buying some crap product (forget the process of designing it, obtaining components parts, transporting etc... that's not closing deals, so it's not "business"!) as cheaply as possible and negotiating to screw their poor customer for as much as they can before assaulting them with a crushing handshake.

Edited by boz1 on Friday 28th October 11:54

[Username888]

Car dealers or estate agents? Who's worse?

[anonymous-user]

Butter Face said:

Can we just wrap this up now to save 50 pages.

Some people are good at their job
Some people aren't
Some people lie
Most people don't
Some people like to wear expensive suits
Some people don't
Some people think they're amazing
Most people just want to do a job and go home

Transpose to any job/industry/whatever and that's really it.

Or we can have another 46 pages of one sided anecdotes, jibes about shiny suits and posturing.

I think we've found a car salesman...

You've got your own special secret PH place to moan about us punters, don't get your knickers in a twist because people have an opportunity to moan back.

And its not ALL car dealers, just the bullst merchants, which if you are not one, then you have no need to feel offended.

Last dealer I spoke to told me I didn't want a diesel Saab for 18k miles/year, but a (older, leggier) V6 Mondeo. And then before I'd even said "no thanks" told me he wanted a deposit before I could test drive it. Pump Hill Garage, in Clacton. Total shyster.

Don't take it personally, stereotypes exist for a reason. (I'm a highways engineer, everyone thinks I hate cars and drivers and everything I do is a conniving trap to force people in to fine-able, endorsable offences, and to force people out of cars and on to pushbikes - it couldn't be further from the truth!)

[93DW]

Ninja59 said:

My BMW dealer started on poor ground not approached by anyone or anything.

In sales this is something we can never win on! You approach someone and get "We were just looking and the sales guy just pounced on us, let us browse in peace!" if you don't approach someone you get the quoted response or "nobody approached me they must not want to sell cars!"

[ThunderGuts]

I have a couple of friends who are salesmen - one for BMW and one for Skoda.

When we were after our last car it was very nice just to go in and work through it as mates - tick the boxes we want, get guided away from the stuff which may not be useful / a value add for us.

Very refreshing.