Reliability - does it exist in a modern diesel?
Discussion
Now first of all I dont get too much into the petrol VS diesel debate - or care for it as allot of non-sense spouting on both sides of argument.
However - my past two modern TDIs have suffered similar problems and my Volvo V70 is suffering a similar fate.
It had injectors replaced at 60k and now the autobox needs replaced. My previous 330d needed injectors and various emissions related gubbins replacing at around 88k.
Prior to that I have a Golf GT TDI that had injector probs at 70k
To me it seems that to eek out the last drop of performance and economy modern engines are in danger of becoming far too delicate and fragile for long term use.
I don't think its going to be isolated to diesels either if you look at progress with super and turbo charging petrol cars?
Not sure why I am posting this, but its getting to point where you start wondering where we crossed the line between solid and reliable - to cutting edge but potentially catastrophic.
Or is it just my perception?
However - my past two modern TDIs have suffered similar problems and my Volvo V70 is suffering a similar fate.
It had injectors replaced at 60k and now the autobox needs replaced. My previous 330d needed injectors and various emissions related gubbins replacing at around 88k.
Prior to that I have a Golf GT TDI that had injector probs at 70k
To me it seems that to eek out the last drop of performance and economy modern engines are in danger of becoming far too delicate and fragile for long term use.
I don't think its going to be isolated to diesels either if you look at progress with super and turbo charging petrol cars?
Not sure why I am posting this, but its getting to point where you start wondering where we crossed the line between solid and reliable - to cutting edge but potentially catastrophic.
Or is it just my perception?
edo said:
A3 TDI 170 dpf. 15,000 miles completed no issues.
Pre LCI 320d 20,000 miles no issues
335d Coup no issues in 10k
Current 320d 11k since 1st march - one minor issue nothing to do with engine.
That's because problems don't occur until higher mileages...Pre LCI 320d 20,000 miles no issues
335d Coup no issues in 10k
Current 320d 11k since 1st march - one minor issue nothing to do with engine.
I had injectors go on my Mondeo TDCi - cost nearly £800 to get replaced. It has put me off diesels for the moment, even if I do a minimum of 2k miles a month.
Which model year V70 is it? The 2002 D5's had injector issues and 2000-2002 models had autogearbox issues (not isolated to Volvo's btw - the same boxes are used in lots of cars and also give trouble) but the 2003-2005's are generally very solid.
However, in 2006 they bought out the EU4 diesels which give a whole set of new problems.
However, in 2006 they bought out the EU4 diesels which give a whole set of new problems.
confused_buyer said:
Which model year V70 is it? The 2002 D5's had injector issues and 2000-2002 models had autogearbox issues (not isolated to Volvo's btw - the same boxes are used in lots of cars and also give trouble) but the 2003-2005's are generally very solid.
However, in 2006 they bought out the EU4 diesels which give a whole set of new problems.
2006 Euro IV version - because its covered by warranty not particulary worried, but interested in peoples perceptions.However, in 2006 they bought out the EU4 diesels which give a whole set of new problems.
I will be choosing my next car very carefully!
I have done 135k Miles in an Alpina D3 no issues what so ever although I think it will need a new Air Flow Meter at the next service but that is about £400 worth.
Just needed Servicing and Tyres in the last 3 Years
Before that had an Audi a4 TDI 130 (02 Plate) ran reliably up until 198k miles and then needed another Turbo was running fine up to 220k miles when it was written off by a colleague who had borrowed it - I wasn't happy because I had just taken delivery of the Alpina and was going to give the Audi to my wife to use.
Short Answer I think is Yes - however I always let my cars warm up before giving them any beans and always let the turbos cool down if I have been driving enthusiasticaly touch wood all the cars I have had have been pretty reliable
Just needed Servicing and Tyres in the last 3 Years
Before that had an Audi a4 TDI 130 (02 Plate) ran reliably up until 198k miles and then needed another Turbo was running fine up to 220k miles when it was written off by a colleague who had borrowed it - I wasn't happy because I had just taken delivery of the Alpina and was going to give the Audi to my wife to use.
Short Answer I think is Yes - however I always let my cars warm up before giving them any beans and always let the turbos cool down if I have been driving enthusiasticaly touch wood all the cars I have had have been pretty reliable
I have a friend that has a 2002 Ford Focus TDCI 115 BHP Ghia. Since picking it up 2 years ago the work he has had done on it exceeds £2000, closer to £3000 now, and he still needs new injectors. This is a car with less than 100k on it and a full service history, head gasket went, heating matrix, injectors repeatedly fail.
halo34 said:
To me it seems that to eek out the last drop of performance and economy modern engines are in danger of becoming far too delicate and fragile for long term use.
Or is it just my perception?
I don't think so, it stands to reason that something has to give in the cost/durabilty/performance/economy equation. Or is it just my perception?
A modern 1900cc oil burner can chuck out 170bhp and return over 50mpg, compare that to 10 years ago, what's changed? technology and tolerances. Fuel rail pressures are very high as are boost pressures, add that to variable geo turbos and injectors made from dilythium crystals or something and you can see where we're going. fuel pumps at £1600, injectors at £800.
Tony*T3 said:
A4 TDi. 226,000 miles, no major mechanical issues.
My A6 is barely even run in then at 97,000. Only problems so far has been needing a new A/C compressor and fan (old one had shattered....), and its now needing a new drivers door window rubber, as its got all crinkly and the window is a nightmare to close ....pbarlow0032 said:
Thats why i've just bought a 3 litre V6 petrol 
manages 28mpg round the doors, don't do massive mileage in it, and there are no expensive turbo/injectors to go wrong.
Oh, and it sounds quite nice too....
manages 28mpg round the doors, don't do massive mileage in it, and there are no expensive turbo/injectors to go wrong.Oh, and it sounds quite nice too....
sounds good, what car is has a 3ltr V6 petrol I thought, so I checked your profile garage and it states SAAB diesel..hmmmm.northandy said:
We have just got rid of a 2 and a bit year old 118d with 83k on the clock, no issues with it at all in all that time.
I have a 120d with 63k on it, and no issues again.
I know of someone with over 100k on a 120d bought in 2008
Mine was the same until recently when the DCS unit went £700 with a BMW goodwill gesture! I have a 120d with 63k on it, and no issues again.
I know of someone with over 100k on a 120d bought in 2008
From what I've seen, I'd definately say that diesels are becoming less reliable - most old-tech diesel engines very unstressed low-output engines often without electrical/management gubbins, and these all seem to soldier on for eternity.
Modern diesels on the other hand are obviously alot more stressed with the ever-increasing power/torque output, and controlled by complex engine management with lots of sensors and electrical gubbins - result seems to be alot more reliability issues, and alot more trips to the dealer/garage. Turbos failing seems to be common, injectors seem more prone to failure, sensor issues (MAF's in particular) and other random electrical gremlins.
As an example, I know three people that have had turbos fail on BMW x20d engines alone, all within the 3 year warranty period. All standard cars, all FSH, and two of them 1 owner from new so there's no issue of past neglect. Yet by the same token, I don't know anyone that's had a turbo fail on an old-tech diesel, despite often intergalactic mileage, neglected services, and many more years worth of use.
Not such an issue for the first owner or two, for whom the car will likely be under warranty and lowish mileage, but I wouldn't fancy owning a high-mileage one a few years down the road.
Modern diesels on the other hand are obviously alot more stressed with the ever-increasing power/torque output, and controlled by complex engine management with lots of sensors and electrical gubbins - result seems to be alot more reliability issues, and alot more trips to the dealer/garage. Turbos failing seems to be common, injectors seem more prone to failure, sensor issues (MAF's in particular) and other random electrical gremlins.
As an example, I know three people that have had turbos fail on BMW x20d engines alone, all within the 3 year warranty period. All standard cars, all FSH, and two of them 1 owner from new so there's no issue of past neglect. Yet by the same token, I don't know anyone that's had a turbo fail on an old-tech diesel, despite often intergalactic mileage, neglected services, and many more years worth of use.
Not such an issue for the first owner or two, for whom the car will likely be under warranty and lowish mileage, but I wouldn't fancy owning a high-mileage one a few years down the road.
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