Should winter tyres be made compulsory in the UK?

[OnTheRoof96]

JCW said:

Does anyone have experience of Avon Ice Touring winter tyres? Only ones I can find at present.

They tend to come last in ADAC tests:

http://www1.adac.de/Tests/Reifentests/Winterreifen...

Where are you trying to source them? Mytyres is generally good, Event tyres too, alternatively I got my last set direct from Germany via www.reifen.com - very fast and good value delivery made them cheaper to buy there than from a UK supplier.

[Twincam16]

I'd say no to compulsory winter tyres, but yes to compulsory snow chains being carried in the boot.

Once word got around, manufacturers would start building-in compartments for them in the spare wheel wells.

[kambites]

I though snow chains were no good in the UK because we never get enough snow to avoid them chewing up the road.

[Shropshiremike]

BMWs on an icerink

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s&fea...

[ewenm]

Twincam16 said:

I'd say no to compulsory winter tyres, but yes to compulsory snow chains being carried in the boot.

Once word got around, manufacturers would start building-in compartments for them in the spare wheel wells.

I'd have said winter tyres were more useful more of the time than snow chains.

[Twincam16]

kambites said:

I though snow chains were no good in the UK because we never get enough snow to avoid them chewing up the road.

Suppose it depends on the 'heaviness of duty' of said chains.

Studded snow tyres would make just as much of a mess, surely?

[Twincam16]

ewenm said:

Twincam16 said:

I'd say no to compulsory winter tyres, but yes to compulsory snow chains being carried in the boot.

Once word got around, manufacturers would start building-in compartments for them in the spare wheel wells.

I'd have said winter tyres were more useful more of the time than snow chains.

Possibly true, but imagine the twice-yearly faff of having to swap your wheels over, especially if you're elderly or infirm. OK, so you could take it to a garage, but it'd just be another inconvenient expense for most people, I'd imagine.

[beanbag]

OnTheRoof96 said:

JCW said:

Does anyone have experience of Avon Ice Touring winter tyres? Only ones I can find at present.

They tend to come last in ADAC tests:

http://www1.adac.de/Tests/Reifentests/Winterreifen...

Where are you trying to source them? Mytyres is generally good, Event tyres too, alternatively I got my last set direct from Germany via www.reifen.com - very fast and good value delivery made them cheaper to buy there than from a UK supplier.

I can highly recommend Goodyear Ultra Grip 7+ tyres. It's the only set I've used but I've done 6500km with them so far and they've been superb offering masses of grip in the current conditions with next to no wear.

(And contrary to belief, very good grip in the dry too).

They also score very highly in a lot of tests and aren't too expensive either.

On a negative note, I haven't a clue where to buy them in the UK. They're pretty common in Germany and Austria though and I'm sure they can be ordered from any decent tyre shop.

[OnTheRoof96]

kambites said:

I though snow chains were no good in the UK because we never get enough snow to avoid them chewing up the road.

Yup, snow chains in the UK are generally a complete waste of time. I've only ever used them a couple of times in my life, on all occasions high up in the Alps when there was signficant (>50cm) snow around.

[F i F]

Twincam16 said:

kambites said:

I though snow chains were no good in the UK because we never get enough snow to avoid them chewing up the road.

Suppose it depends on the 'heaviness of duty' of said chains.

Studded snow tyres would make just as much of a mess, surely?

Yet more misinformation.

Studless studless studless studless aka friction tyres is what we are talking about.

Studded not appropriate for use in UK 99.999999% of the time, even in this winter.

[ewenm]

Twincam16 said:

ewenm said:

Twincam16 said:

I'd say no to compulsory winter tyres, but yes to compulsory snow chains being carried in the boot.

Once word got around, manufacturers would start building-in compartments for them in the spare wheel wells.

I'd have said winter tyres were more useful more of the time than snow chains.

Possibly true, but imagine the twice-yearly faff of having to swap your wheels over, especially if you're elderly or infirm. OK, so you could take it to a garage, but it'd just be another inconvenient expense for most people, I'd imagine.

As opposed to more frequent faff of putting chains on, taking them off, putting them on again...

None of it should be compulsory though.

[beanbag]

F i F said:

Twincam16 said:

kambites said:

I though snow chains were no good in the UK because we never get enough snow to avoid them chewing up the road.

Suppose it depends on the 'heaviness of duty' of said chains.

Studded snow tyres would make just as much of a mess, surely?

Yet more misinformation.

Studless studless studless studless aka friction tyres is what we are talking about.

Studded not appropriate for use in UK 99.999999% of the time, even in this winter.

I despair.....

We've gone beyond misinformation. There's so much information here, if you've read this thread, you should be a winter tyre expert by now!!!

[OnTheRoof96]

beanbag said:

I can highly recommend Goodyear Ultra Grip 7+ tyres.
...
On a negative note, I haven't a clue where to buy them in the UK. They're pretty common in Germany and Austria though and I'm sure they can be ordered from any decent tyre shop.

Excellent tyres, my brother has a set. He got them via Event Tyres, fast delivery and fitting (although this was back in November). Also the Dunlop and Conti offerings - direct experience with all of these, as well as my Nokians, all excellent winter tyres, the Nokians a touch behind on snow grip but ahead in the value stakes.

[SR06]

beanbag said:

SVTRick said:

Why ?

I have had no issues in the current weather.

Ranger 4x4
X5 Diesel
32ton 4 axle tanker

Unless you have the right rubber (which perhaps you do without knowing), a big car makes no difference in the snow. The same goes for wet and icy conditions.

It's mostly down to the rubber you have fitted.

Agree - Audi RS4, shocking!

[SR06]

frosted said:

not much chaos , the news agency do try and show the worse of the worse . I had no problem getting about for work , I quite actually like driving in snow with my summer tyres

I bought 4x Pirelli 225x40x18's about 6 weeks ago, they are not winter tyres but they have been amazing. I have not been stuck once as they have plenty of tread. As for the Audi Q7 that I saw in Fife with 20" bald tyres - I say "shame on you!"

[AndyG-ZTT]

beanbag said:

I despair.....
We've gone beyond misinformation. There's so much information here, if you've read this thread, you should be a winter tyre expert by now!!!

I have been looking at tyres for many years now and have decided:

Good demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s&fea...
Testing Winter/All season/Summer tyres

Summer Tyres for the Summer
Winter Tyres for the winter (Winter conditions, Ice and Snow)
Track Tyres for the Track

1/2" Studs on frozen lakes/full on Ice roads

Edited by AndyG-ZTT on Monday 11th January 12:53

[900T-R]

beanbag said:

Even when the snow disappears, they offer a good advantage in the lower temperatures and in the wet.....

No there isn't - not normal winter temperatures in The Netherlands and southern England. I would like some more hard data about cold temeprature running, but if independant tests from the past 2-3 years consistently mention the tyre manufacturers' and trade's line of 'winter tyres are superior in any conditions below 7 degrees C' is not supported by their findings I have little reason to believe otherwise (particularly when insurers' data so far have failed to determine any significant decrease in claims from winter tyre-equipped vehicles during the cold season in comparison to vehicles ruinning on summer tyres all year round).
What has been established is significantly lower wet braking and aquaplaning performance from winter tyres, so your sentence above is a bit misleading - winter tyres may be better in conditions that are both wet and cold, but that doesn't mean they're better in the wet without that qualification - to the contrary.

And yes, I've been to several manufacturer-organised/sponsored winter/summer tyre comparisons. All toe the '7 degree C line', none so far has made any attempt to prove it.

[JCW]

beanbag said:

OnTheRoof96 said:

JCW said:

Does anyone have experience of Avon Ice Touring winter tyres? Only ones I can find at present.

They tend to come last in ADAC tests:

http://www1.adac.de/Tests/Reifentests/Winterreifen...

Where are you trying to source them? Mytyres is generally good, Event tyres too, alternatively I got my last set direct from Germany via www.reifen.com - very fast and good value delivery made them cheaper to buy there than from a UK supplier.

I can highly recommend Goodyear Ultra Grip 7+ tyres. It's the only set I've used but I've done 6500km with them so far and they've been superb offering masses of grip in the current conditions with next to no wear.

(And contrary to belief, very good grip in the dry too).

They also score very highly in a lot of tests and aren't too expensive either.

On a negative note, I haven't a clue where to buy them in the UK. They're pretty common in Germany and Austria though and I'm sure they can be ordered from any decent tyre shop.

Booger, just ordered a set for the family hack. Still, better than the Pirellis on it at the moment so it should help Madam regain some confidence after last year's prang but I'll wait until I can find the right ones IF I decide to go down this route with my car.

Thanks both.

[Snoggledog]

How long will it be before insurance companies start writing something into the small print about having cold season suitable tyres? This little snow fall we've had has probably cost them a fair amount and they'll be keen to ensure it doesn't happen again.

[F i F]

900T-R said:

... bases his entire argument on a very small subset of data, ie temperatures in Netherlands and Southern England

Let's pick Birmingham, not that far North and remember outside the city it will be ( = is) typically at least a degree or so colder than this.

Modal average temperature for Birmingham is
Month, Max, Min, Mean
Nov, 8, 2, 6
Dec, 7, 1, 4
Jan, 6, 0, 3
Feb, 6, 0, 3
Mar, 9, 1, 6
Apr, 11, 3 ,7

Now if one accepts the modern view that there is no sharp cut off at 7C, and there is a grey zone where it's all very much of a muchness.

Considering that the aggregate grip across a range of conditions afforded by cold weather rubber at 3-4C and below, at least in my experience, and in particular in conditions 1C and below where grip can be most important, I'm not persuaded, at least in my circumstances, by the argument to continue with summer tyres in the months of Dec, Jan and Feb. Extension of use outside those times will depend on conditions and what times of day and types of use, which leads to the next oft repeated point.

However as stated many times before it all depends on individual needs and circumstances, and if someone is prepared to accept potentially a considerable limitation on their activities when the weather turns really cold and nasty then OK. But then don't come bleating and pointing fingers at others when a run to the betting shop isn't possible.