£10k gbox bill on 4yr old Audi. Was it ever fit for purpose?
Discussion
nyxster said:
modern audis are unreliable garbage sold by dealers like mobile phones on 3 year plans. there is no goodwill because all they care about us signing you up for the new 2.5 percent improved model with slightly altered grill and upgraded instagram filter for another 299 a month. the reason they want ten grand for the gearbox is to encourage you to scrap the car and think 'if iI put that money into a new car i'll have a warranty' - they want these kind of HUGE BILLS AHEAD scare stories because it keeps the nervous nellies frightened into their never ending PCP deals, which is why their dealers are now just glorified oil and filter change shops.
I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
I couldn't put it better myself.I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
Expensive, pompous, unreliable brand that sell cars to people who only care about their image. Just perusing PH on a regular basis gives you an idea about how reliable these German vehicles actually are.
It's shame really because I do think that at one time, they were good cars. VAG vehicles of the mid to late 1990's to early 2000's weren't that bad.
Saying that, I think all established brands should take a serious look at the emerging manufacturers. As mentioned above, 7 year warranty on a Kia, 5 year on Hyundai, 3 year warranty on pretty much everything else. For people who aren't bothered about image, it's a no brainer.
None of this will affect Audi though. The parent group has just been through a big scandal. From what I can tell, they have emerged unscathed here in the UK. If something like that doesn't bother them, how will people moaning about their chocolate gearboxes fare?
funkyrobot said:
nyxster said:
modern audis are unreliable garbage sold by dealers like mobile phones on 3 year plans. there is no goodwill because all they care about us signing you up for the new 2.5 percent improved model with slightly altered grill and upgraded instagram filter for another 299 a month. the reason they want ten grand for the gearbox is to encourage you to scrap the car and think 'if iI put that money into a new car i'll have a warranty' - they want these kind of HUGE BILLS AHEAD scare stories because it keeps the nervous nellies frightened into their never ending PCP deals, which is why their dealers are now just glorified oil and filter change shops.
I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
I couldn't put it better myself.I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
when they hear the customer's overjoyed relief at having a warranty which has saved him from that 'massive bill'.funkyrobot said:
nyxster said:
modern audis are unreliable garbage sold by dealers like mobile phones on 3 year plans. there is no goodwill because all they care about us signing you up for the new 2.5 percent improved model with slightly altered grill and upgraded instagram filter for another 299 a month. the reason they want ten grand for the gearbox is to encourage you to scrap the car and think 'if iI put that money into a new car i'll have a warranty' - they want these kind of HUGE BILLS AHEAD scare stories because it keeps the nervous nellies frightened into their never ending PCP deals, which is why their dealers are now just glorified oil and filter change shops.
I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
I couldn't put it better myself.I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
Expensive, pompous, unreliable brand that sell cars to people who only care about their image. Just perusing PH on a regular basis gives you an idea about how reliable these German vehicles actually are.
It's shame really because I do think that at one time, they were good cars. VAG vehicles of the mid to late 1990's to early 2000's weren't that bad.
Saying that, I think all established brands should take a serious look at the emerging manufacturers. As mentioned above, 7 year warranty on a Kia, 5 year on Hyundai, 3 year warranty on pretty much everything else. For people who aren't bothered about image, it's a no brainer.
None of this will affect Audi though. The parent group has just been through a big scandal. From what I can tell, they have emerged unscathed here in the UK. If something like that doesn't bother them, how will people moaning about their chocolate gearboxes fare?
hyphen said:
+1 They must be when they hear the customer's overjoyed relief at having a warranty which has saved him from that 'massive bill'.
We had a late 2007 2.0 Tdi A4 company car at a business I worked for years ago now. In 2011, just outside of warranty (probably 6 months at the most) and at 75k miles, the thing lunched the engine and killed itself. Audi's diagnosis was a faulty oil pump, caused by the part that drove it failing. when they hear the customer's overjoyed relief at having a warranty which has saved him from that 'massive bill'.Audi admitted that it was an issue they had been dealing with on other cars. However, as it was out of warranty, they wouldn't do anything to help. I think they wanted £7k for a new engine.
The MD of the company went and had a word with the dealer. Basically, he told them that if they didn't do anything, he would take the company car fleet business immediately elsewhere.
As if my magic, Audi agreed to pay for the engine, but the company had to pay the labour for fitting. They were still around £2.5k out of pocket, but that was a whole lot better than £7k.
However, it was still the usual £2.5k is better than £7k relief.
culpz said:
ian_c_uk said:
Markbarry1977 said:
If Kia did a rip snorting 300bhp+ sports car with rear wheel drive and 7 year/100000 mile warranty I would have snapped one up.
3.3 V6 turbo, 365bhp, RWD...https://www.kia.com/uk/new-cars/all-new-stinger/
.
(Not knocking the M135i / M140i - is on my next car shortlist, very nice thing, but not an Elise either
)Predictably this has turned into a tedious Audi brand bashing thread peppered with the usual anecdotal "proof".
I'd be intrigued to know which alternative/competing brands the exact same complaints and experiences can't be leveled at?
There are none. It's just what the automobile industry has become because of what the customer demands.
"New World" automakers with their low prices and huge warranties and other headline grabbers are all well and good. But it's easy to do when the product being peddled is at best a generation behind.
I'd be intrigued to know which alternative/competing brands the exact same complaints and experiences can't be leveled at?
There are none. It's just what the automobile industry has become because of what the customer demands.
"New World" automakers with their low prices and huge warranties and other headline grabbers are all well and good. But it's easy to do when the product being peddled is at best a generation behind.
ian_c_uk said:
Markbarry1977 said:
If Kia did a rip snorting 300bhp+ sports car with rear wheel drive and 7 year/100000 mile warranty I would have snapped one up.
3.3 V6 turbo, 365bhp, RWD...https://www.kia.com/uk/new-cars/all-new-stinger/
.
ian_c_uk said:
Absolutely agree, I guess I was comparing it to the M135i he bought.
(Not knocking the M135i / M140i - is on my next car shortlist, very nice thing, but not an Elise either )
Regardless, that new KIA Stinger looks great and could be priced similar to what you'd get for one of these modern hyper hatches. If so, it will be great value.(Not knocking the M135i / M140i - is on my next car shortlist, very nice thing, but not an Elise either
)I do like the M135i/M140i and they're actually really good value for what you get. I personally prefer the M235i/M240i as i really don't like the 1 Series shape/styling. Definitely on the to-own list in the future
dvs_dave said:
Predictably this has turned into a tedious Audi brand bashing thread peppered with the usual anecdotal "proof".
I'd be intrigued to know which alternative/competing brands the exact same complaints and experiences can't be leveled at?
There are none. It's just what the automobile industry has become because of what the customer demands.
"New World" automakers with their low prices and huge warranties and other headline grabbers are all well and good. But it's easy to do when the product being peddled is at best a generation behind.
Maybe if Audi stopped building chocolate products, the bashing of them wouldn't get so tedious.I'd be intrigued to know which alternative/competing brands the exact same complaints and experiences can't be leveled at?
There are none. It's just what the automobile industry has become because of what the customer demands.
"New World" automakers with their low prices and huge warranties and other headline grabbers are all well and good. But it's easy to do when the product being peddled is at best a generation behind.
I'd rather have a 'generation behind' car that works than one that stops and throws a £10k gearbox bill at around five years old.
Thing is, it isn't just the product that is being bashed. It's the attitude of the dealers. They price everything so high that they try to drive you into a new product, rather than a fix that would make a hell of a lot more sense.
I can't get my head around the fact that Audi are marketed as an aspirational brand. Some people I know dream of owning an Audi. Yet, the stuff they build now is unreliable crap.
As for proof, just read the threads on here.
Edited to add - also look at the list on this page:
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-new...
Edited by funkyrobot on Wednesday 22 March 09:41
funkyrobot said:
Edited to add - also look at the list on this page:
Audi seem to be in the ballpark of European manufacturers in the 90 to 95 range - very small delta to the others which makes singling out Audi a bit strange.It's hardly surprising they're all at the same level : Automotive benchmarking is very precise and reliable nowadays.
nyxster said:
modern audis are unreliable garbage sold by dealers like mobile phones on 3 year plans. there is no goodwill because all they care about us signing you up for the new 2.5 percent improved model with slightly altered grill and upgraded instagram filter for another 299 a month. the reason they want ten grand for the gearbox is to encourage you to scrap the car and think 'if iI put that money into a new car i'll have a warranty' - they want these kind of HUGE BILLS AHEAD scare stories because it keeps the nervous nellies frightened into their never ending PCP deals, which is why their dealers are now just glorified oil and filter change shops.
I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
I think what you're written here is mostly true for nearly all brands nowadays. Hell, it traces all the way back to the light bulb.I ran a D2 S8 to over 200k - 50k on a transmission is just appaling, but audi don't give a monkeys because once you arent on their 3 year PCP treadmill your value as a customer is zero, they will simply fleece you fir as much as they can to try and make their pcp and service plan deals seem like good value. The fact is all these '16k' repairs are BS figures inflated to maie people say 'thank god i had a warranty!' instead of asking why a 50k plus product that used to be engineered for 150k+ miles suddenly falls apart at 5 years and then magically costs its entire value to repair.
the whole thing is a scam put together after the beancounters at mercedes worked out that their cars were so well engineered they never made any money from people buying new cars or replacing parts - I can remember my mum;s old boss wheeling a SL in to complain the courtesy light bulb had blown. and the dealer replacing it fior free and apologising. Then look what happened - the whole industry now runs on a 3 year lifespan of warranty + oil and filter service plan, then another 2 years for the approved used scheme to prop up the PCP residuals and offload the ex lease cars into the used market, 5 years suddenly things break that cost as much as the car is worth...
Building a product that lasts for indefinite periods is anathema to any company seeking sustainable profits. The trick, as many have accomplished - Apple is a great example, is making consumers oblivious or uncaring to their failing or "overnight-obsolete" equipment because the newer, better stuff is just within reach.
There is a lot of big data that goes into milking consumers like this, and PCP aka "the customer journey/relationship with the brand" is another part of this. Cars, as you say, aren't made or sold as things you just drive away and keep for decades anymore and haven't been for a while. Now they are commodities that the manufacturer expects you to replace in good time. Manufacturers and dealers actively don't care, in fact, about people looking to buy a car as a one-off purchase anymore, and Audi are definitely not unique or particularly remarkable in this regard.
Edited by Durzel on Wednesday 22 March 11:36
nickfrog said:
funkyrobot said:
Edited to add - also look at the list on this page:
Audi seem to be in the ballpark of European manufacturers in the 90 to 95 range - very small delta to the others which makes singling out Audi a bit strange.It's hardly surprising they're all at the same level : Automotive benchmarking is very precise and reliable nowadays.
I understand that each manufacturer has their issues. I also noted further up the thread that Audi of old seemed a better brand to me.
Durzel said:
I think what you're written here is mostly true for nearly all brands nowadays. Hell, it traces all the way back to the light bulb.
Building a product that lasts for indefinite periods is anathema to any company seeking sustainable profits. The trick, as many have accomplished - Apple is a great example, is making consumers oblivious or uncaring to their failing or "overnight-obsolete" equipment because the newer, better stuff is just within reach.
There is a lot of big data that goes into milking consumers like this, and PCP aka "the customer journey/relationship with the brand" is another part of this. Cars, as you say, aren't made or sold as things you just drive away and keep for decades anymore and haven't been for a while. Now they are commodities that the manufacturer expects you to replace in good time. Manufacturers and dealers actively don't care, in fact, about people looking to buy a car as a one-off purchase anymore, and Audi are definitely not unique or particularly remarkable in this regard.
It saddens me that the world has gone this way. I, personally, hate waste. I don't like the throwaway nature of a lot of popular products.Building a product that lasts for indefinite periods is anathema to any company seeking sustainable profits. The trick, as many have accomplished - Apple is a great example, is making consumers oblivious or uncaring to their failing or "overnight-obsolete" equipment because the newer, better stuff is just within reach.
There is a lot of big data that goes into milking consumers like this, and PCP aka "the customer journey/relationship with the brand" is another part of this. Cars, as you say, aren't made or sold as things you just drive away and keep for decades anymore and haven't been for a while. Now they are commodities that the manufacturer expects you to replace in good time. Manufacturers and dealers actively don't care, in fact, about people looking to buy a car as a one-off purchase anymore, and Audi are definitely not unique or particularly remarkable in this regard.
Edited by Durzel on Wednesday 22 March 11:36
As you say, Apple is a prime candidate for this. A lot of people seem to love their products. Personally, I think they are overpriced and are nothing special. The fact that you can't do something like swap the battery of an iphone in a simple manner puts me off them.
funkyrobot said:
It saddens me that the world has gone this way. I, personally, hate waste. I don't like the throwaway nature of a lot of popular products.
As you say, Apple is a prime candidate for this. A lot of people seem to love their products. Personally, I think they are overpriced and are nothing special. The fact that you can't do something like swap the battery of an iphone in a simple manner puts me off them.
You can change the battery of an iphone! Not that easily but there are shops everywhere that do it for you!As you say, Apple is a prime candidate for this. A lot of people seem to love their products. Personally, I think they are overpriced and are nothing special. The fact that you can't do something like swap the battery of an iphone in a simple manner puts me off them.
And because Apple products are well built and look good, you can upgrade them and thus keep them for much longer than that cheap plastic stuff!
I still work on an 12 year old Apple Pro that I heavily upgraded. No plans to change that in the next few years!
And they still sell for good money on ebay.
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
Filibuster said:
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
I doubt that since a goodly percentage of iPhone users 'must have' the latest model and dispose of the old phone to get one.Filibuster said:
You can change the battery of an iphone! Not that easily but there are shops everywhere that do it for you!
And because Apple products are well built and look good, you can upgrade them and thus keep them for much longer than that cheap plastic stuff!
I still work on an 12 year old Apple Pro that I heavily upgraded. No plans to change that in the next few years!
And they still sell for good money on ebay.
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
What on earth do you manage to do with a G5 era Mac Pro And because Apple products are well built and look good, you can upgrade them and thus keep them for much longer than that cheap plastic stuff!
I still work on an 12 year old Apple Pro that I heavily upgraded. No plans to change that in the next few years!
And they still sell for good money on ebay.
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
Filibuster said:
You can change the battery of an iphone! Not that easily but there are shops everywhere that do it for you!
And because Apple products are well built and look good, you can upgrade them and thus keep them for much longer than that cheap plastic stuff!
I still work on an 12 year old Apple Pro that I heavily upgraded. No plans to change that in the next few years!
And they still sell for good money on ebay.
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
I can swap the battery on my phone by taking the back cover off, and swapping it. You can't do it that simply on an iPhone.And because Apple products are well built and look good, you can upgrade them and thus keep them for much longer than that cheap plastic stuff!
I still work on an 12 year old Apple Pro that I heavily upgraded. No plans to change that in the next few years!
And they still sell for good money on ebay.
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
KevinCamaroSS said:
Filibuster said:
I think Apple is a bad example as I'm sure that a greater percentage of apple products is still in use than of any other consumer electronic brand!
I doubt that since a goodly percentage of iPhone users 'must have' the latest model and dispose of the old phone to get one.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff