So I did buy some LingLong Ditchfinders

[citizensm1th]

So did the Op die in a flaming wreck or is he still with us?

[GC8]

He was a bit of an arse, but he made a reasonable point unreasonably. Im surprised that Nexen are being referred to a 'mid-range'. I would regard them as very good budgets. A semantic distinction to some, but important to me.

[HustleRussell]

You are welcome HornetRider, do please feel free to report back in another 11 months with how the Nexens have really performed over their useful life. Perhaps by then we'll have a meaningful comparison against the Contis.

[jon-]

As usual, it's a very complicated argument.



Full article - http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/Should-we-cha...

[markirl]

hornetrider said:

So I replaced my Conti SC5s with Nexen N8000s on the front of my Passat Alltrack. Have been throwing it round corners and roundabouts expecting to understeer off into the local scenery but not a bit of it. At 8/10ths I can detect no discernable drop off in grip or turn in.

And they were 70 a corner instead of 125, a significant saving.

I'll be interested to see how you feel they perform in the wet as I felt the same as above about Kumho KU39s when I first fitted them but they weren't nearly up to standard in the wet.

[Frankthered]

markirl said:

hornetrider said:

So I replaced my Conti SC5s with Nexen N8000s on the front of my Passat Alltrack. Have been throwing it round corners and roundabouts expecting to understeer off into the local scenery but not a bit of it. At 8/10ths I can detect no discernable drop off in grip or turn in.

And they were 70 a corner instead of 125, a significant saving.

I'll be interested to see how you feel they perform in the wet as I felt the same as above about Kumho KU39s when I first fitted them but they weren't nearly up to standard in the wet.

This is my experience too, and seems to be that of most people. The difference between most tyres probably isn't going be noticeable while driving on public roads in dry conditions.

The differences tend to be much more noticeable in the wet.

[Countdown]

Frankthered said:

This is my experience too, and seems to be that of most people. The difference between most tyres probably isn't going be noticeable while driving on public roads in dry conditions.

The differences tend to be much more noticeable in the wet.

I think the "notice ability" would also depend on how close to the limit you were driving.

So Grandma driving at 3/10ths isn't going to notice much difference between Budget and premium whereas PowerfullyBuiltGoatee driving at 9/10ths will do.

[emicen]

Countdown said:

Frankthered said:

This is my experience too, and seems to be that of most people. The difference between most tyres probably isn't going be noticeable while driving on public roads in dry conditions.

The differences tend to be much more noticeable in the wet.

I think the "notice ability" would also depend on how close to the limit you were driving.

So Grandma driving at 3/10ths isn't going to notice much difference between Budget and premium whereas PowerfullyBuiltGoatee driving at 9/10ths will do.

I'm now 190k in to Kumho useage after dispatching my first 25k on Pilot Sport 2 / RE040s.

Wet grip has never been an issue. I'd like to think I don't really fall in to the bracket of a mumsnet contributor but I can't help but think people searching for every last ounce of wet grip on the public highway need to have a word with themselves.

[Countdown]

emicen said:

I'm now 190k in to Kumho useage after dispatching my first 25k on Pilot Sport 2 / RE040s.

Wet grip has never been an issue. I'd like to think I don't really fall in to the bracket of a mumsnet contributor but I can't help but think people searching for every last ounce of wet grip on the public highway need to have a word with themselves.

I completely agree.

My response was intended more for the "I tried budgets and immediately exploded in a ball of fiery flame" brigade.

Ps I'm also not sure I'd class Kumho tyres in the same brand as Wanli or Nangking.I've always found them pretty good.

[emicen]

Countdown said:

I completely agree.

My response was intended more for the "I tried budgets and immediately exploded in a ball of fiery flame" brigade.

Ps I'm also not sure I'd class Kumho tyres in the same brand as Wanli or Nangking.I've always found them pretty good.

Totally in agreement.

The interesting bit is Nankang and Nexen and the like are rapidly closing the gap towards the midrange Kumho/Falken types who in turn are narrowing the gap to the premiums.

Complete tangent: Avon is an interesting brand. There really doesn't seem to be much love for them as road tyres despite a long Motorsport history and European heritage.

[BigMacDaddy]

emicen said:

Complete tangent: Avon is an interesting brand. There really doesn't seem to be much love for them as road tyres despite a long Motorsport history and European heritage.

I always buy Avons for all of my cars. Superb wet and dry performance, and that's been on everything from a lightweight Ignis Sport to a pretty hefty 300bhp Nissan Stagea.

[M-SportMatt]

emicen said:

I can't help but think people searching for every last ounce of wet grip on the public highway need to have a word with themselves.

But that's the thing, what is 5/10ths on a premium is 10/10ths on a linglong

I think the thread has drifted into talking about people using fairly decent midrange tyres as oppposed to the wangling ning nong type that are super rubbish

[thiscocks]

brrapp said:

^^^^This^^^^

My daily driver is an old Ford Ranger pickup, rear wheel drive most of the time and when the back is empty, it's lethal on wet or frosty roads. Even with top quality tyres, it's by far the worst/best vehicle I've driven for going sideways on roundabouts. I'm pretty sure it's far more dangerous than any modern car running the cheapest 'ditchfinders' available but I and many others drive vehicles like this on a daily basis and don't die more often then the rest of the population. We just (mostly) drive to suit the road/vehicle conditions.

Until you have to do an emergency stop or swerve in the wet.

[E36Ross]

I think Nankang have moved up to Mid Range.

I'v noticed a lot of new budgets lately, Lucky Land Happy Gallop anyone?

[jon-]

E36Ross said:

I think Nankang have moved up to Mid Range.

I'v noticed a lot of new budgets lately, Lucky Land Happy Gallop anyone?

There's 3 or 4 main factories in China churning out hundreds of brands and patterns.

I guess they're running out of "good" names as they're getting more and more stupid.

[Frankthered]

jon- said:

There's 3 or 4 main factories in China churning out hundreds of brands and patterns.

I guess they're running out of "good" names as they're getting more and more stupid.

Are you suggesting Linglong wasn't stupid?

[vsonix]

emicen said:

Countdown said:

Frankthered said:

This is my experience too, and seems to be that of most people. The difference between most tyres probably isn't going be noticeable while driving on public roads in dry conditions.

The differences tend to be much more noticeable in the wet.

I think the "notice ability" would also depend on how close to the limit you were driving.

So Grandma driving at 3/10ths isn't going to notice much difference between Budget and premium whereas PowerfullyBuiltGoatee driving at 9/10ths will do.

I'm now 190k in to Kumho useage after dispatching my first 25k on Pilot Sport 2 / RE040s.

Wet grip has never been an issue. I'd like to think I don't really fall in to the bracket of a mumsnet contributor but I can't help but think people searching for every last ounce of wet grip on the public highway need to have a word with themselves.

Odd, I run Kumho tyres on my E36 and Z3 (KU39 on the 328i, PS91 on the Z3) and one of the reasons I pick Kumho over other brands is precisely because they're good in the wet, they are very good with standing water, they stop well and grip nicely in bends. I'm not on track so I'm definitely not chasing wet grip at silly levels of speed but at the same time I do feel confident enough in their abilities to be able to press on a fair bit in rainy conditions, my speed is limited by the relative lack of visibility etc rather than feeling I have to be super-cautious due to reduced grip or potential to aquaplaning potential.

[vsonix]

emicen said:

Countdown said:

I completely agree.

My response was intended more for the "I tried budgets and immediately exploded in a ball of fiery flame" brigade.

Ps I'm also not sure I'd class Kumho tyres in the same brand as Wanli or Nangking.I've always found them pretty good.

Totally in agreement.

The interesting bit is Nankang and Nexen and the like are rapidly closing the gap towards the midrange Kumho/Falken types who in turn are narrowing the gap to the premiums.

Complete tangent: Avon is an interesting brand. There really doesn't seem to be much love for them as road tyres despite a long Motorsport history and European heritage.

Nankang make pretty decent tyres.The NS2 are a pretty good everyday road car for 'sporty' cars up to around 250 BHP. They now make trackday special semi-slicks which are well-regarded by those who use them. There were a few stories about the NS2 splitting in the middle a few years back but it seems this was confined to a single batch. Landsail are another better-than-adequate budget tyre, it seems they are based on older Michelin tooling and designs. They're also making a push into motorsport which basically seems to indicate they are serious about demonstrating their performance and taking their brand to the next level. Although with a odd sounding name like 'Landsail' it's hard to see brand appeal, which I think is a lot of why people are so rude about some of the Chinese tyres. If they were called 'Dominator' or something instead of 'Wanli' I dare say more people would find them acceptable.

[HustleRussell]

Frankthered said:

hornetrider said:

HustleRussell said:

Midrange tyre in 'similar dry grip to shagged premium tyre' shocker.

Do you think a Conti SC5 with ~3mm would display handling characteristics in the dry that could be described as 'shagged'? If so, why?

ISTR on an episode of (very) Old Top Gear they did a not very scientific tyre test - basically Tiff doing timed laps on various tyres. IIRC, the "worn out" premiums with 3mm tread posted the fastest time of the day in dry conditions.

Different story in the wet of course.

I remember a test on Fifth Gear where Tiff set out to prove that money spent on brand new quality tyres was money well spent. It compared the stopping distance of brand new premium tyres, brand new budget tyres and lucky dip part worns on wet cobblestones.

The message was compromised slightly when the budget tyres (Matadors) pulled up shorter than premium tyres (Continental PC2s), and the lucky dip budgets shorter still!

Transpires that two of the lucky dip budgets were winter tyres which excelled on the slippery, wet surface, and that Matadors are actually rather good (I can personally recommend them).

The piece was surprisingly signed off for broadcast and Tiff, in wrapping up, pointed out that Continental PC2s, like a lot of premium touring tyres, was optimised for low rolling resistance and durability.