RE: Volkswagen Golf GTI
Discussion
thehawk said:
rsstman said:
collateral said:
thehawk said:
Targarama said:
OK, reality check. The RS6 and Evo8 were probably not trying, or not expecting the Golf to be trying. The Golf will still be making less than 300hp.
A very conservative remap and exhaust would give an Edition 30 300bhp as a minimum.With what was described (fuel pump etc) it should be 330bhp minimum.
blank said:
I WISH said:
I love my GT TDI 170 DSG. Its one of the most impressive cars I've ever owned. Handles well and the mid range performance feels like it could even be better than my Elise ..... masses of mid range torque.
What is mid range performance?Targarama said:
rwd.wiganer said:
Rocky Balboa said:
Too fat. Too heavy. Slower than the previous model. Awful.
When the f
k are these cars going to start losing weight! Pisses me off!
I must admit this used to be how I looked at new cars in general! I know the new Golf is not to my taste at all, but a friend of mine has completely changed my perspective on them! When the f
k are these cars going to start losing weight! Pisses me off!Mk5 GTI 'Edition 30' with DSG
Miltek Exhaust
Revo chip
FMIC
Uprated fuel pump... and thats it! 1.6 bar standard turbo and engine internals!
I have actually seen it pull away from an RS6 and a 400bhp Evo 8
it really is impressive for a rep car! Gridl0k said:
For what it's worth, day to day I drive a C43 AMG - hardly an antique - and my Golf has roughly 330bhp/ton.
C43 - well thats only 3 generations of AMG C class out of date... and a C63 is better in every respect. Yes I have driven both. As for the Golf - im 100% confident that my 330hp per ton Octavia would destroy your vintage mkII.... in the same way im sure a 330bhp per ton MK VI would kill the Octavia.
Just because you prefer old metal doesnt mean you have to have rose tinted glasses about newer stuff. Im sure the Golf is a real hoot - been involved in the building of some silly Mk IIs and the C43 is still a cool car - but not really relevant to a new Mk VI gti is it? Safety, equipment and CO2 output and warranties are relevant to a new car.
dom180 said:
More fool them then! Clarkson just writes controversial stuff so people read him - I recall he actually bought a convertable Lamborghini - if the mk5 GTI was so good, why didn't he buy one lol!
There are a lot of comments here from people who really don't understand the appeal of the GTi. Do people really think VW see the Focus RS et al as rivals?! They're totally different cars for God's sake! I doubt they were considered at all during the development of the new car.andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
Get over it!
Well it's probably not a bad car if you don't want an involving driving experience but VW do push the performance angle in their marketing so I think it's a very fair comparison - to charge virtually as much (or more, optioned up) as an RS, given that that offers so much more in terms of either interaction (no computer stopping simultaneous use of brakes and throttle or a non-switch off stability system for starters) or performance, is quite amusing to me, at any rate.
Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
Edited: I'd be very surprised if VW aren't benchmarking the RS against their proper GTI, the R20.
Get over it!
Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
Edited: I'd be very surprised if VW aren't benchmarking the RS against their proper GTI, the R20.
andrewparker said:
dom180 said:
More fool them then! Clarkson just writes controversial stuff so people read him - I recall he actually bought a convertable Lamborghini - if the mk5 GTI was so good, why didn't he buy one lol!
There are a lot of comments here from people who really don't understand the appeal of the GTi. Do people really think VW see the Focus RS et al as rivals?! They're totally different cars for God's sake! I doubt they were considered at all during the development of the new car.andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
Get over it!
Edited by dom180 on Saturday 18th April 21:53
dom180 said:
Well it's probably not a bad car if you don't want an involving driving experience but VW do push the performance angle in their marketing so I think it's a very fair comparison - to charge virtually as much (or more, optioned up) as an RS, given that that offers so much more in terms of either interaction (no computer stopping simultaneous use of brakes and throttle or a non-switch off stability system for starters) or performance, is quite amusing to me, at any rate.
Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
Get over it!
Do you have any examples of said marketing? As far as I was aware VW's press release centred largely around the improvements in refinement and build quality over the MKV, and hence answering what their loyal fan base asked for. I would fully understand your point if VW had come out and said that the MK6 is the last word in performance, but they haven't. As for the GTi image, well that has moved over the years, to the point where the GTi is seen as the mature choice. I'd say VW play to this. Even the R20 won't be a Focus RS rival in my opinion.Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
andrewparker said:
dom180 said:
More fool them then! Clarkson just writes controversial stuff so people read him - I recall he actually bought a convertable Lamborghini - if the mk5 GTI was so good, why didn't he buy one lol!
There are a lot of comments here from people who really don't understand the appeal of the GTi. Do people really think VW see the Focus RS et al as rivals?! They're totally different cars for God's sake! I doubt they were considered at all during the development of the new car.andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
Get over it!
The comparison just doesn't make sense to me.
You can download a pdf brochure from their website, www.volkswagen.co.uk
P2:
"Breathtaking. Quite simply, more charismatic, more stylish
and more exhilarating than ever before."
Suppose the 5 door makes some sense if you have a family but I still see this car as a cynical marketing exercise - and given the price, I'd think a lot of (the more image conscious) buyers would prefer to opt for a 3 series derivitive!
The comparison just doesn't make sense to me.
P2:
"Breathtaking. Quite simply, more charismatic, more stylish
and more exhilarating than ever before."
Suppose the 5 door makes some sense if you have a family but I still see this car as a cynical marketing exercise - and given the price, I'd think a lot of (the more image conscious) buyers would prefer to opt for a 3 series derivitive!
andrewparker said:
dom180 said:
Well it's probably not a bad car if you don't want an involving driving experience but VW do push the performance angle in their marketing so I think it's a very fair comparison - to charge virtually as much (or more, optioned up) as an RS, given that that offers so much more in terms of either interaction (no computer stopping simultaneous use of brakes and throttle or a non-switch off stability system for starters) or performance, is quite amusing to me, at any rate.
Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
Get over it!
Do you have any examples of said marketing? As far as I was aware VW's press release centred largely around the improvements in refinement and build quality over the MKV, and hence answering what their loyal fan base asked for. I would fully understand your point if VW had come out and said that the MK6 is the last word in performance, but they haven't. As for the GTi image, well that has moved over the years, to the point where the GTi is seen as the mature choice. I'd say VW play to this. Even the R20 won't be a Focus RS rival in my opinion.Lol that VW can exploit the GTI "image" to that extent especially given the price hike and marginal improvements (?) over the mk5.
andrewparker said:
dom180 said:
More fool them then! Clarkson just writes controversial stuff so people read him - I recall he actually bought a convertable Lamborghini - if the mk5 GTI was so good, why didn't he buy one lol!
There are a lot of comments here from people who really don't understand the appeal of the GTi. Do people really think VW see the Focus RS et al as rivals?! They're totally different cars for God's sake! I doubt they were considered at all during the development of the new car.andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
Get over it!
The comparison just doesn't make sense to me.
If you're image conscious the one car you don't buy is a 3-series! I drove a 330Ci prior to buying my MKV GTi, and great car thought it was, it doesn't give people the best impression!
I just think the GTi is doing what it has always done, evolving. Fair enough, the improvements over the MKV don't make me want to go out and buy one, and many, including myself would have liked to have seen improved acceleration times, but there's a big difference between speed and performance. The GTi is still a quick car cross country, but it isn't marketed as "super quick".
I just think the GTi is doing what it has always done, evolving. Fair enough, the improvements over the MKV don't make me want to go out and buy one, and many, including myself would have liked to have seen improved acceleration times, but there's a big difference between speed and performance. The GTi is still a quick car cross country, but it isn't marketed as "super quick".
But what's a realistic 0-60 acceleration given that it is front wheel drive. I think it's 6.6 for DSG model and maybe you'd get a second off that with some easy mods but it will never be able to get the grip down like a RWD or 4WD.
It's in gear acceleration is actually pretty good, and that's what I mean when i say an Evo or RS6 wouldn't 'destroy' it - if you take a look at things like 30-50 then there is nothing in it.
It's in gear acceleration is actually pretty good, and that's what I mean when i say an Evo or RS6 wouldn't 'destroy' it - if you take a look at things like 30-50 then there is nothing in it.
The Golf (MKV and I guess MKVI) is quick enough and that's the point.
These cars are about more than the performance figures. It's about the vehicle as a package.
Like I said these are the Ikea sofa of the car world. Not the best performer, not the best in class but they take the middle path and fulfill their design brief very well.
These cars are about more than the performance figures. It's about the vehicle as a package.
Like I said these are the Ikea sofa of the car world. Not the best performer, not the best in class but they take the middle path and fulfill their design brief very well.
wigsworld said:
Pommygranite said:
wigsworld said:
This car is a complete rip off. If you start adding a few extras to these you're looking at 26k at least. I think it's possible to spend 32k with every conceivable option. I'm sure it's a decent drive but you can get better cars for quite a lot less these days. It also looks really boring to my eyes.
p.s compared to its rivals you can select a lot more options so yes it will cost more. Like for like i believe is a similiar cost.I'd be interested to see what cars you think are better for a lot less?
With regards to character i would say thats subjective (bland focus cabin anyone), and i believe the handling of the Golf is regarded as sweeter (i'm open to being wrong on this one) with the Focus a lot more nose heavy.
Mazda 3 MPS - 2 words: torque steer. And the new Mazda has no more power than the other. Also character is certainly not its strong point. Fast rental car comes to mind.
I like the 3 and the Focus, dont get me wrong, but the Golf just seems to have more bases covered more of the time.
Pommygranite said:
You make an interesting point. However if you look at the fuel consumption of a Focus ST, at 10mpg worse consumption in the real world compared to the Golf, you are then down approx 800 pounds a year based on 15,000 miles. So over a 3 year ownership thats your purchase price benefit wiped out.
Am I right in thinking you'd be £200 a year worse off from tax aswell?andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
You have a 4 door GTI, how strange, must be a one off. I only thought they built a 3dr or a 5dr but i stand to be corrected.The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
On the subject of GTI's, am a big fan, my MKV GTI was the second favorite car i've owned, my Impreza being the favorite. The Golf was a better everyday car, i could park it up without to much worry about some one trying to nick it and i could turn up at a 5 star hotel and not look out of place. Not so with the Impreza.
Edited by my93wrx on Sunday 19th April 12:14
blank said:
Pommygranite said:
You make an interesting point. However if you look at the fuel consumption of a Focus ST, at 10mpg worse consumption in the real world compared to the Golf, you are then down approx 800 pounds a year based on 15,000 miles. So over a 3 year ownership thats your purchase price benefit wiped out.
Am I right in thinking you'd be £200 a year worse off from tax aswell?Pommygranite said:
You make an interesting point. However if you look at the fuel consumption of a Focus ST, at 10mpg worse consumption in the real world compared to the Golf, you are then down approx 800 pounds a year based on 15,000 miles. So over a 3 year ownership thats your purchase price benefit wiped out.
I'd suggest that it is actually more like 5 - 8 mpg (real world) and thus more like £500pa. When I was looking/buying, the difference in price between the two in equivalent circumstances was £3 - £4k. Not going to get that back in 3 years, are you. No doubt someone will now trot out the depreciation argument (again, I see it has already been tried) but I would suggest looking at real world money rather than theoretical stuff. If you do you will find there isn't much difference.Pommygranite said:
With regards to character i would say thats subjective (bland focus cabin anyone), and i believe the handling of the Golf is regarded as sweeter (i'm open to being wrong on this one) with the Focus a lot more nose heavy.
You pays your money and makes your choice as both have their strong points. I'm not sure how you can call the Focus' interior bland in comparison to the Golf (a bit nicer and better built fair enough, but that's not character, is it) & the advantages of the Golf's handling need to be balanced against the infinitely greater character of the engine in the ST.Pommygranite said:
Mazda 3 MPS - 2 words: torque steer. And the new Mazda has no more power than the other. Also character is certainly not its strong point. Fast rental car comes to mind.
The Evo test of the MPS against the S3/130i/Brera seemed to be rather more complimentary of the Mazda's abilities. I'd agree though that it doesn't get the juices flowing, well mine anyway. Pommygranite said:
I like the 3 and the Focus, dont get me wrong, but the Golf just seems to have more bases covered more of the time.
I like the Golf but a lot of the misnomers around reliability, purchase & running costs and image are usually a bit mis-directed.
my93wrx said:
andrewparker said:
I'd echo the comments of those who say the comparison with the more hardcore hot hatches, the Focus RS and R26.R, is a pointless one. I'd seriously doubt anyone who test drives a GTi will consider either of those two. In fact I'd reckon the 3-series is possibly it's closest rival, even though it's in a different class.
The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
You have a 4 door GTI, how strange, must be a one off. I only thought they built a 3dr or a 5dr but i stand to be corrected.The GTi is, as I see it, a family car for people who are into cars, it bridges the class divide, and as Clarkson says, is all things to all men! I've driven my 2006 black 4-door GTi everyday since I bought it, and it has provided thrills and practicality. I don't think I'll sell it.
Edited by my93wrx on Sunday 19th April 12:14
Targarama said:
blank said:
I WISH said:
I love my GT TDI 170 DSG. Its one of the most impressive cars I've ever owned. Handles well and the mid range performance feels like it could even be better than my Elise ..... masses of mid range torque.
What is mid range performance?Modern ones are smooth and make power all the way to the slightly higher redline, you dont end up stuck in a no mans land and committed either... especially seen as though I note he has a DSG gearbox...
Edited by Matt_ on Monday 20th April 10:39
Matt_ said:
Targarama said:
blank said:
I WISH said:
I love my GT TDI 170 DSG. Its one of the most impressive cars I've ever owned. Handles well and the mid range performance feels like it could even be better than my Elise ..... masses of mid range torque.
What is mid range performance?Modern ones are smooth and make power all the way to the slightly higher redline, you dont end up stuck in a no mans land and committed either... especially seen as though I note he has a DSG gearbox...
Edited by Matt_ on Monday 20th April 10:39
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