RE: Driven: Lotus Evora S

[kambites]

I think caring what badge is on the front of a car is a bit sad, whether it's a Porsche badge or a Hyundai one.

[chevronb37]

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

[Mikeyboy]

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Does seem odd doesn't it.
If you like driving then it's not hard to appreciate that many brands will make good drivers cars and that Porsche and Lotus are ones that make consistently good ones that aren't also priced only for millionaires.

I mean at least no-one has mentioned that you could get a GT-R or even a used R8 for the same money. That would just be putting the cat among the pigeons.

[DJC]

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Well to be fair to Pits he actually has a point that it seems certain sectors of the Pork market love to give Lotus a kicking and yes it does always seem to be Pork owners. Now Im not terribly sure why people feel the need to do this as Lotus have generally proven themselves to be excellent shooters-in-their-own-feet over the years to not need any outside help in that area!

Perhaps it is simply that? Over the year Lotus have had many admirers and opened many a wallet but their continued ability to shoot themselves and by consequence their owners wallets has turned that admiration into irritation and anger. I think a lot of people want to want Lotus to do well, but get annoyed again when they bugger it up.

[MG-FIDO]

cathalm said:

An awful lot of sense

Good post sir! Nicely summed up.

[sunsurfer]

I hope people are not ANTI anything or FOR anything without checking them out through reviews, talking to owners, viewings and test drives.

Personally my next fun wheels is likely to be either a Mk1 Boxster, a Mk1 Elise or a Vauxhall VX220. They are all within a few grand of each other and all amazing (and cheap) cars regardless of their badge.

[cathalm]

Don't discount the VX220 next to the Elise, I still miss mine after years.

[Vladimir Pukin]

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Oh no it doesn't.

[chevronb37]

Yes, it's a funny thing. I first drew a Lotus in my school book when I was 5 years old - an Esprit in ModSports tackling Oulton Park's Cascades at speed. I can still visualise it clear as day and have wanted one ever since. I am tremendously fond of the brand and the cars - especially the racing endeavours. However, I'm realistic enough to admit my Elise is almost entirely hopeless at everything, except the business of driving pleasure. My girlfriend (a massive car enthusiast herself) thinks it's noisy, uncomfortable and stupid. My colleagues at work think I'm a flash git. It's hopeless when it rains and you can't see anything out of it. However, I love it more than life itself and would never dream of swapping it for anything other than an even faster Lotus. That said, I feel no antagonism towards Porsche, nor its owners. I cannot understand why everyone's always so defensive. So we like different stuff and choose to buy cars based on different parameters - so what?

[Agent Orange]

kambites said:

I think caring what badge is on the front of a car is a bit sad, whether it's a Porsche badge or a Hyundai one.

Sorry to pickup on this but in which case what made you choose a Lotus Elise over a Vauxhall VX220/220 Turbo?

[sunsurfer]

cathalm said:

Don't discount the VX220 next to the Elise, I still miss mine after years.

Yes. I'm not yet ready to buy but from research I suspect the VX220 may suit my driving style better than the Mk1 Elise. The n/a engine has more low down torque. The Boxster is a possibility if the Lotus and VX220 are too raw edged ;-) for me and my girlfriend.

[harryowl]

Agent Orange said:

kambites said:

I think caring what badge is on the front of a car is a bit sad, whether it's a Porsche badge or a Hyundai one.

Sorry to pickup on this but in which case what made you choose a Lotus Elise over a Vauxhall VX220/220 Turbo?

Maybe beacuse the vauxhall is epically fugly?

[The Pits]

Mikeyboy said:

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Does seem odd doesn't it.
If you like driving then it's not hard to appreciate that many brands will make good drivers cars and that Porsche and Lotus are ones that make consistently good ones that aren't also priced only for millionaires.

I mean at least no-one has mentioned that you could get a GT-R or even a used R8 for the same money. That would just be putting the cat among the pigeons.

I disagree with the commonly held notion that if you like driving you have to like both Lotus and Porsche. And I reserve the right to have a preference for british cars over german ones.

From personal experience I have been consistently amazed by driving Lotuses and underwhelmed (at best) by the many Porsches I have driven. I also think the GTR is a huge achievement from Nissan and is quite brilliant. It just can't get past the way it looks which is of course entirely subjective. In fact I rather wish I did like the way it looks, I'd have one in heartbeat. 911 turbo pace for a fraction of the cost is something for petrolheads to celebrate. The R8 is also another brilliant car that for me exposes the 911 to be well past it's sell-by date. I can't see anything but badge snobbery preventing a 911 owner from trading his car in for an R8.

As to why threads tend to descend into personal insults I think it's a question of priorites. Those who've owned a Lotus clearly place driving pleasure at the top of their list. Porsche fans bring up build quality ad nauseam so I don't think it's controversial to suggest that build quality is near the top of their priority list. Letting the world know you're in financial services and going through a mid-life crisis is presumably another.

With such different priorites behind their car purchases, it's no great wonder that there are disagreements.

What I don't get is why Porsche fans spend so much time airing their negative views in Lotus and TVR discussions.

Edited by The Pits on Wednesday 10th November 16:13

[Porscheplayer]

Vladimir Pukin said:

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Oh no it doesn't.

[GKP]

The Pits said:

I also think the GTR is a huge achievement from Nissan and is quite brilliant.

Is it ironic, given the subject matter of this thread, that Nissan went to a certain Norfolk based manufacturer for help with the chassis of the GTR?

[DJC]

He would have to deal with an Audi dealership.

Having experienced this in the last week nothing short of rampant lesbian nakedness would entice me to step through the doors of another Audi dealership.

[Porscheplayer]

The Pits said:

Mikeyboy said:

chevronb37 said:

I struggle to understand why every thread relating to Lotus always descends into a massive argument.

Does seem odd doesn't it.
If you like driving then it's not hard to appreciate that many brands will make good drivers cars and that Porsche and Lotus are ones that make consistently good ones that aren't also priced only for millionaires.

I mean at least no-one has mentioned that you could get a GT-R or even a used R8 for the same money. That would just be putting the cat among the pigeons.

I disagree with the commonly held notion that if you like driving you have to like both Lotus and Porsche. And I reserve the right to have a preference for british cars over german ones.

From personal experience I have been consistently amazed by driving Lotuses and underwhelmed (at best) by the many Porsches I have driven. I also think the GTR is a huge achievement from Nissan and is quite brilliant. It just can't get past the way it looks which is of course entirely subjective. In fact I rather wish I did like the way it looks, I'd have one in heartbeat. The R8 is also another brilliant car that for me exposes the 911 to be well past it's sell-by date. I can't see anything but badge snobbery preventing a 911 owner from trading his car in for an R8.

No one says you have to like both, I like both but, Porsche has built cars which suit my needs so far and I honestly give two hoots about the country of origin.
Have you driven a full lit Turbo or GT3 like you've stole it, I'd very surprised if that didn't get your heart racing?

[The Pits]

You're still doing it, even now, still can't believe how it's possible not to like 911s.

I'm really happy for anyone that likes both. And I'm envious of people who don't give a stuff where their car is built, quite unbothered that companies like TVR have gone to the wall. Bully for you.

As for me not liking Porsches, you're all just going to have to live with it I'm afraid.

[kambites]

Agent Orange said:

kambites said:

I think caring what badge is on the front of a car is a bit sad, whether it's a Porsche badge or a Hyundai one.

Sorry to pickup on this but in which case what made you choose a Lotus Elise over a Vauxhall VX220/220 Turbo?

A combination of things. On the standard wheels the VX220 doesn't handle as well as the Elise, and adding different sized wheels would push the cost up considerably. I didn't like the engine in the turbo and the N/A was rather slow. But the single deciding factor was that I don't like servo assisted brakes.

[Agent Orange]

kambites said:

Agent Orange said:

kambites said:

I think caring what badge is on the front of a car is a bit sad, whether it's a Porsche badge or a Hyundai one.

Sorry to pickup on this but in which case what made you choose a Lotus Elise over a Vauxhall VX220/220 Turbo?

A combination of things. On the standard wheels the VX220 doesn't handle as well as the Elise, and adding different sized wheels would push the cost up considerably. I didn't like the engine in the turbo and the N/A was rather slow. But the single deciding factor was that I don't like servo assisted brakes.

So nothing to do with the badge then...