RE: Range Rover Velar teased
Discussion
Fire99 said:
Just chewing the fat but I think the risk for JLR regarding the Defender is that their reputation 'DNA' appears to all come from it. The Land Rover brand still has tough ability primarily in its 'floor pans' (Even if the Evoque is available as a less able model)
OK the Defender may not have been a big money-spinner but it was a kind of utilitarian off-road 'halo' model. Take it away and initially it will have no impact act all but I think there's a risk that the Land Rover brand could lose its unique selling point longer term as it has nothing 'stand out' to attract it compared to a bucket of other SUV's..
Image is a very fickle business..
But aren't all manufacturers on the same path? Is an M4 as credible a drivers car as an e30 M3? Plenty of businesses have failed because they tried to stick to core values and didn't accept the world had moved on and customers wanted something else.OK the Defender may not have been a big money-spinner but it was a kind of utilitarian off-road 'halo' model. Take it away and initially it will have no impact act all but I think there's a risk that the Land Rover brand could lose its unique selling point longer term as it has nothing 'stand out' to attract it compared to a bucket of other SUV's..
Image is a very fickle business..
I think JLR were very fortunate to have been purchased by Tata, but they've used the investment very wisely.
DonkeyApple said:
As the Evoque is built on the Ford floorpan and this car will use the Jaguar's is it likely that they ultimately won't replace the Evoque when the time comes to renew it?
Evoque is the same platform as Discovery Sport and built at Halewood. The Velar thing is the bigger platform built in Solihull. I'm pretty sure they would intend to keep at least two different platforms for the fundamental differences in size and power train between the large and small cars. They won't kill Evoque until its been milked dry and that looks a while off yet.
DonkeyApple said:
As the Evoque is built on the Ford floorpan and this car will use the Jaguar's is it likely that they ultimately won't replace the Evoque when the time comes to renew it?
I doubt it, the Evoque sold in huge numbers, they'd be mad not to renew it. The small SUV market is very lucrative, they just had nothing in the "goldilocks" mid size space so the Velar will just complete the range (no pun intended) rather than replace it.Hungrymc said:
DonkeyApple said:
As the Evoque is built on the Ford floorpan and this car will use the Jaguar's is it likely that they ultimately won't replace the Evoque when the time comes to renew it?
Evoque is the same platform as Discovery Sport and built at Halewood. The Velar thing is the bigger platform built in Solihull. I'm pretty sure they would intend to keep at least two different platforms for the fundamental differences in size and power train between the large and small cars. They won't kill Evoque until its been milked dry and that looks a while off yet.RacerMike said:
Evilex said:
Most absolutely this. Stop tooling around, LR. Release a world-class replacement for the Defender. That's where the gaping space in your model line up REALLY is.
Well it's not really is it. The Defender sold in relatively small but steady numbers to the same people that have always bought them. This isn't really that profitable, and the only reason the Defender actually made any financial sense, was the fact it's design, development and tooling was probably paid off about 50 years ago. Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
Classless
Extremely capable off-road
Tough & easy to fix, modify and customize.
But also;
Modern
Comfortable
Readily adaptable and configurable
Safe
As good to drive as any of its competition.
popeyewhite said:
Hoofy said:
popeyewhite said:
petemurphy said:
skidskid said:
They arent Range Rovers, merely Land Rovers. Its a badge snob thing.
no its a 7 seats versus 5 thing
I have a 4x4 only because it looks nicer than a van but basically it's a van and that's how I think of it. Reality is that it probably really is an "SUV" because it is a utility vehicle (van) that I use for sports (transporting sports equipment about)! At the moment, I have about 8 large balls, 6 tennis balls and a couple of racquets in there plus about 20 muddy cones.
RacerMike said:
Well it's not really is it. The Defender sold in relatively small but steady numbers to the same people that have always bought them. This isn't really that profitable, and the only reason the Defender actually made any financial sense, was the fact it's design, development and tooling was probably paid off about 50 years ago.
Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
You know, you're absolutely right.Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
I'm off right now to tell those fools at Toyota to stop making the LandCruiser GX and the HiLux.
havoc said:
RacerMike said:
Well it's not really is it. The Defender sold in relatively small but steady numbers to the same people that have always bought them. This isn't really that profitable, and the only reason the Defender actually made any financial sense, was the fact it's design, development and tooling was probably paid off about 50 years ago.
Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
You know, you're absolutely right.Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
I'm off right now to tell those fools at Toyota to stop making the LandCruiser GX and the HiLux.
Nobody even liked it until a lhd amg version appeard in 1998 at a random merc dealer in the south near ascot
loose cannon said:
Whilst your there can you give Mercedes a shout and tell them to stop building that ruddy g wagon
Nobody even liked it until a lhd version appeard in 1998 at a random merc dealer in the south near ascot
Not sure mentioning the G wagon to prove that point is a good idea. It might be a tough as nails "proper" 4x4 but ever since it started appearing in rap videos a few years ago, it has perhaps become the ultimate urban SUV status symbol.Nobody even liked it until a lhd version appeard in 1998 at a random merc dealer in the south near ascot
Guvernator said:
Not sure mentioning the G wagon to prove that point is a good idea. It might be a tough as nails "proper" 4x4 but ever since it started appearing in rap videos a few years ago, it has perhaps become the ultimate urban SUV status symbol.
I think we started selling them to the posh people of ascot whey before that happened I no I used to work at the dealer in sunnigdale that the x forces guys brought in for us amongst all the other import stuff we used to make big money on selling Tbh the modern g wagons are not hard as nails they have modern merc electrics in them and we all no how crap they are
Contrary to what some on here would like you to believe
Hungrymc said:
But aren't all manufacturers on the same path? Is an M4 as credible a drivers car as an e30 M3? Plenty of businesses have failed because they tried to stick to core values and didn't accept the world had moved on and customers wanted something else.
I think JLR were very fortunate to have been purchased by Tata, but they've used the investment very wisely.
I hear what you're saying but the difference to me is that BMW still make the M3 / M4 even if the car has evolved somewhat from the old E30. If BMW dropped all the M cars and perhaps the 3/4 series entirely, maybe that would be closer to JLR dropping the defender. It's not just a model that's changed. It's a major icon for the brand gone.I think JLR were very fortunate to have been purchased by Tata, but they've used the investment very wisely.
I think JLR have made some great moves forward and I wouldn't want to throw the baby out with the bath water. They have some much improved cars over the days of the Discovery / Discovery 2 and the like. However losing the Defender entirely may be a detrimental move for the brand's image.. Purely my slant on things of course..
ruprechtmonkeyboy said:
RacerMike said:
Evilex said:
Most absolutely this. Stop tooling around, LR. Release a world-class replacement for the Defender. That's where the gaping space in your model line up REALLY is.
Well it's not really is it. The Defender sold in relatively small but steady numbers to the same people that have always bought them. This isn't really that profitable, and the only reason the Defender actually made any financial sense, was the fact it's design, development and tooling was probably paid off about 50 years ago. Ignoring all the issues with modern crash regs etc, a new Defender in the same mould as the original won't make money. There aren't enough people in the world who want a car like the old Defender to warrant the cost of developing a new one.
However they've currently lost their (w
ky market speak warning...) "DNA" in binning the defender.You could trace all models back to the old prehistoric landy, but now that's gone.
It's like Porsche stopped making the 911 - in some small ways traceable back to the 365, rear engine, started out same engine yada yada. With the landy gone there is no previous. Even Porsche tried to replace the 911 with the 928 before thinking "s
t, hang on..." and didn't bin it completely.They got rid of a phrase marketeers would die for (best 4x4xfar) (due to not only making 4x4's), and now they're limited to lifestyle vehicles to some degree (I do like them, had a couple...) with no usp.
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