Are there any manufacturers WITHOUT a reliability nightmare?

[Andehh]

Yipper said:

As always, just buy Japanese. They know how to make a car last. Lexus, Honda, etc.

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/best-cars/driver-powe...

Blimey - some surprises down that List. Land Rover Discovery Mk4 - 91.9%. That's a serious impressive result seeing as it is big, heavy & old (based off Mk3 underpinnings...). As well as vastly more complicated then a lot of other vehicles on that list with Air Suspension, class leading towing, and all that off roading tech stuck to it!

[vsonix]

ch108 said:

Sometimes it's just your luck no matter what car you buy.

I reckon. I've had about 10 BMWs from 1996-2006 models and none of them have had VANOS issues. Some have been absolute peaches in terms of needing nothing but servicing and consumables, one or two others have had every single known issue turn up in the space of a couple of months ownership. None of them have ever left me stranded by the roadside though, which is the main thing.

[Truckosaurus]

As always those Power Rankings are mostly nonsense, witness the differing scores for identical cars such as the Aygo/C1/107 (same car, same engine, built in the same factory) and in general more 'white goods' marques scoring better than luxury brands due to lower expectations of the owners (except for Lexus which we all know are excellent and only driven by connoisseurs )

[Otispunkmeyer]

Japanese
Petrol
NA

I have 2. They don't go wrong. The Honda in particular has had some new shock absorbers. Thats it, in 11 years. Its still got most of its original bulbs as well!

[Otispunkmeyer]

The Crack Fox said:

cwis said:

mgv8 said:

Honda

Pretty much! The only thing that tends to happen are seizing brake calipers...

Last gen civic diesels had chocolate clutches. So the rumour mill says.

Solution is to buy a petrol version, which doesn't have enough torque to trouble even the most chocolatey of clutches. (diesels are not the Japanese's thing really, they only made them to quench our thirst for diesel, which is less popular in their home country. Toyota tried as well, but now they just re-badge BMW units.)

[LasseV]

Toyota and Lexus. Honda is the 3rd one.

[GTIAlex]

Ford Ecoboost failures.

Show me some statistics to back that up.

A few early problems with a coolant pipe which was soon upgraded.

Again, show me some statistics.

[Harvey Mushman00]

I use a 2003 1.6 petrol Civic, 130k covered to date and only ever had consumables replaced, the thing just never goes wrong, Lexus IS-F for weekends etc only done 38k so as expected nothing has gone wrong, in fact I don't expect it to suffer any failures in its lifetime with me, the 3 previous Lexus I have owned have cost me absolutely nothing in repairs.

[anonymous-user]

My Kia has been more reliable than any car I've owned. It makes my 2010 Hilux look flaky. My W211 E Class is like a 1980's Lancia in comparison.

Always go East for reliability.

[GC8]

The Crack Fox said:

caelite said:

Mx5? Seriously. From what I've read the NC generation onwards doesn't have the rust issues of the older ones

Wrong. And even the very latest ND model, when you poke about underneath, has terrible undersealing in the key areas where corrosion will appear.

NCs are rusting quite badly in some cases and Subaru engines are extremely durable on the whole. The issues are caused by fuel quality/RON principally and Id expect a normally aspirated engine to go on forever.

[ILoveMondeo]

GTIAlex said:

Ford Ecoboost failures.

Show me some statistics to back that up.

A few early problems with a coolant pipe which was soon upgraded.

Again, show me some statistics.

Dont take it personally, I never said these were fact, just what you read about disaster story's on the inter-webs

[havoc]

kambites said:

I think part of the problem is that issues are better publicised these days. Cars are probably getting more and more reliable (although I get the feeling that when they do break repairs tend to be more expensive than in yesteryear), it's just easy for people to complain to a larger audience when they do break.

With a few very exceptions, mechanical reliability wouldn't really worry me in a modern car. I own a K-series and it's never broken down in ten years of daily use.

Yes and no. (See footnote especially)

- The base mechanicals are far better than they used to be.
- The bodies are far better than they used to be.
- The electronics are far more complicated so whilst better, there's a lot more for something TO go wrong with*.
- As pointed out by a few, emissions regs. are making the control over engines and the sensors within them far more complicated, making a frustrating EMS light as likely as ever, far more difficult to track down, yet actually far less critical (unless it goes into limp-home mode).
- ...and then you've got DPFs (spit), turbos (a bunch of weak points all assembled together), EGRs (hmmm), DSGs (hmmm x2)...


OP - I'd go for a naturally-aspirated petrol Honda/Toyota/Mazda with a manual 'box, if you're looking for the most reliable powertrain. But Hondas have caliper and a/c issues, Toyota have had their own well-publicised faults (airbags, brakes, electricals), and I bet Mazda aren't immune...




* Boss' 3y.o. Range Rover Sport - oil-level sensor sender failure just before end of warranty = 3 weeks in the dealership (sump off, which means subframe and 1 axle off, etc...), 15 parts replaced, unknown bill (if out of warranty) as they wouldn't tell him!!! A £20 part failure resulted in what HAS to be a 4-figure bill...all because they deleted the dipstick...

[daveco]

I've learnt from past experience that going for cars as close to the end of their life cycle (as in, close to being replaced) can help get rid of a lot of big bills.

This is probably common knowledge, but it is amazing how many manufacturers release cars that are really not production ready at all.

[caelite]

GC8 said:

NCs are rusting quite badly in some cases and Subaru engines are extremely durable on the whole. The issues are caused by fuel quality/RON principally and Id expect a normally aspirated engine to go on forever.

Yeah upon further research I realise the NCs and even NDs are just as bad as the older ones from a design perspective. Although in theory the ND RF will suffer less from inner sill rust caused by the block drainage hole issues.

If what you say is correct then the GT86/BRZ may be a good contender for a PH worthy reliable car, personally I have had one too many turbo Impreza's to ever trust Subaru to design an engine which can go more than 10minutes without a serious drivetrain fault

[Over over under steer]

caelite said:

Mx5? Seriously.

From what I've read the NC generation onwards doesn't have the rust issues of the older one and that really was the only 'major' fault in them. The engines are pretty lazy, I know the old 1.8s are bulletproof, I can imagine the new 2.0s are just as good.

Agree, had a 2010 NC2 2.0 for nigh on three years and drove the nuts off it, apart from a yearly service it needed absolutely nothing. Took it from 15k up to 70k miles. Parked outside, driven throughout the year, seldom cleaned and not a sign of any rust.

[SuperchargedVR6]

Catatafish said:

Online reliability accounts are almost totally biased towards the negative aspects, and dosed with an insane amount of hyperbole.

Stories are passed off as gospel under the guise of "my mate had x go wrong" or "I reckon blah de blah" when really they are simply read online, exaggerated and passed on, containing very little to base any rational analysis on.

Yep, zero context & zero back story. Did the engine break because it was on a track day and oil surge cooked a rod bearing? Has the car got a full service history? Has the car been repaired properly, or just had things cable tied or gorilla glued back together? Has it been remapped it to spin the crap out of the turbo and smash a ring land?

It's the internet exaggeration and sensationalism of a particular issue that is more common than the issue itself, which causes people to need too much hand holding to make a purchase decision. "What car should I buy?" Grow a pair and just go and buy the car you want. Nothing in life is risk free.
You can only mitigate it by buying something basic and under stressed.

[GC8]

caelite said:

GC8 said:

NCs are rusting quite badly in some cases and Subaru engines are extremely durable on the whole. The issues are caused by fuel quality/RON principally and Id expect a normally aspirated engine to go on forever.

Yeah upon further research I realise the NCs and even NDs are just as bad as the older ones from a design perspective. Although in theory the ND RF will suffer less from inner sill rust caused by the block drainage hole issues.

If what you say is correct then the GT86/BRZ may be a good contender for a PH worthy reliable car, personally I have had one too many turbo Impreza's to ever trust Subaru to design an engine which can go more than 10minutes without a serious drivetrain fault

They hardly ever go wrong in Japan - its the fuel/owner problem that causes them to fail here. Some later hatches were chocolate too, but my experience is more with Classics and New Age saloons to a lesser degree.

NCs seem to have rusty sills as well, but I suspect that this has more to do with rainwater becoming trapped in the sills, than a Mazda quality issue. If you cleared the drain holes then everything would be very different.

[Rick101]

I think modern Lotus are vastly underrated. They really are fantastic cars and give much more enjoyment per pound than many of the others.

I considered many sports cars when deciding my 'list' and Lotus was always a strong contender. There are a small niche manufacturer and yes they often do have niggles, but nothing that would leave you stranded or with a bill running to thousands as many of the others do.

They really are superbly reliable cars, despite the silly bd thats wetting themselves in the haste to rush out and say...lotus, loads of trouble usually serious.