The Greateast Mass Production Engines Ever Made?

[bobski1]

throwing in the VW PD engines

[Mr2Mike]

bobski1 said:

throwing in the VW PD engines

Into a skip I hope. They had reasonable reliability and economy, but otherwise a harsh, rattly four banger diesel like all the rest.

[Hasbeen]

aeropilot said:

Fords 'Kent' engine has to have a claim on one of the greatest 4 cyl production engines, from use in mundane versions of the Anglia, Escort, Cortina, Capri, Fiesta, as well as Lotus/Caterham 7's, it also provided the power plant for what is probably the most successful 'feeder' single-seat racing series ever - Formula Ford. It also provided the basis of the Lotus-Ford Twin Cam used in the Cortina & Escort and Lotus 7, Elan & Europa, as well as the Cosworth FVA and BDA engines...right up to the fearsome 600hp Evolution version of the BDT used in the RS200 Group B rallycar, and it can even be linked to the Hart 420 F1 engines.

I have to agree with this. From a 1963 Morgan 4/4, through a Lotus 20 Formula Junior, A Brabham Oz Formula 2 & a Brabham Oz National Formula 1.5L to 1968 when I got my backside into a Brabham Repco, formula 1 I spent 5 years sitting behind or infront of one of the magnificent 105E/115E Cosworth, Holbay or home built Kent engines.

Some had expensive steel forged bottom ends, but some were still running Ford Anglia cast iron bottom ends, revving to 8,000 RPM & producing a hundred BHP per liter. Most Australian racing of that period depended on the little Ford, in one of it's various forms. It was only the low cost of it that made racing affordable for so many.

[Vitorio]

bobski1 said:

throwing in the VW PD engines

If any diesel were to be considered (which i would argue it shouldnt), id take Alfa/Fiat's JTD over the PD TDI any day, the first common rail engines, reliable, will run tons of miles, and the 2.4 5 cylinder is an amazing lump.

Either way, Diesel doesnt belong in the greatest engine ever

[Veeayt]

So most of the best engines were thrown in some of the worse cars.

[djt100]

AdeTuono said:

SBC 350. No contest.

This without doubt.

[catman]

djt100 said:

AdeTuono said:

SBC 350. No contest.

This without doubt.

No-one answered my question about the small block Ford. It also has been fitted to many cars over many years, and seems to me to be a great engine too.

Certainly, to my ears at least, it sounds much better than the Chevy engine.

Tim

[njw1]

aeropilot said:

Fords 'Kent' engine has to have a claim on one of the greatest 4 cyl production engines, from use in mundane versions of the Anglia, Escort, Cortina, Capri, Fiesta, as well as Lotus/Caterham 7's, it also provided the power plant for what is probably the most successful 'feeder' single-seat racing series ever - Formula Ford. It also provided the basis of the Lotus-Ford Twin Cam used in the Cortina & Escort and Lotus 7, Elan & Europa, as well as the Cosworth FVA and BDA engines...right up to the fearsome 600hp Evolution version of the BDT used in the RS200 Group B rallycar, and it can even be linked to the Hart 420 F1 engines.

I think one of the best engine sounds anyone can ever hear is a crossflow on twin dcoe's, 4 branch and straight through exhaust revving it's nuts off around a forest, awesome! I don't actually think there are many engines that can take abuse so well either.

[gazza285]

aeropilot said:

Fords 'Kent' engine has to have a claim on one of the greatest 4 cyl production engines, from use in mundane versions of the Anglia, Escort, Cortina, Capri, Fiesta, as well as Lotus/Caterham 7's, it also provided the power plant for what is probably the most successful 'feeder' single-seat racing series ever - Formula Ford. It also provided the basis of the Lotus-Ford Twin Cam used in the Cortina & Escort and Lotus 7, Elan & Europa, as well as the Cosworth FVA and BDA engines...right up to the fearsome 600hp Evolution version of the BDT used in the RS200 Group B rallycar, and it can even be linked to the Hart 420 F1 engines.

We know, all this was mention earlier in the thread...

[Total loss]

Sorry, the Ford V8 doesn't come close. Came out 8 years after the Chevy & finished 10 years before. Needs serious mods to equal the Chevy given same capacity. Sound is down to cam & exhaust, nothing to do with manufacturer.

[catman]

Total loss said:

Sorry, the Ford V8 doesn't come close. Came out 8 years after the Chevy & finished 10 years before. Needs serious mods to equal the Chevy given same capacity. Sound is down to cam & exhaust, nothing to do with manufacturer.

I thought that it was more to do with the firing order. When you say needs serious mods, are you referring to horsepower? Obviously, they can both be built in many different stages of tune.

Tim

[aeropilot]

catman said:

djt100 said:

AdeTuono said:

SBC 350. No contest.

This without doubt.

No-one answered my question about the small block Ford.

Great engine indeed, lasted from 1961 right through to the early 1990's. More compact than the SBC as well, and in Cobras's it won the 1965 World Sportscar GT Championship, and in GT40's won the '68 & '69 Le Mans 24hrs not to mention US Trans-Am racing prior to the introduction of the Cleveland engined BOSS 302's.

[catman]

aeropilot said:

Great engine indeed, lasted from 1961 right through to the early 1990's. More compact than the SBC as well, and in Cobras's it won the 1965 World Sportscar GT Championship, and in GT40's won the '68 & '69 Le Mans 24hrs not to mention US Trans-Am racing prior to the introduction of the Cleveland engined BOSS 302's.

My friend's Ram replica Cobra had a 351 Windsor engine, with under floor exhausts. At any revs from idle to max, the noise (quality and volume) was just fabulous.

We went to Le Mans in it. Many happy memories!

Tim

[aeropilot]

catman said:

My friend's Ram replica Cobra had a 351 Windsor engine, with under floor exhausts. At any revs from idle to max, the noise (quality and volume) was just fabulous.

Best noise is a 289 with quad IDA Webers - wonderful noise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I85lay7s1NU

[alabbasi]

catman said:

No-one answered my question about the small block Ford. It also has been fitted to many cars over many years, and seems to me to be a great engine too.

Certainly, to my ears at least, it sounds much better than the Chevy engine.

Tim

AFAIK, the Cleveland engines are big block quality in a small block form. The Windsor engines are sloppy. In most cases, Ford parts are a lot more expensive when compared to Chevy.

[Gareth1974]

I like the Napier Deltic engine, developed in the 1940's, produced from the 1950's, and still in use today with the Royal Navy. They had an excellent power to weight ratio, and are best known for their use in railway locomotives. They also sound great.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic

[aeropilot]

alabbasi said:

catman said:

No-one answered my question about the small block Ford. It also has been fitted to many cars over many years, and seems to me to be a great engine too.

Certainly, to my ears at least, it sounds much better than the Chevy engine.

Tim

AFAIK, the Cleveland engines are big block quality in a small block form.

That was the intention.....the Cleveland was effectively the replacement for the old FE big-blocks.

[Crafty_]

If people are chucking in the VW PD engine (I mean, really?) I'll throw in the Vauxhall XE engine. Virtually indestructible, 150hp but 150lb/ft too. Simple engine management meant it could easily be transplanted in to just about anything. Easily tuned in NA form it was also easy to convert to turbo.

Ultimately the winner has to be the SBC though.

[unpc]

aeropilot said:

catman said:

My friend's Ram replica Cobra had a 351 Windsor engine, with under floor exhausts. At any revs from idle to max, the noise (quality and volume) was just fabulous.

Best noise is a 289 with quad IDA Webers - wonderful noise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I85lay7s1NU

Agreed the 289 was a sweet revving thing. Not great for big power though. The SBC was probably one of the most versatile motors ever produced and was/is used in cars, RVs, buses, trucks, boats and even plant.

[Willy Nilly]

Gareth1974 said:

I like the Napier Deltic engine, developed in the 1940's, produced from the 1950's, and still in use today with the Royal Navy. They had an excellent power to weight ratio, and are best known for their use in railway locomotives. They also sound great.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic

'pparantly you're not allowed that sort of engine