Fraudulent bankers draft update!!!
Discussion
The problem with a forged/fraudulent bankers draft is that no matter how good it is still a fraud.
You could insist on being paid cash but a good forged note is very hard to spot and you are likely to be dealing in large denomination notes so most likely lots of £20s and £50s. You could take the stack to the bank and try to cash it - the 18yr old trainee behind the counter might even let it all through but ultimately if it is forged you still lose the money and are probably going to be in yet more trouble for attempting to pay it in even though you knew nothing about it (being forged).
Any transaction is a matter of trust and there are no guarantees that the person you are dealing with is genuine. The more your car is worth the more likely you are to come into contact with a fraudster but even if you are flogging a £200 banger you can get caught short. Trading cars is a fairly easy way of laundering money so there are plenty of dodgy dealers out there both private and trade.
All you can do is be careful, be sensible and avoid the obvious traps.
You could insist on being paid cash but a good forged note is very hard to spot and you are likely to be dealing in large denomination notes so most likely lots of £20s and £50s. You could take the stack to the bank and try to cash it - the 18yr old trainee behind the counter might even let it all through but ultimately if it is forged you still lose the money and are probably going to be in yet more trouble for attempting to pay it in even though you knew nothing about it (being forged).
Any transaction is a matter of trust and there are no guarantees that the person you are dealing with is genuine. The more your car is worth the more likely you are to come into contact with a fraudster but even if you are flogging a £200 banger you can get caught short. Trading cars is a fairly easy way of laundering money so there are plenty of dodgy dealers out there both private and trade.
All you can do is be careful, be sensible and avoid the obvious traps.
smilerbaker said:
Think your flogging a dead horse here, its well known that bankers drafts arn't worth the paper they are written on. Ignorance is not a defence.
It's not that well known. Us PHers are a well informed bunch on the whole but most of the population believe a bankers draft is equivalent to cash.
t who gave it to you? have you got the police involved? not that they'll be interested as it'll involve a bit of work
The police have "eventually" begun looking in to it and things are progressing although it is not going to be solved overnight as it looks like a major organised crime syndicate might be behind it. We are making progress though and I hope to have some good news on that side of things soon ;o)
As for the bank though, no reply to my email yesterday, surprise surprise!
As for the bank though, no reply to my email yesterday, surprise surprise!
the only way a bank clerk could verify a draft would be to phone the issuing branch and check amounts/serial numbers. even if they did that there would be no guarantee that it wasnt a copy of a legit one. a draft clears much the same way as a cheque, equally inefficient so the lack of funds/fraud takes a week or so to discover.
only way to be sure on a draft is to see it written out in front of you in the bank...preferably same bank as your own so it can be paid straight back.
last time i sold a car the buyer wanted to fly over, buy it if all ok and then drive it off to sunny spain. so did it all thru my solicitor. buyer pays money to solicitor's client account in advance, if all agreed on day of sale, buyer takes car, solicitor pays you by bank transfer. if for whatever reason sale doesnt go thru then buyer gets his money back and his only risk if with the solicitor (who are used to handling large transfers for houses).
a bit of agg. to set up but only cost a couple of hundred quid and all went to plan.
in this case i would get a lawyer invloved. in fact probably the aa or rac can advise, they have lawyers who handle automotive issues and advice is free to members i believe
only way to be sure on a draft is to see it written out in front of you in the bank...preferably same bank as your own so it can be paid straight back.
last time i sold a car the buyer wanted to fly over, buy it if all ok and then drive it off to sunny spain. so did it all thru my solicitor. buyer pays money to solicitor's client account in advance, if all agreed on day of sale, buyer takes car, solicitor pays you by bank transfer. if for whatever reason sale doesnt go thru then buyer gets his money back and his only risk if with the solicitor (who are used to handling large transfers for houses).
a bit of agg. to set up but only cost a couple of hundred quid and all went to plan.
in this case i would get a lawyer invloved. in fact probably the aa or rac can advise, they have lawyers who handle automotive issues and advice is free to members i believe
When I worked in a high street Building society/bank I had a guy phone up who had just sold his lap top and was querying a cheque he had been given. He read out the numbers on the cheque and I could not tie them up with our accounts.
He brought the cheque in and it was a fake. It had been scanned from another cheque, but all the account numbers and sort codes had been changed.
We could not do anything about it as it was not a genuine bank cheque, just something someone had knocked up on a PC or Photocopier.
The guy lost about £500. Now if we had drawn the cheque from an account where fraudulent activity had occurred, then he may have had a chance of getting some compensation.
Thinking how the bank may see it. If I knock up a fake cheque on my PC, give it to you, then you try and bank it, they aren't going to suddenly give you the money.
I do hope you get it sorted though.
Re: fake money, working where I did you can spot a forged note a mile off. I could also easily spot fake £1 coins, and there are a lot of them around.
Good luck, it is a really s
t thing to happen. 
He brought the cheque in and it was a fake. It had been scanned from another cheque, but all the account numbers and sort codes had been changed.
We could not do anything about it as it was not a genuine bank cheque, just something someone had knocked up on a PC or Photocopier.
The guy lost about £500. Now if we had drawn the cheque from an account where fraudulent activity had occurred, then he may have had a chance of getting some compensation.
Thinking how the bank may see it. If I knock up a fake cheque on my PC, give it to you, then you try and bank it, they aren't going to suddenly give you the money.
I do hope you get it sorted though.
Re: fake money, working where I did you can spot a forged note a mile off. I could also easily spot fake £1 coins, and there are a lot of them around.
Good luck, it is a really s
t thing to happen. Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 12th September 20:24
Really sorry to hear the news here.
Having prepared bankers drafts in a former life when working in a branch of a UK high street clearer there are a few things that people can look out for. Obviously for security reasons I am not going to publicly state them here but any branch / cashier worth their salt will be able to give some advice.
As other have said the only really safe way to check the validity of the draft is to call the issuing brach and run through some checks. This seems to be becomming more difficult these days as some banks no longer allow you to call the branch - its a call centre in India or worse - but that another story.
Good luck with the police and MP
Having prepared bankers drafts in a former life when working in a branch of a UK high street clearer there are a few things that people can look out for. Obviously for security reasons I am not going to publicly state them here but any branch / cashier worth their salt will be able to give some advice.
As other have said the only really safe way to check the validity of the draft is to call the issuing brach and run through some checks. This seems to be becomming more difficult these days as some banks no longer allow you to call the branch - its a call centre in India or worse - but that another story.
Good luck with the police and MP
Just another reason why I try and deal in cash when I buy or sell. Less hassle in theory.
In practice I can see why people dont like cash - If you are selling a £25,000 car do you really want to be keeping that sort of cash in your house after the sale? or have that sort of cash on your person when taking it to the bank?
I knew a mate who sold a car for £1500. Nothing fancy, just an older mondeo. The buyer waited until after the banks had closed before buying the car. Therefore he knew my mate had £1500 cash sitting in his house overnight. So he came back after dark and tried to break in. Luckily he was caught in the act by a neighbour putting their bin out for the morning. He ran off, but was arrested later as my mate had his address so he could send the v5 away!!!!
In practice I can see why people dont like cash - If you are selling a £25,000 car do you really want to be keeping that sort of cash in your house after the sale? or have that sort of cash on your person when taking it to the bank?
I knew a mate who sold a car for £1500. Nothing fancy, just an older mondeo. The buyer waited until after the banks had closed before buying the car. Therefore he knew my mate had £1500 cash sitting in his house overnight. So he came back after dark and tried to break in. Luckily he was caught in the act by a neighbour putting their bin out for the morning. He ran off, but was arrested later as my mate had his address so he could send the v5 away!!!!
Best way is to meet the seller/buyer early in the day, agree the deal, call you bank & arrange a chaps transfer to the sellers account.
Go for lunch together, talk cars & the seller can call his bank after lunch to verify cleared funds in his account.
To the op, i hope you get this sorted, the bank are at fault here as you asked them to verify it, which they did.
Sadly, i think you may be on a hiding to nothing though.
Go for lunch together, talk cars & the seller can call his bank after lunch to verify cleared funds in his account.
To the op, i hope you get this sorted, the bank are at fault here as you asked them to verify it, which they did.
Sadly, i think you may be on a hiding to nothing though.
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