RE: Facelifted Audi RS3 Sportback revealed
Discussion
aspirated said:
QuattroDave said:
The Mperformance exhaust was designed for the car and built by BMW so I wouldn't consider it non-standard in the sense you seem to be intimating, it's a performance option, hence the name.
Anywho, your point is null and void for suggesting it sounds like a bag of bolts as although it doesn't sound as nice as the RS3 (but them I'm biased from my URQ owning days) it's easily nicer sounding than any other car in that segment and many from the segment above. Plus are you seriously telling us that you've listened to an M135/140 with every type of exhaust option available for the car?
The performance exhaust is obviously non-standard because it's an optional extra i.e it doesn't come as standard ffsAnywho, your point is null and void for suggesting it sounds like a bag of bolts as although it doesn't sound as nice as the RS3 (but them I'm biased from my URQ owning days) it's easily nicer sounding than any other car in that segment and many from the segment above. Plus are you seriously telling us that you've listened to an M135/140 with every type of exhaust option available for the car?
Not every type, only the ones I've heard, and they all sound pretty similar.
nickfrog said:
I am not convinced Aspirated has had a chance to drive it either.
I don't recall ever claiming that?Can you name which exhausts you have heard? Either way a bag of bolts the M'lites do not sound.
Daft move terry. Don't you know you could have easily fixed the wobbly handling with m4 lower control arms and a set of aftermarket springs? That's the owner stock answer.
Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
nunpuncher said:
Daft move terry. Don't you know you could have easily fixed the wobbly handling with m4 lower control arms and a set of aftermarket springs? That's the owner stock answer.
Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
Yeah even as an owner I'm not sold on that, as you rightly say if BMW have it in their parts bin, the only reason that could be given is cannibalising M2 sales but even then that doesn't make that much sense as they could have potentially sold more or offered lower discount on the m lites with the magic fix.Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
nunpuncher said:
Daft move terry. Don't you know you could have easily fixed the wobbly handling with m4 lower control arms and a set of aftermarket springs? That's the owner stock answer.
Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
My modding days are past me I'm afraid I just want it to work out of the box. Lowering springs would effect the ride quality and it's not that simple with adaptive so the best option is go for the Bmw upgraded springs etc which is not cheap at all.Although, if it's so easy to fix I don't understand why BMW didn't do so during the 2+ model refreshes. Especially since they seemed to have the magically transformative parts in the cupboard.
The MPE also loses the valves so it's permnantly open which is no use for the long Motorway drives I have to do at times as it can get a bit drony.
I'll see how it goes with the TTS I certainly won't miss the unseasy feeling coming back up the M6 and unexpectedly the snow came on hard. My M135 was all over the shop. If I end up in an M4 I'll be buying a winter set of tyres/wheels
Edited by TerryCTR on Sunday 12th February 10:26
I was joking (as I'm sure you know). I'm sure the TT will be very good. I much preferred my golf R to the m135i for it's general usefulness, better practicality and no less interactive when pushed.
Im not into modding cars either and don't think it should be left to an owner to try to resolve handling issues.
Im not into modding cars either and don't think it should be left to an owner to try to resolve handling issues.
nunpuncher said:
I was joking (as I'm sure you know). I'm sure the TT will be very good. I much preferred my golf R to the m135i for it's general usefulness, better practicality and no less interactive when pushed.
Im not into modding cars either and don't think it should be left to an owner to try to resolve handling issues.
Yeah mate I detected the sarcastic tone Im not into modding cars either and don't think it should be left to an owner to try to resolve handling issues.
I rated the R when test driving, not overly fussed on the looks as strangely I find the GTI/GTD much nicer to look at but it was the 7 month wait that put me off and got me into the M135i in the first place.
The TTS arrives march just in time to beat this tax hike so I am hoping that I'll keep this one longer than 5 months this time!
Edited by TerryCTR on Sunday 12th February 11:08
This RS3 certainly as the numbers on paper and no doubt it will be a bullet but it won't make it a great car. It needs to be engaging and interactive.
There is a modern breed of car enthusiasts. A lot of people find it exciting accelerating in a straight line. Hey I enjoy a bit of acceleration but where I feel most connected to a car is in the corners. Not to say I drive on the edge on public roads, that would be irresponsible and dangerous but if a car is designed to go around corners well and transmits that feedback to the driver even at slower speeds you can feel it.
I had an S3 before and it was a competent and we'll made car if somewhat unexciting. Maybe a Golf GTI would have been better. Laughable as it may sound I then got an E46 320d for tip runs and the funny thing is that RWD setup with a chappy 2.0d felt much nicer to drive. Go and figure that one out...
Since then I have spent my money on a few RWD cars, different brands still go back to BMW for me it works the best. Audio are nice cars but just not for me, for now anyway. Never say never
There is a modern breed of car enthusiasts. A lot of people find it exciting accelerating in a straight line. Hey I enjoy a bit of acceleration but where I feel most connected to a car is in the corners. Not to say I drive on the edge on public roads, that would be irresponsible and dangerous but if a car is designed to go around corners well and transmits that feedback to the driver even at slower speeds you can feel it.
I had an S3 before and it was a competent and we'll made car if somewhat unexciting. Maybe a Golf GTI would have been better. Laughable as it may sound I then got an E46 320d for tip runs and the funny thing is that RWD setup with a chappy 2.0d felt much nicer to drive. Go and figure that one out...
Since then I have spent my money on a few RWD cars, different brands still go back to BMW for me it works the best. Audio are nice cars but just not for me, for now anyway. Never say never
All these cars we discuss are very fast road cars. However, the RS3, M2 and A45AMG are at the top end, unlike the M135i, Golf R and S3. Therefore, I think they should be a lot more than simply fast road cars that is why they are compared and tested on track. If the RS3 falls short on track (in dry conditions) so be it.
Two track days a year represents approx 3% of the year, so it is likely that these car will not see a track.
I understand the traction issue in wet conditions especially in some parts of the country. I simply drive slower in hazardous conditions. I think the main test should be rolling starts. 0-60 in damp conditions AWD will always win. Rolling starts anything from 30mph would be more realistic on the road.
AWD cars are more secure when driving very fast in hazardous condition, but unlikely to be in normal conditions. For the record I have never driven any of these powerful AWD vehicles.
Two track days a year represents approx 3% of the year, so it is likely that these car will not see a track.
I understand the traction issue in wet conditions especially in some parts of the country. I simply drive slower in hazardous conditions. I think the main test should be rolling starts. 0-60 in damp conditions AWD will always win. Rolling starts anything from 30mph would be more realistic on the road.
AWD cars are more secure when driving very fast in hazardous condition, but unlikely to be in normal conditions. For the record I have never driven any of these powerful AWD vehicles.
PixelpeepS3 said:
So to sum up reasons why you wont buy it and for the same reason i will....
Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
Yeah, but you are still wrong to buy one, ok?Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
QuattroDave said:
There's a huge f'ing difference between an exhaust that's been whacked on by a back street tyre & exhaust place and one that's been specifically designed by the oem manufacturer, that's what I'm trying to explain to you but are unwilling or unable to grasp.
Can you name which exhausts you have heard? Either way a bag of bolts the M'lites do not sound.
I do understand the difference between a custom exhaust and a manufacturer designed one. However what I'm referring to as 'bag of bolts' is the unnecessary crap popping and banging that the Performance and other exhausts do in an attempt to keep up with the latest trend, e.g;Can you name which exhausts you have heard? Either way a bag of bolts the M'lites do not sound.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntxaYIh4YvA - this video at 37 sec
Can't hold a candle to the RS3 w/Sports Exhaust or Dynamic Pack, especially with a secondary de-cat, my initial point
Alucidnation said:
PixelpeepS3 said:
So to sum up reasons why you wont buy it and for the same reason i will....
Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
Yeah, but you are still wrong to buy one, ok?Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
A nice round arbitrary number. Woo.
I quite liked the 225bhp S3 of 15 years ago, despite knowing full well it was s
te, but this is so so bland. Another car for people who aren't into cars, and I suppose that's the smart thing to do - most people aren't into cars.
I can't believe at my age I'm coming back around to the idea of buying an Integra... I don't think there's a single new car on the market that is both achievable and desirable. It's an entire market of 1500kg+ lard arses, driven by little heads poking up above the shoulder line.
I quite liked the 225bhp S3 of 15 years ago, despite knowing full well it was s
te, but this is so so bland. Another car for people who aren't into cars, and I suppose that's the smart thing to do - most people aren't into cars. I can't believe at my age I'm coming back around to the idea of buying an Integra... I don't think there's a single new car on the market that is both achievable and desirable. It's an entire market of 1500kg+ lard arses, driven by little heads poking up above the shoulder line.
PunterCam said:
incorrect stereotyping comment
life is compromises - RS3 means you can have your cake and eat it rather than having your cake and then dying because you're not quite the driving god you thought you was and failed to spot that wet bit of tarmac as you hit the throttle and ended up being a stain on a 300 year old oak tree.PixelpeepS3 said:
Alucidnation said:
PixelpeepS3 said:
So to sum up reasons why you wont buy it and for the same reason i will....
Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
Yeah, but you are still wrong to buy one, ok?Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
981C said:
Apart from 0-20mph, you're utilising 5-7.6krpm for acceleration tests in the F80 and 6-8400 in the S65, so the delta is indeed quite large. Can you overlay the C63 AMG S power and torque?
As you say the delta is large hence the performance difference, that graph was from the F80 launch stuff BMW provided to show why a car with only 11hp more peak power can be quicker than the outgoing model. As far as the C63S vs. M3 question you raised, car and driver give the following from their instrumented tests (the weights are from their scales)
431hp/1643kg = PWR 262hp 0-100mph 8.5 and 0-150mph 20.8
510hp/1864kg = PWR 274hp 0-100mph 8.3 and 0-150mph 19.6
Which seems pretty fair to me similar PTWR due to the weight of the C63S giving similar 0-100 times in traction limited cars, over 100mph where power is more important than weight the C63S pulls away.
Anyway we're way off topic...
PixelpeepS3 said:
life is compromises - RS3 means you can have your cake and eat it rather than having your cake and then dying because you're not quite the driving god you thought you was and failed to spot that wet bit of tarmac as you hit the throttle and ended up being a stain on a 300 year old oak tree.
Rubbish. Having your cake and eating it? In what possible way?! That implies this car is both fun and usable - well it's certainly usable (in a 25mpg kind of way). Speed in itself isn't fun. Speed dates. And this car isn't all that fast.. Owning cars has always been a compromise; you compromised to have something special. Now the compromise is in the car, not the person. You buy something bland and compromise yourself.
But like I said, a car from people who aren't car people. They'll sell.
PixelpeepS3 said:
So to sum up reasons why you wont buy it and for the same reason i will....
Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
+1Dull = less attention from police and chavs
no fun to drive = i can make progress in all conditions without having a heart attack on my way to work
no manual = the commute & traffic in general will be more pleasant (+ slightly better MPG)
i've said it before and ill say it again, you shouldn't by a car based on how poorly it will perform for the 3% of its average life.
97% of the time you will be sitting in stop start traffic/pouring rain/just wanting to get home from work. and for that, it will be epic.
i'm in
Thats exactly how we feel about the A45.
Doesnt attract a lot of attention as it looks like pretty much every other A class "AMG Line".
Is a complete hoot when you're driving it.
Spends a fair amount of its time in heavy city traffic.
Ok I like it, I won't deny it but:
1) I could never afford it
2) I don't do mainstream; I know this will remain a relatively rare car but it's too similar to a S Line spangled TDI to the uninitiated
3) I like my cars to demand my concentration AND to tax my skill levels when pressing on, it's my interpretation of 'driving'
4) I do like a sleeper
With the above in mind, I'm just more determined to go to stage 6/7 with my 9-5 Aero
1) I could never afford it
2) I don't do mainstream; I know this will remain a relatively rare car but it's too similar to a S Line spangled TDI to the uninitiated
3) I like my cars to demand my concentration AND to tax my skill levels when pressing on, it's my interpretation of 'driving'
4) I do like a sleeper
With the above in mind, I'm just more determined to go to stage 6/7 with my 9-5 Aero
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