£10k gbox bill on 4yr old Audi. Was it ever fit for purpose?
Discussion
98elise said:
I'm guessing head of engineering, or at the very least a member of the test team.
You don't just walk into a job "Looking for mistakes"
That's the one, he is one of the Test drivers. I just couldn't find the word that time You don't just walk into a job "Looking for mistakes"
Edited by 98elise on Friday 14th April 07:25
ETA He also said that the 2.0 TFSI engine can do about 6 thousand KM's in 1st gear at redline
Edited by exelero on Saturday 15th April 01:39
confused_buyer said:
djc206 said:
I own a Ford and the materials it's built from are far inferior to my previous Audis. Is the Ford more reliable? Time will tell. Is it better built? Nope, shocking plastic qualities and the metal panels flex when cleaning where the Audi felt bullet proof.
That's just it thought isn't it. If you put the money into the bits the customers feels you have to save elsewhere on the metal oily bits which go round and round they don't see. Audi are very good at making cars which feel bulletproof but that doesn't mean they are necessarily well engineered, reliable or last any longer on the bits which actually make the car go.Personally, I'd take a slightly iffy bit of dashboard plastic and have an oil pump properly engineered which didn't round off all the edges on its drive at 50k miles and wreck the engine (as many owners of a 2.0 TDI balancer shaft equipped Audi know all too well....)
I'm going to play devils advocate and say that the likes of Audi are building cars for the modern market. People who buy/lease/PCP new cars every 3 years want something nice to sit it with all the latest gadgets and good quality leather seats. Because they change their cars every 3 years they could not give a hoot if it goes bang at 5 years. It's new car sales that drive the business so why wouldn't manufacturers pander to these customers at the expense of the second hand buyers? That's the only logic I can find in it all.
Most modern cars don't even have leather it's an optional extra (depending on model obviously) as standard, they call it a variety of different names but leather it's not, Artico if you have a Mercedes, Sensatec if you have a BMW, Audi do the same as do the Japanese & it all equals the same thing VINYL lol.
My experience with 'old' modern cars is that they rapidly become uneconomic to repair. When the cooling fan costs about the same as the car is worth it becomes hard to justify keeping it going.
And the reason the cooling fan cost £380 just for the part, emissions. Clever computer controlled variable speed control built into the fan itself.
And the reason the cooling fan cost £380 just for the part, emissions. Clever computer controlled variable speed control built into the fan itself.
Hungrymc said:
ZX10R NIN said:
it all equals the same thing VINYL lol.
Vinyl or polyurethane. To be fair, most leather isn't leather even when you pay the premium (the surface you can touch isn't anyway, it will have some leather in it's structure)ZX10R NIN said:
Most modern cars don't even have leather it's an optional extra (depending on model obviously) as standard, they call it a variety of different names but leather it's not, Artico if you have a Mercedes, Sensatec if you have a BMW, Audi do the same as do the Japanese & it all equals the same thing VINYL lol.
Only Mercedes do the 'synthetic leather' thing - BMW have Dakota as the entry level leather. It's not great, but it *is* real leather. Audi also only offer cloth plus a couple of different leather grades.Not sure why Mercedes persevere with Artico. It can only be because a large proportion of C and E class end up in the private hire sector. Paying extra for real leather in a £40k car is just wrong. I'd prefer Mercedes to offer a proper cloth / velour rather than Artico.
(Since getting our Toyota Alphard, I'm kind of converted to deep pile velour as a seat covering - and I always liked the cloth in Alfa 156s, which was like corduroy)
Hoofy said:
If you don't pay for leather, what do you get? Cloth? (Just asking as I prefer cloth seats to leather/vinyl/lino.)
The shiny / grainy / colored top surface won't be leather. If you cut through it, you'd see the fibrey leather material and then a sort of coating on top. Really cheap leather only has a small amount of actual hide material.Then there are the fully fake leathers with no leather whatsoever in them, they're a sheet of plastic material (PU or pvc normally) with a woven mesh stuck on the back to give them strength.
You'll see a lot of leather seats will have certain panels that you don't touch often made of the fully fake stuff,
ETA... COMPLETELY miss read your question - sorry.
Yes, you normally get a fairly course textile if you don't pay for leather. I quite like a good quality textile seat.
Edited by Hungrymc on Saturday 15th April 11:47
Trabi601 said:
Only Mercedes do the 'synthetic leather' thing - BMW have Dakota as the entry level leather. It's not great, but it *is* real leather. Audi also only offer cloth plus a couple of different leather grades.
Not sure why Mercedes persevere with Artico. It can only be because a large proportion of C and E class end up in the private hire sector. Paying extra for real leather in a £40k car is just wrong. I'd prefer Mercedes to offer a proper cloth / velour rather than Artico.
(Since getting our Toyota Alphard, I'm kind of converted to deep pile velour as a seat covering - and I always liked the cloth in Alfa 156s, which was like corduroy)
BMW do it too, it's called Sensatec. Dakota is part Sensatec, part (the bits in the middle) real leather.Not sure why Mercedes persevere with Artico. It can only be because a large proportion of C and E class end up in the private hire sector. Paying extra for real leather in a £40k car is just wrong. I'd prefer Mercedes to offer a proper cloth / velour rather than Artico.
(Since getting our Toyota Alphard, I'm kind of converted to deep pile velour as a seat covering - and I always liked the cloth in Alfa 156s, which was like corduroy)
VGTICE said:
BMW do it too, it's called Sensatec. Dakota is part Sensatec, part (the bits in the middle) real leather.
Not for the UK market, though (I've not seen it offered on the 1, 3, 4 or 5 series). If they are using Sensatec, it's not on the front of the seat - but may be used for the seat backs. But that's largely standard even for domestic leather furniture.Trabi601 said:
ZX10R NIN said:
Most modern cars don't even have leather it's an optional extra (depending on model obviously) as standard, they call it a variety of different names but leather it's not, Artico if you have a Mercedes, Sensatec if you have a BMW, Audi do the same as do the Japanese & it all equals the same thing VINYL lol.
Only Mercedes do the 'synthetic leather' thing - BMW have Dakota as the entry level leather. It's not great, but it *is* real leather. Audi also only offer cloth plus a couple of different leather grades.Not sure why Mercedes persevere with Artico. It can only be because a large proportion of C and E class end up in the private hire sector. Paying extra for real leather in a £40k car is just wrong. I'd prefer Mercedes to offer a proper cloth / velour rather than Artico.
(Since getting our Toyota Alphard, I'm kind of converted to deep pile velour as a seat covering - and I always liked the cloth in Alfa 156s, which was like corduroy)
It seems Ford/Vauxhall don't & nor do Audi Volvo do a combination so the part you sit on is leather the sides etc are not.
ZX10R NIN said:
No as I said BMW have a synthetic version as do Lexus/Toyota Mazda etc
It seems Ford/Vauxhall don't & nor do Audi Volvo do a combination so the part you sit on is leather the sides etc are not.
See above - BMW only offer cloth or the Dakota and above leather options.It seems Ford/Vauxhall don't & nor do Audi Volvo do a combination so the part you sit on is leather the sides etc are not.
I can't recall last time BMW offered vinyl (on the seat facings) in the UK.
Also see above - it's very common, even with higher end options, for only the facings to be leather - the back / sides are very often vinyl.
Hungrymc said:
Hoofy said:
If you don't pay for leather, what do you get? Cloth? (Just asking as I prefer cloth seats to leather/vinyl/lino.)
The shiny / grainy / colored top surface won't be leather. If you cut through it, you'd see the fibrey leather material and then a sort of coating on top. Really cheap leather only has a small amount of actual hide material.Then there are the fully fake leathers with no leather whatsoever in them, they're a sheet of plastic material (PU or pvc normally) with a woven mesh stuck on the back to give them strength.
You'll see a lot of leather seats will have certain panels that you don't touch often made of the fully fake stuff,
ETA... COMPLETELY miss read your question - sorry.
Yes, you normally get a fairly course textile if you don't pay for leather. I quite like a good quality textile seat.
Edited by Hungrymc on Saturday 15th April 11:47
giggity said:
No not just ZF. Multitronic CVT - made by LUK, but ignorant people will be ignorant people.
Their manual boxes are also s
t, see DUU box issues - dog st),
There is plenty of reliability issues with VAG / Audi only have to look at the oil consumption issues too.
you seem to be just confirming the fact you are not particularly bright by continuing to post nonsense...Their manual boxes are also s
t, see DUU box issues - dog st), There is plenty of reliability issues with VAG / Audi only have to look at the oil consumption issues too.
Edited by giggity on Friday 14th April 02:47
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