anybody here actually own a Tesla?

[MarshPhantom]

Max_Torque said:

Unlike your old volvo, the typical Tesla is fully charged by the time you come out the house each morning. So unless you regularly drive 200 miles no stop, i fail to see the issue. And if you do drive 200 miles every day, the the bigger issue is that at that rate of mileage accumulation, your Tesla is going to depreciate like it's falling off a cliff......

All great assuming you don't want/need to use your car in the evening.

I often do.

[kambites]

MarshPhantom said:

All great assuming you don't want/need to use your car in the evening.

I often do.

As long as you haven't done 200+ miles that day, why is that a problem? Unless you regularly leave it in public car parks overnight? You can get 200 mile's worth of charge from a home charger in ~8 hours from a standard domestic supply. I think running three-phase supplies into domestic properties will become considerably cheaper and more common as EVs really start to take off, too.

Of course the things aren't suitable for everyone, some people will drive too much or have nowhere to charge, or whatever... but wanting to use your car in the evenings certainly isn't a barrier.

Edited by kambites on Monday 9th January 08:25

[MarshPhantom]

kambites said:

MarshPhantom said:

All great assuming you don't want/need to use your car in the evening.

I often do.

As long as you haven't done 200+ miles that day, why is that a problem? Unless you regularly leave it in public car parks overnight? You can get 200 mile's worth of charge from a home charger in ~8 hours from a standard domestic supply. I think running three-phase supplies into domestic properties will become considerably cheaper and more common as EVs really start to take off, too.

Of course the things aren't suitable for everyone, but wanting to use your car in the evenings certainly isn't a barrier.

Edited by kambites on Monday 9th January 08:24

I've seen quite a few as posh mini cabs, I thought a lot of cabs/taxis didn''t really stop work, just changed drivers.

Who knows.

[kambites]

MarshPhantom said:

I've seen quite a few as posh mini cabs, I thought a lot of cabs/taxis didn''t really stop work, just changed drivers.

Who knows.

I suppose the taxi companies have very high speed chargers installed at their bases. You get pure EV buses too, which must have the same problem.

[98elise]

MarshPhantom said:

Max_Torque said:

Unlike your old volvo, the typical Tesla is fully charged by the time you come out the house each morning. So unless you regularly drive 200 miles no stop, i fail to see the issue. And if you do drive 200 miles every day, the the bigger issue is that at that rate of mileage accumulation, your Tesla is going to depreciate like it's falling off a cliff......

All great assuming you don't want/need to use your car in the evening.

I often do.

Only if you drive 200 miles per day and have already empties the battery. Some people will not suit EV's. In every EV thread somone says they don't work because they need to do 500mile per day without stops.

Its a bit like pointing out that a 458 is no good for you because you regularly need to drive 4 people and luggage. No one car will meet everyones needs. The average person drives about 30 miles per day. That means they would need to charge once per week. I drive 130miles per day and an EV will be fine for me (I have a tesla on order)

[MarshPhantom]

98elise said:

MarshPhantom said:

Max_Torque said:

Unlike your old volvo, the typical Tesla is fully charged by the time you come out the house each morning. So unless you regularly drive 200 miles no stop, i fail to see the issue. And if you do drive 200 miles every day, the the bigger issue is that at that rate of mileage accumulation, your Tesla is going to depreciate like it's falling off a cliff......

All great assuming you don't want/need to use your car in the evening.

I often do.

Only if you drive 200 miles per day and have already empties the battery. Some people will not suit EV's. In every EV thread somone says they don't work because they need to do 500mile per day without stops.

Its a bit like pointing out that a 458 is no good for you because you regularly need to drive 4 people and luggage. No one car will meet everyones needs. The average person drives about 30 miles per day. That means they would need to charge once per week. I drive 130miles per day and an EV will be fine for me (I have a tesla on order)

They are ideal for people that don't use their car very much and have a drive to park them on for charging, which limits appeal. How are residuals for older EVs?

[kambites]

MarshPhantom said:

They are ideal for people that don't use their car very much and have a drive to park them on for charging, which limits appeal. How are residuals for older EVs?

"People who don't use their car very much" is 90% of the population though in this context (the median average is about 15 miles a day; I think the 90% percentile is unlikely to be above 200 miles), and "people who have a drive to park on" was around (very roughly) 50% at the last census so that's a pretty big target market to get going on.

Residuals are a rather complicated question because with a few of the early EVs, the battery was rented rather than owned. I think EVs, even more than ICE powered cars, tend to be leased rather than bought anyway. An enormous number of them were company cars.

Edited by kambites on Monday 9th January 09:09

[anonymous-user]

The chap who owns our village shop (and a few others beside) has a 75. It's obviously very impressive from a performance and technology perspective, but it's bland as can be in the looks department, looks more like a £30k car than a £70k car, especially inside. It also seems to lack any character to speak of.

I'm glad they're being built, and they will no-doubt advance the efficiency of personal transport significantly in the coming years. I'll watch from the wings until they make something that is more compelling for my lifestyle requirements - but until then I'll enjoy hearing how others are getting on.

[MarshPhantom]

kambites said:

MarshPhantom said:

They are ideal for people that don't use their car very much and have a drive to park them on for charging, which limits appeal. How are residuals for older EVs?

"People who don't use their car very much" is 90% of the population though in this context (the median average is about 15 miles a day; I think the 90% percentile is unlikely to be above 200 miles), and "people who have a drive to park on" was around (very roughly) 50% at the last census so that's a pretty big target market to get going on.

Residuals are a rather complicated question because with a few of the early EVs, the battery was rented rather than owned. I think EVs, even more than ICE powered cars, tend to be leased rather than bought anyway. An enormous number of them were company cars.

Edited by kambites on Monday 9th January 09:09

Some people may not do much mileage but I don't know why people would buy a car that wouldn't get them London to Brum and back in a day, for example.

[Chr1sch]

jamoor said:

DoubleD said:

I havent driven one. Im sure its a nice car though.

Quote from "what car"

At faster speeds the i3 can feel a bit twitchy and nervous, though, so it isn't as fun to drive along a twisting country road as you might imagine.

It seems to be a decent town car. But it doesnt appear to drive like a hot hatch type car and it certainly doesnt look sporty to me.

The i3 is a gimmick, it's a funny looking car that isn't exactly desirable. It looks odd, has a cheapened interior and will date horribly.

It's one of the examples of why electric cars have e struggled to become mainstream.

I would agree it isnt a hot hatch, and its top speed of 94 is indicative of that. I've not had any issues with the long journey piece but the twitchiness i get due to the speed of the rack and steering lock to lend its self to that at higher speeds. (performance from 35-60 ish is very enjoyable!)

I 100% disagree with the gimmick statement, the looks are a bit marmite and i'd never dispute that, (i for one think it looks great but thats just personal taste) however the interior is a fantastic place to sit, it is beautifully made, stylish and loaded with technology.

In terms of mainstream adoption, go and sit in a Prius, Ioniq, Honda 'thing', or Nissan Leaf - all hideous to look at, sit in, cheap plastic etc etc. They also look crap - at least the i3 has attempted to be slightly stylish whether you like them or not.

As i said earlier, for a person doing anything up to 100 miles or so a day, the i3 makes a fantastic and every enjoyable car. In terms of next, i'd like to try a Tesla Model 3, but for now the i3 is by far the best electric car out there.

[Chr1sch]

MarshPhantom said:

kambites said:

MarshPhantom said:

They are ideal for people that don't use their car very much and have a drive to park them on for charging, which limits appeal. How are residuals for older EVs?

"People who don't use their car very much" is 90% of the population though in this context (the median average is about 15 miles a day; I think the 90% percentile is unlikely to be above 200 miles), and "people who have a drive to park on" was around (very roughly) 50% at the last census so that's a pretty big target market to get going on.

Residuals are a rather complicated question because with a few of the early EVs, the battery was rented rather than owned. I think EVs, even more than ICE powered cars, tend to be leased rather than bought anyway. An enormous number of them were company cars.

Edited by kambites on Monday 9th January 09:09

Some people may not do much mileage but I don't know why people would buy a car that wouldn't get them London to Brum and back in a day, for example.

I agree to a degree, but its all about the use case. We have 2 cars, so don't need 2 that do that mileage (plus you can charge in 40 mins anyway) but either way, the Virgin Train i get every day will do it in half the time anyway lol

[kambites]

MarshPhantom said:

Some people may not do much mileage but I don't know why people would buy a car that wouldn't get them London to Brum and back in a day, for example.

Because they don't ever drive from London to Birmingham and back in a day? I can't remember the last time either of our cars did a trip a Tesla couldn't comfortably manage but it's certainly been at least three years quite possibly more like 10.

[rscott]

MarshPhantom said:

Some people may not do much mileage but I don't know why people would buy a car that wouldn't get them London to Brum and back in a day, for example.

London to Brum & back is what, 250 miles? So about the range of a Tesla.. You might need a quick topup, but you'd probably also need to fill up with fuel at some point along the way too.

[rxe]

The problem I have with these discussions is the level of certainty that people have about their future commutes. If you're in the market for an £80K /1000 a month car, I would guess that you are in a job that requires a certain level of flexibility in terms of location. Unlikely to be "pole up at the same office every day 9 - 5". Some people will get good money doing exactly that, but my experience is that this is the exception.

My commute has changed hugely in the last few years:

2013 - very random, lots of sites, ranging from 30 each way to 300 each way. Hard to plan.
2014 - daily commute 0 - walked to work - EV depreciating horribly donig nothing
2015 - daily commute, 30 each way - perfect for an EV
2016 - weekly commute - 200 each way, short journeys other end, no charging at hotels or sites - EV as useful as a brick
2017 - I have no idea yet, but it is shaping up to be 0 again.

[Chr1sch]

rxe said:

The problem I have with these discussions is the level of certainty that people have about their future commutes. If you're in the market for an £80K /1000 a month car, I would guess that you are in a job that requires a certain level of flexibility in terms of location. Unlikely to be "pole up at the same office every day 9 - 5". Some people will get good money doing exactly that, but my experience is that this is the exception.

My commute has changed hugely in the last few years:

2013 - very random, lots of sites, ranging from 30 each way to 300 each way. Hard to plan.
2014 - daily commute 0 - walked to work - EV depreciating horribly donig nothing
2015 - daily commute, 30 each way - perfect for an EV
2016 - weekly commute - 200 each way, short journeys other end, no charging at hotels or sites - EV as useful as a brick
2017 - I have no idea yet, but it is shaping up to be 0 again.

100% agree, im in a sales role so my commute is largely just to a train station, however, i could need to do a 400 mile round trip and dont want a 40min stop to charge up.

Thats why my wife (who will NEVER do more than 150-200 miles in a day) has the i3, for her use case its perfect. For me EV's are a long way off being applicable for anyone who may need to do more than 200 miles p.d

[SWoll]

rscott said:

MarshPhantom said:

Some people may not do much mileage but I don't know why people would buy a car that wouldn't get them London to Brum and back in a day, for example.

London to Brum & back is what, 250 miles? So about the range of a Tesla.. You might need a quick topup, but you'd probably also need to fill up with fuel at some point along the way too.

Don't be daft. The vast majority of modern petrol/diesel cars would happily do that trip twice on a tank of fuel at cruising speeds.

ICE would be perfect for my wife as she runs around town and rarely covers more than 100 miles in a day so will be looking at the ptions closely when her current car goes back. I cover 25K+ a year and regularly do 3-400 mile round trips so at the moment I'd have concerns from a practicality standpoint as wouldn't want to have to plan my day around re-charging.

[jamoor]

Chr1sch said:

I would agree it isnt a hot hatch, and its top speed of 94 is indicative of that. I've not had any issues with the long journey piece but the twitchiness i get due to the speed of the rack and steering lock to lend its self to that at higher speeds. (performance from 35-60 ish is very enjoyable!)

I 100% disagree with the gimmick statement, the looks are a bit marmite and i'd never dispute that, (i for one think it looks great but thats just personal taste) however the interior is a fantastic place to sit, it is beautifully made, stylish and loaded with technology.

In terms of mainstream adoption, go and sit in a Prius, Ioniq, Honda 'thing', or Nissan Leaf - all hideous to look at, sit in, cheap plastic etc etc. They also look crap - at least the i3 has attempted to be slightly stylish whether you like them or not.

As i said earlier, for a person doing anything up to 100 miles or so a day, the i3 makes a fantastic and every enjoyable car. In terms of next, i'd like to try a Tesla Model 3, but for now the i3 is by far the best electric car out there.

I'd say the Tesla model S is the best electric car out there.

It's packed with features, it looks great, is fast, has a supercharger network and most importantly it isn't an ICE type car with an electric motor, it is an entirely new type of car from the ground up.

[kambites]

Chr1sch said:

100% agree, im in a sales role so my commute is largely just to a train station, however, i could need to do a 400 mile round trip and dont want a 40min stop to charge up.

There are of course quite a lot of people for whom this will be true, which is why you'll be able to buy ICE powered cars for the foreseeable future.

[dtmpower]

C7 JFW said:

- I regularly do 3-400 miles journeys (up to 6-800 miles some days) so range/charging pace is a problem.
- There aren't enough chargers
- These vehicles are much too expensive

C7 , you are very much not the target market, imagine the average commuter who works out of town, 10-20 miles to the office, maximum 50 a day with a school run or some shopping after work.

400 miles in one go is not common.. for a start in the South East that would take 4-5 hours in busy times. Are you a taxi or private hire driver or a sales rep ?

[fushion julz]

I am far from ever being able to own (any) new car, far less a Tesla.
However, for the first time I have had a look at used Vauxhall Amperas/Chevy Volts. Now selling from circa £7.5k so a reasonable price. They still have the balance of a 6 year battery warranty so at least 2 years' worth. The pure EV with Rex make more sense to me to have as an everyday car.

My commute is usually 20 miles each way, mostly motorway and I regularly do trips of up to 250 miles each way...Hence a pure EV would be only good for commuting and then only if it had at least 40miles of range. The only things putting me off are the a) front wheel drive b) the lack of space in the boot and c) only 4 seats.