RE: Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?

[tankplanker]

isaldiri said:

If it was really Porsche AG's cunning plan to rip off UK customers why is it the £ price of the gt3 is so much lower than the € version?

Production is not strictly limited per the R but it's effectively limited as Porsche have rather more profitable tat like macans and cayennes to make so the gt3 is capacity limited. If Porsche announced they would fulfill every order (say let's assume the impossible by turning part of macan production to gt3...), the cars would depreciate as usual and no one would want them.

At the end of the day, if a dealership gets 10 cars but has 50 people putting in letters of interest of which I'd guess over half are doing so purely because it's a tax free instant gain, how do you suppose allocations should be handed out?

It would never happen but I'd like to see them pay the full deposit, this gets you one ticket to a raffle ran by Porsche (not the dealer), first x tickets out of the raffle get the car, the others get refunds on their deposit. One ticket per address and name. Deposit to be paid upfront to try and reduce people getting mates to enter for them. I'd also make it so that anybody selling on the car within the first 3 years can't enter again for another 5 years. Obviously raffles can be rigged, hot balls and all that, but I'd hope the process would be fairer.

I don't like first past the post system for reservations, those in bed with the dealer/trade would always know in advance and can jump the queue because they are ready before the order books go live.

[isaldiri]

tankplanker said:

t would never happen but I'd like to see them pay the full deposit, this gets you one ticket to a raffle ran by Porsche (not the dealer), first x tickets out of the raffle get the car, the others get refunds on their deposit. One ticket per address and name. Deposit to be paid upfront to try and reduce people getting mates to enter for them. I'd also make it so that anybody selling on the car within the first 3 years can't enter again for another 5 years. Obviously raffles can be rigged, hot balls and all that, but I'd hope the process would be fairer.

I don't like first past the post system for reservations, those in bed with the dealer/trade would always know in advance and can jump the queue because they are ready before the order books go live.

Hm, can't really fault the dealers for wanting to take care of their best customers to be fair. It's just human nature at the end of the day. What does irritate people obviously is the cars immediately appearing at the likes of JZM/Romans I suppose more than the good customers getting cars early and using them...

IMO the dealers should have a clause saying the cars have to be returned to them within 2 years otherwise you won't get another one for X number of years and they should ask for non refundable deposits. Right now people are firing off deposits left right and centre as they know it's returnable so try to put them in everywhere for everything rumoured.

[Never you mind]

isaldiri said:

What does irritate people obviously is the cars immediately appearing at the likes of JZM/Romans I suppose more than the good customers getting cars early and using them...

There was a Silver 991 GT3 RS at one dealer up north that the owner/flipper/speculator told them that he won't be picking up and to stick it in the showroom as soon as it came out of PDI check. Now if I was wanting one and didn't get one I would be majorly annoyed with said OPC and would probably take my business elsewhere. However I bet they still get the next GT car and will probably do the same.

[AMGJocky]

Who gives a monkeys? No one will be able to buy one

[Dan Trent]

LaurasOtherHalf said:

monthefish said:

"Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?"
.
"not any time soon"


Classic clickbait.

This.

The busiest week in the motoring journalist calendar & PH come up with this crap.

And you clicked, right? And you had this question...

headline said:

Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?

...put directly to the two guys managing the department that has 1) just launched a mid-engined racing 911 to compete in frontline GT racing 2) is in charge of building current and future road product inspired by said racing cars and with a direct technology transfer in shared engines, homologation, etc... And the article then went on to detail their response.

I understand your sense of utter betrayal. Oh, hang on, no I don't.

Dan

[Davey S2]

isaldiri said:

If it was really Porsche AG's cunning plan to rip off UK customers why is it the £ price of the gt3 is so much lower than the € version?

Or why is the list price so low to start with?

£112k base price is an absolute bargain for this car if you can get one. Porsche would have no issues shifting all of them if they listed it at £150K.

[Oddball RS]

I think the article is more interesting for what is not said and reading between the lines, although only one point in time, event he photo of the meeting tells a story.

Doesn't sound like a happy camp, and someone sounds very very Germanically self important.

[f1ten]

Yep exactly right and it's a phase and will soon be over. Abercrombie and fitch once had ques round the corner then they fell out of fashion. Gt3 with big wing being used to go to a regional owners hq office isn't subtle for every day use. Having that expensively in the garage when interest rates.coax money back into proper investments etc this nonsense of flipping will disappear i

toppstuff said:

No, I think it is a Porsche strategic decision to rip off the Uk enthusiast market for the simple reason that they can. There are enough moneyed property developer types who are best mates with the dealer principal, who can fill up the order book on cheap finance and then flip the car to the dealer to sell again for 50% more.

It is a deeply cynical exercise and, frankly, has practically put me off the brand for life.

[DM525i]

(say let's assume the impossible by turning part of macan production to gt3...), the cars would depreciate as usual and no one would want them.
I can't believe this would be the case. Surely they would be enjoyed for what they are. And the fact you are not driving around in your retirement fund may lend itself to using it with a bit more of a carefree attitude (you could actually enjoy the car, not worry about the investment). Is this really where we are at with this type of car, investment first driving 10th. Is a mid-engined 911 a 911? I think Pistonheads need to break up. Piston heads for drivers and Pistonheads for investors.

[isaldiri]

DM525i said:

(say let's assume the impossible by turning part of macan production to gt3...), the cars would depreciate as usual and no one would want them.
I can't believe this would be the case. Surely they would be enjoyed for what they are. And the fact you are not driving around in your retirement fund may lend itself to using it with a bit more of a carefree attitude (you could actually enjoy the car, not worry about the investment). Is this really where we are at with this type of car, investment first driving 10th.

We have to disagree here. The vast demand for the gt cars now is primarily imo due to the impression of scarcity and the resultant premiums. Everyone knows that supply is limited to some extent whether the car is a limited model like the R or not so there is a mad scrabble for them, especially on launch as the cars are dead certs for instant appreciation. the fact that they are excellent dynamically is a nice bonus and I intentionally put that order that way.

Just look at the level of demand for the older gt3s which did depreciate if more slowly than the standard C2S. The world is a different place now I admit but I don't believe there are that many people people keen on the driving lark than before to explain the huge surge in demand of GT cars.

[monthefish]

Dan Trent said:

LaurasOtherHalf said:

monthefish said:

"Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?"
.
"not any time soon"


Classic clickbait.

This.

The busiest week in the motoring journalist calendar & PH come up with this crap.

And you clicked, right? And you had this question...

headline said:

Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?

...put directly to the two guys managing the department that has 1) just launched a mid-engined racing 911 to compete in frontline GT racing 2) is in charge of building current and future road product inspired by said racing cars and with a direct technology transfer in shared engines, homologation, etc... And the article then went on to detail their response.

I understand your sense of utter betrayal. Oh, hang on, no I don't.

Dan

That's a BS response. A more accurate headline for your article would have been "Next GT3 RS highly unlikely to be mid-engined" - why not use that?



Here's next weeks headline for you...
Next GT3 RS to be 4WD?

[article content] "No."

[GranCab]

Never you mind said:

isaldiri said:

What does irritate people obviously is the cars immediately appearing at the likes of JZM/Romans I suppose more than the good customers getting cars early and using them...

There was a Silver 991 GT3 RS at one dealer up north that the owner/flipper/speculator told them that he won't be picking up and to stick it in the showroom as soon as it came out of PDI check. Now if I was wanting one and didn't get one I would be majorly annoyed with said OPC and would probably take my business elsewhere. However I bet they still get the next GT car and will probably do the same.

My OPC blacklist anyone flipping their GT3s and GT4s.

[Dan Trent]

monthefish said:

That's a BS response. A more accurate headline for your article would have been "Next GT3 RS highly unlikely to be mid-engined" - why not use that?

Here's next weeks headline for you...
Next GT3 RS to be 4WD?

[article content] "No."

No it's not - why wouldn't they consider making the GT3 RS road car mid-engined at some stage, given the RSR is actually homologated from the RS and the whole point of the GT road cars is their bloodline to the competition models? Given how capable the 'base' GT3 now is - effectively overtaking the gen one RS in a number of key areas, not least its engine and choice between 'purist' manual for the road and 'lap-time' PDK for the track (sweeping generalisations but you get the point) - why not put a bigger gap between that and the RS and make the latter decidedly more 'exotic' to go chasing Ferrari, McLaren and Lamborghini in the <£200K bracket? It's not like GT3 911s have back seats anyway so they're not losing that 'functionality' that marks other 911s out compared with most rivals.

It's an interesting question put directly to the two key, senior guys who will - at some stage or other - make the decision. OK, they're not going to commit to anything at this stage but the conversation was batted around and discussed rather than outright dismissed.

Absolutely a worthwhile story. And not a misleading headline - an attention grabbing and provocative one sure. But we're hardly the first media outlet in the world to use that tactic are we.

Dan

[Dan Trent]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Agreed on all of that. But not impossible and not a ridiculous question to be asking of those two chaps as part of a wider ranging conversation, just to see what their response would be. If they'd flat said "we'd never do that, ever" then fine, no story. And I doubt it would happen for the gen two 991 RS, on the assumption such a thing will come. Preuninger's line was "why WOULDN"T we consider it" and Dr Frank wasn't contradicting him. He was quite funny on the RSR last time I spoke with him too - "it only took us 52 years" and all that.

Cheers,

Dan

[LaurasOtherHalf]

Dan Trent said:

not a misleading headline - an attention grabbing and provocative one sure. But we're hardly the first media outlet in the world to use that tactic are we.

Dan

I've snipped the rest of your quote as quite honestly, it's all waffle.

The thread doesn't say Next GT3 RS to be mid-engined?

There is no question mark in your click bate thread

[Dan Trent]

But it did! Dunno what happened to it in the forum version but the story I filed to the homepage had one.

Dan

[f1ten]

Yes you are bang on.
Let us not forget how ott an f40 or testarossa was in 1989 driving down there road. Recession then hit and everyone had to hide their wealth and well 959 and f40 didn't get replaced for quite a while i.e. 1996 for the f50
Porsche is playing to the hype and so they must sadly or they will go pop downside is like some have said I now have zero interest in a standard or s carrera model
Here is more choice than ever. Before at these price levels. Buyers must be voting wi their feet as I frankly never see a bogo 911 in london anymore so who is buying them ?!

anonymous said:

[redacted]

[LaurasOtherHalf]

Dan Trent said:

But it did! Dunno what happened to it in the forum version but the story I filed to the homepage had one.

Dan

But it doesn't;



Jeez man quit back peddling, or perhaps alert one of your mods to point out the error.

[Dan Trent]

Well we're both right then aren't we - not often that happens! :hippy

Cheers!

Dan

[LaurasOtherHalf]

Enjoy the clicks

crags