RE: Enjoying a fast car slowly

[CABC]

Clem Fandango said:

Through work I used to travel to Aberystwyth/Porthmadog/Anglesey so became very familiar with the routes.
At times in my own mind I'm a driving God - think LJK Setright in his Scirocco Storm , but know I'm fairly crap in reality.
With the utmost respect to Reg, and noting his post stressing line of sight, before, during and after using the "other side of the road", it has to be said that drivers should always stay on their side of the road in my view.
Having been in many varied convoys of fast traffic, we all know the type of situation, assorted snail vehicles progressing at or below the posted speed limits, the pressing on types that will overtake the snails but aren't going for a qualifying time, often in clusters of two, three, four, usually with varied appetite for risks, usually hitting 80,90, around 100mph even - in short bursts, and the out and out racers really reeling in the horizon, again with obviously varied skills and vehicle performance, oh and bikes.

Having witnessed a couple of accidents, and plenty of close calls, one thing is obvious, not everybody that wants to use the other side of the road through corners has the presence of mind to do so.

One particular time springs to mind, coming back from Barmouth, overtaking in a group of three, my Passat 170TDI, a Megane RS, and a BMW 320d, all was relaxed keeping a decent distance behind the car in front, when a Porsche Boxster speeds into the gap braking for the corner. Not a problem. The Boxster then drops a gear, accelerating towards the traffic ahead. Two guys wearing baseball caps in a BMW M3 convertible pass me with a woosh and catch up with the Porsche. Both cars must have been hitting 90 on a long straight approaching an open curve climbing up a steep incline. Fantastic line of sight, literally miles.
Absolutely amazed to see the Porsche cross the white lines and position for the corner whilst the indicating M3 was in the process of overtaking, almost side-swiped. Much flashing of lights and horn pounding, heavy braking but thankfully nothing worse.
Sometimes people must either be in a world of their own, underestimate the closing speed of the car behind, or just throw caution to the wind.
I think making it a rule to stay on your own side of the road is generally the best idea though....one less thing to worry about.

a lot there to disassemble and critique.
So, Porsche didn't use mirrors.
others well over speed limit.
not sure how that leads to assertion of "that drivers should always stay on their side of the road in my view"?

[Loyly]

Clem Fandango said:

I think making it a rule to stay on your own side of the road is generally the best idea though....one less thing to worry about.

What a load of guff. Making rules to suit the feckless is madness, but if your own low standards of driving mean you're not happy using all of the road, then please, don't.

[NDNDNDND]

Loyly said:

Clem Fandango said:

I think making it a rule to stay on your own side of the road is generally the best idea though....one less thing to worry about.

What a load of guff. Making rules to suit the feckless is madness, but if your own low standards of driving mean you're not happy using all of the road, then please, don't.

The thing is, the last time I saw a car being driven in this manner - crossing white lines to 'improve sight-lines' and to straight line corners - it was a blue Peugeot estate, complete with PH smiley. This guy clearly thought he was amazing, however oncoming cars were literally swerving out of his way. Yes, use all the road if you believe it's safe to do so, but I think it's a risky thing to suggest as a good technique. A lot of people who will end up using it simply aren't as good as they think they are.

[Zajda]

Clem Fandango said:

I think making it a rule to stay on your own side of the road is generally the best idea though....one less thing to worry about.

Use mirrors maybe? If you ever cut a corner not aware of situation behind, you obviously did it wrong. From my experience the most dangerous road positioning occurs when otherwise comformal driver understeers at corner exit because he was on the correct side of the road approaching it. And he is doing under speed limit so he/she is the safest driver in the world and doesn't need to vary speed. Or sometimes these types of safe drivers happen to cut one odd corner out of the blue in the dumbest possible place.

Edited by Zajda on Thursday 23 February 00:48

[Bunfighter]

Hoofy said:

If you want your drive to be more interesting, try staying in your own bloody lane. The roads suddenly become narrower.

No. It's perfectly a good technique. Smooth smooth smooth.

[cptsideways]

Bunfighter said:

Hoofy said:

If you want your drive to be more interesting, try staying in your own bloody lane. The roads suddenly become narrower.

No. It's perfectly a good technique. Smooth smooth smooth.

And can massively increase visibility further ahead

[Reg Local]

Just to put some context to the discussion about using the full width of the road where appropriate, below is a picture of the bend in the photograph of the Jag, taken from the same direction I'm driving in in the picture.

If anyone can give me a genuinely valid reason why it's inappropriate or dangerous to straighten this corner with a clear view on approach & no traffic either ahead or behind, I'll give up the advanced driving stuff today, take my books off sale, take the YouTube channel down & hand in my drivers licence:



Anyone?

[Michaelhunt]

Pistonheads bullst might be covering the blind bit of road making you slide and end up in a field full of it

[Reg Local]

Michaelhunt said:

Pistonheads bullst might be covering the blind bit of road making you slide and end up in a field full of it

Starts writing letter to DVLA...

[Michaelhunt]

Lets be honest maybe it's not exclusive to PH but more of a life thing - you are going to be damned if you do or damned if you don't with anything on here. People won't be able to give you a good reason of why you can't do this but they still won't agree with you.

On a side note it's interesting to see how much you straight line the road compared to me a "non advanced driver" who readily admits to "making progress" as safely as possible. I always thought you IAM guys were always against that type of thing

[Jex]

For those who say you should always stay on your own side of the road, how do you ever overtake anything? And don't say you never overtake on bends, because if the visibility is good, I bet you do.

[dc2rr07]

Reg Local said:

Just to put some context to the discussion about using the full width of the road where appropriate, below is a picture of the bend in the photograph of the Jag, taken from the same direction I'm driving in in the picture.

If anyone can give me a genuinely valid reason why it's inappropriate or dangerous to straighten this corner with a clear view on approach & no traffic either ahead or behind, I'll give up the advanced driving stuff today, take my books off sale, take the YouTube channel down & hand in my drivers licence:



Anyone?

ok, that maybe your view from the driving seat but the only information provided in the article was this picture

Hoofy said:

If you want your drive to be more interesting, try staying in your own bloody lane. The roads suddenly become narrower.

and looking at this picture it appears that road behind is a left hand bend and dips away with a grassy knoll on the left obscuring the view round the corner, so with the information provided in the article it looks like there is no way you could see what was coming the other way until you had taken the left turn for what it's worth.

[CABC]

dc2rr07 said:

and looking at this picture it appears that road behind is a left hand bend and dips away with a grassy knoll on the left obscuring the view round the corner, so with the information provided in the article it looks like there is no way you could see what was coming the other way until you had taken the left turn for what it's worth.

from the information provided i was fully aware that i could not make any meaningful assessment.

these threads just help remind me who's sharing the roads with me.

[dc2rr07]

CABC said:

dc2rr07 said:

and looking at this picture it appears that road behind is a left hand bend and dips away with a grassy knoll on the left obscuring the view round the corner, so with the information provided in the article it looks like there is no way you could see what was coming the other way until you had taken the left turn for what it's worth.

from the information provided i was fully aware that i could not make any meaningful assessment.

these threads just help remind me who's sharing the roads with me.

and your point is exactly what...

Reg was showing the view from the car after the left corner had been taken which we did not have access to in the article, the first picture in the article obviously taken for its dramatic effect was our only source to work with so from that picture a few deductions can be made as to why it may look inappropriate to take the next right on the wrong side of the road.

Edited by dc2rr07 on Thursday 23 February 19:50

[dc2rr07]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

It's not a controversial opinion at all it is just looking at the picture provided in the article with no other local knowledge or topography provided and in my opinion before the right hand bend which the car is on there is left turn, an incline and a grass bank to the left or am I looking at a different photograph to everyone else.

[Michaelhunt]

I'm just like wtf is going on with this thread...

It's like the Vlogger thread all over again.

[Tickle]

Reg Local said:

Just to put some context to the discussion about using the full width of the road where appropriate, below is a picture of the bend in the photograph of the Jag, taken from the same direction I'm driving in in the picture.

If anyone can give me a genuinely valid reason why it's inappropriate or dangerous to straighten this corner with a clear view on approach & no traffic either ahead or behind, I'll give up the advanced driving stuff today, take my books off sale, take the YouTube channel down & hand in my drivers licence:



Anyone?

Nope, very well sighted..

[dc2rr07]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

So you are saying the image behind does not
1. Indicate a left turn
2. The road is ascending
3. There is a grass bank to the left

How you managed to jump to the conclusion that it was bias is rather strange when all I am pointing out is deductions taken from some photograph.

[bordseye]

Michaelhunt said:

On a side note it's interesting to see how much you straight line the road compared to me a "non advanced driver" who readily admits to "making progress" as safely as possible. I always thought you IAM guys were always against that type of thing

The teaching in the IAM is that you can use the full width of the road if its clear to do so and legally allowed. Got to say, though, that I would think twice in the case of both the photos but particularly the Lotus driver. Visibility in his case is marginal if you allow for another Lotus driver barreling down a nice open road in the oncoming direction doing maybe 80? But thats a personal judgement and the Lotus driver thinks differently.

"I always thought you IAM guys..... " is a pretty common attitude. People assume that we are like BRAKE, driving eveywhere at 25mph with the inside wheel clipping the kerbstone. Sure the car driver side is a bit more righteous, but the bikers .... well they are like any other enthusiastic biker and most dont ride BMWs.

[Clem Fandango]

Jex said:

For those who say you should always stay on your own side of the road, how do you ever overtake anything? And don't say you never overtake on bends, because if the visibility is good, I bet you do.

The discussion is about generally keeping on one's own side of the road when driving along, or not as the case may be.
It goes without saying that moving to the other side of the road will be both acceptable and essential when overtaking, likewise for passing parked vehicles or other obstructions.
Seems to be that in regard to the Welsh A roads I'm referring to that these days stealth overtaking seems to be the norm rather than merrily flying along passing long lines of vehicles at high speed.
People overtaking before bends, on bends or following bends is of course routine. Especially for those that are intimate with well travelled routes rather than week-end visitors.
Reaching really high speeds on the long Roman straights is less prevalent than it used to be because there may well be an unmarked Police car waiting. Still the occasional 170mph bike can turn up.
In North Wales we have drivers/bikers that think they are Sir Stirling Moss and Denis Jenkinson on the '55 Mille Miglia or John McGuinness on the TT.

Whether partly due to Arrive Alive safety camera vans and increased police patrolling targeting speeding cars and bikes especially in Summer, can't say.
I'm not condoning or condemning people's driving styles just commenting that people speed along in varying ways. Again obviously, ideally using mirrors before signalling and manoeuvring is basic stuff. Some know very well another "fast" car is behind them but will still move all over the road either trying to keep ahead or just enjoying themselves. People towing caravans, boats, jet skis, foreign trucks, UK trucks, Irish trucks, single bikers, groups of bikers, drive along Welsh A roads often enough and you'll see all sorts getting corners wrong, cutting corners and routinely messing up. Probably more so since the EVO-Triangle became "a thing".

Its just my opinion that average peddlers should generally keep to their side of the road and everybody will be safer. What would happen if everybody started doing it, those that think they are better drivers than they actually are ?

Edited by Clem Fandango on Thursday 23 February 21:28