RE: German cars have to cut emissions
Tuesday 4th September 2007
German cars have to cut emissions
In five years time, every new European car will have to be as clean as a diesel Vauxhall Tigra
The German Environment Minister, Sigmar Gabriel, has said that ALL new cars built from 2012 will have to comply to Europe-wide emissions regulations.
All new cars will have to emit fewer than 120 grams of CO2 per kilometre, which will make life interesting for German performance and luxury car manufacturers.
To give an idea of scale, an Audi A6 2.7 emits 192g/km and a Porsche Cayenne 320 g/km. A Vauxhall Tigra 1.3 CDTI emits the required 120g/km. Oh dear.
Discussion
This sounds like a load of hot air. The article states that the minister has merely SAID this. He has not passed a law or even drafted a bill.
Ministers say alot of things, mostly crap so I wouldn't read too much into this.
Besides, which government will commit political suicide by instatntly killing of the German Luxury Saloon / Performance Car / SUV - an industry that employs a large part of the population and responsible for for a large share of exports?
Ministers say alot of things, mostly crap so I wouldn't read too much into this.
Besides, which government will commit political suicide by instatntly killing of the German Luxury Saloon / Performance Car / SUV - an industry that employs a large part of the population and responsible for for a large share of exports?
Don't see this happening. Basically they are saying all SUVs, sports cars and even large family saloons will be non-compliant ("illegal".
If you went for the "average" the problem is that you are saying companies that specialise in SUVs or sports cars and don't make other types will be non-compliant ("illegal". This would force smaller car companies to merge in order to gain a fleet that might be complient.
Ferrari and Fiat. Volksvagen and Porsche.
This would create a small number of super-manufacturers operating in monopolistic conditions - cannot be good for the public...unless they're planning on bloody "nationalising" the car manufacturers and will only allow the state-owned car maker to produce state-approved design cars.
ing green-meanie communists. It really is time we left the EU.
If you went for the "average" the problem is that you are saying companies that specialise in SUVs or sports cars and don't make other types will be non-compliant ("illegal". This would force smaller car companies to merge in order to gain a fleet that might be complient.
Ferrari and Fiat. Volksvagen and Porsche.
This would create a small number of super-manufacturers operating in monopolistic conditions - cannot be good for the public...unless they're planning on bloody "nationalising" the car manufacturers and will only allow the state-owned car maker to produce state-approved design cars.
ing green-meanie communists. It really is time we left the EU.
MK4 Slowride said:
So what about heavy industry when are they going to get limitations & extra taxes on their emissions? Very irritating all this.
Unlike the rest of the world, our rapidly declining manufacturing industry has been taxed on CO2 emissions for some time via a carbon tax on electrical power; of course none of this counts in China or the USA; what kind of mugs are we.Marki said:
Gazboy said:
Wasn't it the French who proposed this?
I might have known they would be behind it dingocooke said:
MK4 Slowride said:
So what about heavy industry when are they going to get limitations & extra taxes on their emissions? Very irritating all this.
Unlike the rest of the world, our rapidly declining manufacturing industry has been taxed on CO2 emissions for some time via a carbon tax on electrical power; of course none of this counts in China or the USA; what kind of mugs are we.otolith said:
Yes, and the EU will have to look to protectionist policies again if it restricts domestic manufacturers to making cars people don't want to buy.
Or, of course, manufacturers would start marketing 'light commercial vehicles' that are - of course - exempt from such restrictions, to general folks like you and me, which means we'd end up sitting in the same traffic jams as before in erm, light commercial vehicles with leather and air con, and emitting about double the volume of CO2 as back when we were allowed to choose the vehicle we wanted in the first place.
Then our domestic motor industry forgets how to build a decent car as there's no margin in them anymore.
Sounds strangely familiar, that...
Edited by 900T-R on Tuesday 4th September 12:16
Al 450 said:
And on the day Porsche announces it has bought more of VW? They can declare an average C02 amount based on everything from Lupo through to Cayenne.
This law is never going to happen.
Agreed.This law is never going to happen.
Besides if I remember correctly the proposed Kyoto protocol hasn't even worked properly, so I doubt very much this will.
Even the Tigra is actually 124g/km. How many cars are there that actually emit less than 120g/km?
I don't support these ideas, and I couldn't agree more about industry emitting more etc, but a lot of cars out there are actually hopelessly inefficient, and that hurts our wallets as emissions is directly linked to mpg. I'd obviously like to see cars like the TVR Sagaris and 911 Turbo still built (as they're made in relatively small numbers), but your average car on the street (0-60 in 9 or 10 seconds, top end of 120mph, 160-200 g/km and 35-40mpg) shouldn't really be using similar or more fuel than my Elise (0-60 in 5 seconds, top end of 135mph, 163g/km and 40-50mpg). We need more clever thinking from engineers - where an average family car uses considerably less fuel than something like my Elise.
I don't support these ideas, and I couldn't agree more about industry emitting more etc, but a lot of cars out there are actually hopelessly inefficient, and that hurts our wallets as emissions is directly linked to mpg. I'd obviously like to see cars like the TVR Sagaris and 911 Turbo still built (as they're made in relatively small numbers), but your average car on the street (0-60 in 9 or 10 seconds, top end of 120mph, 160-200 g/km and 35-40mpg) shouldn't really be using similar or more fuel than my Elise (0-60 in 5 seconds, top end of 135mph, 163g/km and 40-50mpg). We need more clever thinking from engineers - where an average family car uses considerably less fuel than something like my Elise.
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