RE: PH Heroes: VW Golf GTI

[ASBO]

MartinMGBGTSV8 said:

Deffo over-scored. Its a 6/10 car, an icon but not a hero. Its no where near as good as a Pug 205 Gti. The VW may have been the first but it will always be overshadowed by the Pug's superior looks, speed and handling.

In your humble opinion though

[vrooom]

I driven it, i found it be rubbish, not that fast compared to 205 GTI. very jelly alike body control. 1.8 8v engine bit gutless.

on other hand.. 205 GTI 1.6.. WOW much better car, and very quick car.

[900T-R]

cg360 said:

People knock these cars when they drive 15-20 year old versions which have barely been maintained.

Exactly. Of course your shiny, factory fresh new motor is always going to feel better than the one with 20 year old suspension bushes and aged rubber that you just left behind at the dealer lot. That does say nothing about the relative qualities of the car models.

The problem with '80s and '90s cars is their low market value - few will invest more than what's strictly needed to keep the car going from MOT to MOT on a car that may be worth £2K on a good day.

[torres del paine]

ASBO said:

MartinMGBGTSV8 said:

Deffo over-scored. Its a 6/10 car, an icon but not a hero. Its no where near as good as a Pug 205 Gti. The VW may have been the first but it will always be overshadowed by the Pug's superior looks, speed and handling.

In your humble opinion though

I'd say he's about spot on there.

Golfs have always been overrated, not to mention uninspiring to look at, slow and relatively dimwitted. The Mark 1 was pretty seminal and deserves some respect but they just got crapper and crapper as time went on. Overweight too.

Mark 3 and 4 were stodgy and boring.

I quite like the new GTI though even though it's too big.

[lordlee]

tps23 said:

Mark 2 was good but i still preferred the Pug

I had both and while I loved my Pug I feel the Golf a better all rounder and was far less of a buzz box!!

[ASBO]

torres del paine said:

ASBO said:

MartinMGBGTSV8 said:

Deffo over-scored. Its a 6/10 car, an icon but not a hero. Its no where near as good as a Pug 205 Gti. The VW may have been the first but it will always be overshadowed by the Pug's superior looks, speed and handling.

In your humble opinion though

I'd say he's about spot on there.

Golfs have always been overrated, not to mention uninspiring to look at, slow and relatively dimwitted. The Mark 1 was pretty seminal and deserves some respect but they just got crapper and crapper as time went on. Overweight too.

Mark 3 and 4 were stodgy and boring.

I quite like the new GTI though even though it's too big.

Again, in your humble opinion

MKII is widely regarded as the best of the bunch. Handling was not stodgy. Look at the number being used as track/sprint cars to illustrate this.

[GiorgioGT]

The spirit of crazy germans with crazy ideas still lives on; R36, W12 etc. But the thing that bugs me is that VW have lost its way with the GTi these days. VW really have let the GTi badge onto cars that don't deserve it, Mk5 Polo, Mk4 Golf for example

Old VW's are a pleasure to own. The fun factor is something you don't get in modern cars. A few trick mods and some half decent suspension and you will be upsetting alot of modern hot hatches.

Mk4 Golf GTi is the biggest joke ever to leave a VW dealership. 100bhp/tonne. Thats embarasing for a GTi. Concidering the Mk1 was about 140bhp/tonne.

god bless volkswagen. But Polo's are better, because they are not golfs

[dinkel]

I loved the sound of the Mk1. Interstate (Delft where I come from) had kits for 'em.

Now they do Alpina and AMG . . .

2K for a solid Mk2 GTi is good money. Trash in a year and get a new one. Don't care about the parking scratches

A Mk2 Golf is still a reasonable driving car. Imagine how it was in '84.

205 GTi for me . . .

[Teafortwo]

I've got a Mk2 8v as a daily driver. Big bumpers, in Tornado Red (cos red ones go faster )

Not so practical around speed hump infested north London anymore, but still puts a big smile on my face every time I get out of town and onto the B roads.

[drunknfuctup]

OVERRATED! I have owned a MKII 16v for a 1yr and a half and was extraordinarily disappointed. Slow, unreliable (I couldn't fix it faster than it was breaking), but good looking. 6/10 in my book. These cars are a labor of love for those subscribed to the VW cult, others need not apply......

[Dantxd]

GiorgioGT said:

Mk4 Golf GTi is the biggest joke ever to leave a VW dealership. 100bhp/tonne. Thats embarasing for a GTi. Concidering the Mk1 was about 140bhp/tonne.

Didn't the first incarnation of the Mk4 with the 2.0 only have like 115bhp in total? And a 0-60 of 11 seconds or something mad?

Dan

[Dave200]

Well, I am firmly in the Mk2 Golf GTi camp here. The 92 Mk2 8v I had is probably the best car I have owned, despite being the slowest.
It had some minor suspension and brake fettling, but was ultimately pretty stock, and it was an absolute hoot to drive. You could hurl it down country lanes and into corners, safe in the knowledge that the chassis was supple and communicative enough for you to get out of the other end with minimal fuss. Although with 120bhp/tonne it was never going to be rocket-fast in a straight line, the combination of easily-accessible torque and a nicely balanced gearbox meant that the car never had any problem picking up and dragging itself between corners.

I have driven three 205 GTis (one of which was an Mi16'd example) and I wasn't really all that impressed with them. They are in a completely different (lower) league to the VW in terms of build quality and ergonomics, and I couldn't shake the feeling that the "skittish" handling was going to throw me into the roadside furniture as soon as I pushed it.
On the other hand, I drove a friend's 106 GTi more recently and I must say that it was a country mile better than the 205s in all respects.

The "best" is obviously going to be very subjective, based on what different people look for in cars, but I just personally couldn't see a case for choosing the Peugeot over the VW...

[joz8968]

The only one to have is an unmolested, concours Mk.1 1800 GTI in Mars Red... with the Pirelli P alloys... size, weight, proportions - all spot on.

Edited by joz8968 on Wednesday 12th December 14:05

[joz8968]

<...we won't worry about the brakes>

[joz8968]

Dantxd said:

GiorgioGT said:

Mk4 Golf GTi is the biggest joke ever to leave a VW dealership. 100bhp/tonne. Thats embarasing for a GTi. Concidering the Mk1 was about 140bhp/tonne.

Didn't the first incarnation of the Mk4 with the 2.0 only have like 115bhp in total? And a 0-60 of 11 seconds or something mad?

Dan

...Plus the infamous phoney front foglights!

[Orangecurry]

ASBO said:

torres del paine said:

ASBO said:

MartinMGBGTSV8 said:

Deffo over-scored. Its a 6/10 car, an icon but not a hero. Its no where near as good as a Pug 205 Gti. The VW may have been the first but it will always be overshadowed by the Pug's superior looks, speed and handling.

In your humble opinion though

I'd say he's about spot on there.

Golfs have always been overrated, not to mention uninspiring to look at, slow and relatively dimwitted. The Mark 1 was pretty seminal and deserves some respect but they just got crapper and crapper as time went on. Overweight too.

Mark 3 and 4 were stodgy and boring.

I quite like the new GTI though even though it's too big.

Again, in your humble opinion

MKII is widely regarded as the best of the bunch. Handling was not stodgy. Look at the number being used as track/sprint cars to illustrate this.

So how many of you dissenters have owned one?

I've owned six, and still own my mk1.

Looks? It was designed by Giorgetto Giugiaro (Car designer of the Century) - the Pug was designed by... a frenchman. (OK that's a lie obviously)

dear oh dear - EVO magazine doesn't give out too many 5* ratings - Mk2 16v gets one.

Mk3 being stodgy and boring is a myth - the mk3 16v has a better power to weight over the mk2 16v, and I drove one for 20k miles and loved every second; it's just a bit too refined and you don't realise how fast/quick it is.

We had our mk2 16v for years and years, and loved it; a friend had a 1.9 Pug at the same time - sure the pug was a bit quicker, but you were on a knife-edge of handling, and where it span, the mk2 did not.

The only ones which let down the mk2 are the post 1988 8v, which had a revised fuel injection system which just didn't perform for some reason. We had an mk2 8v 1986 which went like a train.

As to fun - well I've got a lairy RWD BMW from the age of trailing-arm rear-suspension, which (in the wet) will tip you into the scenery if you don't watch it constantly, a Prodrive Impreza, which is devastating in all weathers, and an unmodified mk1 GTI, on Pirelli wheels with 185 tyres.

They are all GREAT fun (otherwise I wouldn't have them), but the GTI is by far the most fun, because you can explore the limits of physics in it AT MUCH LOWER SPEEDS than the other two, because it weighs as much as a packet of biscuits and handles like a housefly.

A constant grin factor vs tiny running costs and over 30mpg if driven hard;

Bigger on the inside and smaller on the outside than a BMW MINI;

heap that on top of the fact the pug/clios are made of tin-foil and most have rusted-away or are crumpled in a field somewhere leaves you with the definate GTI HERO

[AdamMX-5]

My 2nd car was a 90G Mk2 8v (last of the small bumpers) and I loved it. Replaced a 205 Roland Garros (camp XS) and whilst the Golf didn't feel that much quicker (paper 0-60 was the same would you believe!) it was a far better car and, crucially, never let me down like the 205 did constantly despite having double the miles up it.

Also had a Mk3 GTi and a VR6 - Mk3 GTi underrated in my opinion.

[RacingTeatray]

I've had five Golf GTIs in the past - a B-reg Mk2 GTI, a G-reg Mk2 GTI 16v, an H-reg Mk2 2.0 GTI 16v (USA-spec), a J-reg Mk2 GTI 16v 5dr and, briefly a 1993 Mk3 GTI.

The Mk3 was admittedly pants and I went back to a Mk2 afterwards, but the four Mk2s were all great. The B-reg GTI was still going strong on 286k miles when I sold it. The best was the 1992 5dr valver (see My Cars in profile) - it was a hoot to drive, solidly reliable and, in metallic black with black leather and BBS RMs, even in 2003 when I sold it, it looked easily smart enough to rock up anywhere (not something you could say of most 11yr old hot hatches).

Edited by RacingTeatray on Wednesday 12th December 14:14

[uremaw]

I pick up my new-old '88 Mk2 GTI 8v on the 20th Dec, having never driven it but always fancied one. Wanted a Pug 205 as well (bid unsuccesfully on the Pistonheads one). I'll let you know if it's as good as i hope it is.

[puffpuff]

I had nine Golf GTIs over the years; some good, some not so good but all were enjoyable. Best by far was my MkII 16V which, after a bit of work to brakes, suspension, head/exhaust and wheels/tyres was an absolute hoot to drive.

I once saw an indicated 147mph on an autobahn, had a grin right round the back of my head that day!!

For their time, they were pretty good straight out of the box but, as with just about every car, could be made even better - the likes of Brian Ricketts, GTI Engineering, Tim Stiles Racing and AMD saw to that.

It was 20 years ago I blasted down to Austria with half a dozen mates for the GTI Treffen. We were blown away by the enthusiasm and started CLUB GTI after we returned.

Those were the days....... Now I potter about in a TDI but the sound of a GTI with drilled airbox still makes my ears prick up.