Outer CV joint stuck in hub, what next?

Outer CV joint stuck in hub, what next?

Author
Discussion

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Hi folks, I've a front wheel bearing to do in a Honda Jazz I recently acquired, the problem being I can't get the CV joint free from the hub. Started out with a hub puller (the type that bolts to the hub) and impact wrench (half decent CP air powered one), then hammered the hell out of the puller, then engine on and brakes pressed on and a breaker bar with extension lever on the puller, more hammering, heat, WD40, air hammer, bigger air hammer and finally a drive round the yard full lock/heavy braking with the nut on very loosely. It's still not budging!

Any more suggestions? Thinking about parking next to a wall and using a Porta-power against the axle though not sure if the WW2 walls of our garage will cope laugh .

Thanks in advance!

battered

4,088 posts

146 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
I'm not taking the mick, but are you sure that you're not overlooking a circlip or similar?

GreenV8S

30,150 posts

283 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Don't know whether the Jazz has a different setup, but other Hondas have a straight forward setup where the stub axle is secured with a hub nut. There are no extra circlips of unusual tricks to remove them. You just remove the nut and press the axle out of the hub. It may need several tons force, plus penetrating oil, and time for the oil to soak in, and I think your approach of applying a big preload with a puller and then hitting it with a big hammer is a sensible approach. If you get completely stumped, you could take the brakes off and take the whole upright/drive shaft assembly to somebody with a press.

ETA Don't know what size puller you're using or how tight you're doing it, but you could easily need 5+ tons. If you aren't sure whether your puller is up to that sort of force - get a bigger one!

Megaflow

9,347 posts

224 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
You say you have tried driving it around with the nut on loosely. Have you removed the bottom arm from the upright yet? You won't get the driveshaft out without removing the bottom arm from the upright.

imagineifyeswill

1,224 posts

165 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
This is a fairly common problem on Volvo V70s, Ive done a few and Ive had to use a puller with a 10 ton hydraulic ram and still use a big hammer, its always worked eventually though.

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
I'm fairly confident there's nothing else holding it in place. This is the tool I'm using, in the 10 or so years I've had it it's never let me down!


To answer the question about the bottom ball joint, nope, it's still on. The nut started to round with the open end of the spanner so my initial plan was to get a bit clearance between it and the C V joint to get the ring on (I've always used this method on Vauxhall, Saabs and probably a few more without issue, can't see this jalopy being any different). I don't want to cut the nut off and make the car unmovable yet - plus the added cost of a new arm!

I've thought about getting a 10 ton hydraulic puller like this, https://www.amazon.co.uk/Generic-Hydraulic-Bearing... but from what I've read online it might not be man enough. I guess the other option could be split the outer CV if I can or pull the shaft eek, cut the ball joint nut off carefully and try and find a man with a bigger press!

Jakg

3,451 posts

167 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Lugy said:
I've thought about getting a 10 ton hydraulic puller like this, https://www.amazon.co.uk/Generic-Hydraulic-Bearing... but from what I've read online it might not be man enough. I guess the other option could be split the outer CV if I can or pull the shaft eek, cut the ball joint nut off carefully and try and find a man with a bigger press!
Obviously I would recommend checking you've not missed anything first - but I've got one of those 10 ton pullers and it's fantastic. There's nothing it wont shift, and plenty of jobs I wouldn't of been able to do without it - but just bear in mind even if something shouldn't move, with 10 tons it probably will bend...

GreenV8S

30,150 posts

283 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Lugy said:
To answer the question about the bottom ball joint, nope, it's still on.
You may find it's easier to leave the ball joint alone and take the arm off the car instead - especially if the ball joint is proving difficult to remove.

That doesn't look like a particularly big puller, and if it isn't doing the job then get a bigger one - plus penetrating oil applied liberally and left to soak.

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
I've come across a work sheet which would confirm there's nothing else holding it on, it seems to imply it should come apart easily laugh.

There's a 10 ton puller on Amazon with quite quick delivery for £40 which could be worth a punt, I'll not get back to the car until Friday now but will report back.

Cheers again!

battered

4,088 posts

146 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Joys of home mechanicing. I remember as a kid changing brake discs with my dad. Haynes said "remove the caliper, remove the disc retaining screw, lift off the disc". Real world said "do all this then apply a bloody big puller that will bend the edges of the disc over, then smash hell out of it with a hammer, you may need to take it off in bits". We nearly did. Since then "lift off the disc" has had mythological status and been used to describe anything that needs smashing into small bits to work.

M32Guy

62 posts

88 months

Saturday 3rd December 2016
quotequote all
Air chisel never fails in this situation. Any local garages you could take it too just to brake it free?

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Sunday 4th December 2016
quotequote all
battered said:
Joys of home mechanicing. I remember as a kid changing brake discs with my dad. Haynes said "remove the caliper, remove the disc retaining screw, lift off the disc". Real world said "do all this then apply a bloody big puller that will bend the edges of the disc over, then smash hell out of it with a hammer, you may need to take it off in bits". We nearly did. Since then "lift off the disc" has had mythological status and been used to describe anything that needs smashing into small bits to work.
hehe Tell me about it, just about every job I do I'm left wondering why I shouldn't wander down to the local BMW garage and do what the rest of the people do!

M32guy, I borrowed a decent air chisel from the garage next to us, that was his suggestion.

Thinking about it, I might just detach the suspension arm and remove the whole shebang then dodge away with that. The hydraulic puller would be nice to have though..... laugh.

Evoluzione

10,345 posts

242 months

Sunday 4th December 2016
quotequote all
I would have put some intense heat on it by now....

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Sunday 4th December 2016
quotequote all
I've tried a bit heat from a propane torch but unless my physics has let me down (entirely possible!), I only want to heat the part of the hub inside the bearing, otherwise the stub axle will expand and be even tighter?

S0 What

3,358 posts

171 months

Sunday 4th December 2016
quotequote all
I've had this very issue in the past (way to often) i usually remove the hub with the outer CV still in it so i can lay it on it's back to let the pentrating oil sit and soak into (not just run off the face of) the slpine/drivshaft interface, load up the puller (same as you show above), heat the area then bugger off home for the eve and let it cool, usually i come back to find parts strewn all over the worshop, nowdays i have a 20T press as i'm older wiser and to knackerd to roll about on the floor sodding about with PITA stuck driveshafts laugh
if your near N London and can get the hub off i wil happyly flex the might of my press for free just to watch it go bang and fly appart (and run screaming like a little girl as it does so) laugh

Edited by S0 What on Sunday 4th December 16:51

chryslerben

1,168 posts

158 months

Sunday 4th December 2016
quotequote all
S0 What said:
I've had this very issue in the past (way to often) i usually remove the hub with the outer CV still in it so i can lay it on it's back to let the pentrating oil sit and soak into (not just run off the face of) the slpine/drivshaft interface, load up the puller (same as you show above), heat the area then bugger off home for the eve and let it cool, usually i come back to find parts strewn all over the worshop, nowdays i have a 20T press as i'm older wiser and to knackerd to roll about on the floor sodding about with PITA stuck driveshafts laugh
if your near N London and can get the hub off i wil happyly flex the might of my press for free just to watch it go bang and fly appart (and run screaming like a little girl as it does so) laugh

Edited by S0 What on Sunday 4th December 16:51
Haha this seems far to familiar especially the bit about having a 20 ton press.

That's my advice though op drop the shaft out of the box with the hub and press that badboy out.

R E S T E C P

660 posts

104 months

Tuesday 6th December 2016
quotequote all
Hydraulic Press

"Vee must deeel vith it"

Lugy

Original Poster:

830 posts

182 months

Tuesday 6th December 2016
quotequote all
Yup, doing it off car is definitely they way I'm going to go for. No idea when to be fair due to work commitments but I was hoping to put it in for an MOT next week!

Petrolhead_Rich

4,659 posts

191 months

Wednesday 7th December 2016
quotequote all
Heating, then allowing to cool will break the (presumably corrosion) bond between the stub and the hub, heat up, leave to cool, heat up, leave to cool!

Be aware that brake fluid and rubber hoses are VERY flammable though!!!

julian64

14,317 posts

253 months

Tuesday 20th December 2016
quotequote all
Heat and cold here but with a twist

When you heat the thing up its slow and often its impossible not to heat both up at the same time.

If you get the hub to 60deg you'll no longer be able to touch it with your hands, and it'll take quite a while with a good burner. Much higher and you have the change of burning or igniting something. All that for probably a 50-60 deg differential in temperature frown

Luckily I have access to liquid nitrogen. Having heated up to a modest heat with the burner, I then dribble liquid nitrogen onto the CV. and usually just put a glove on to catch it before it hits the floor smile The liquid nitrogen is -200, so the differential is huge. Its fun to do.

You can buy isopropanyl alcohol or freeze spray from a lot of DIY places which isn't as good but probably safer. They use it to freeze water in pipes for quick repairs.