RE: Driven: Alfa Romeo Spider 1750 TBi

RE: Driven: Alfa Romeo Spider 1750 TBi

Author
Discussion

davepoth

29,395 posts

198 months

Tuesday 11th January 2011
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It's a very good point. Especially with "LanChrysler" coming on strong.

Edited by davepoth on Tuesday 11th January 17:28

crostonian

2,427 posts

171 months

Tuesday 11th January 2011
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My parents have had a Spider LE 2.2 on contract hire since May 2008, finished in white with tan sports seats and 19" spoked alloys it looks stunning and at £320pcm it was a no brainer of a deal. My mother loves it for pootling to the shops and they have been to Italy in it 4 times, it has been 100% reliable. My old man is considering buying it at the end of the contract if the price is right and having the remap done which improves the woeful throttle action of the 2.2

Personally I am horrified that he is planning on keeping it, as stated here the scuttle shake is awful, the ride terrible on 19" wheels, the seats too high, the dasboard in my opinion is just an ugly slab of metal, the hood takes forever to go up and down and the engine is a soulless GM lump.

Considering I have access to drive the car whenever convenient, I never once said to the wife over summer 'fancy going out in the Spider?' which to me sums up how disappointing this car really is. Good riddance to it along with the Brera and 159 - worst Alfas since the Arna in context? I think so.

T5SOR

1,991 posts

224 months

Tuesday 11th January 2011
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I'm still not convinced. I thought the 2.2 that I drove was great. I went home in my MK1 MX5 and although I love it the Alfa stayed on my mind.

Mmmmm 3.2 on the way

Black S2K

1,462 posts

248 months

Tuesday 11th January 2011
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I drove the 3.2 Brera 4x4.

The review isn't any different to the Spyder really. Only you cannot blame the absence of a roof for the truly rubbish dynamics - It reminded me of a 1984 Cavalier SRi. That had been used as a taxicab for 20 years.

Looking at the thing, I could almost have cried.

As Marchionne recently said "as it is, we should never have launched the 159 (family)"


dwilkie

Original Poster:

2,222 posts

185 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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Black S2K said:
I drove the 3.2 Brera 4x4.

The review isn't any different to the Spyder really. Only you cannot blame the absence of a roof for the truly rubbish dynamics - It reminded me of a 1984 Cavalier SRi. That had been used as a taxicab for 20 years.

Looking at the thing, I could almost have cried.

As Marchionne recently said "as it is, we should never have launched the 159 (family)"
See I still think the 159 was one of the nicest cars from a driver pov that I've ever had the pleasure of, it was truly superb and every bit as good as the 156. The Brera/Spider on the other hand...

Oddball RS

1,757 posts

217 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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Wierd, my wifes Brera V6 SV was a nice car to drive, no real problems and it got you round in the snow with no problems.

Guvernator

13,109 posts

164 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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T5SOR said:
I'm still not convinced. I thought the 2.2 that I drove was great. I went home in my MK1 MX5 and although I love it the Alfa stayed on my mind.

Mmmmm 3.2 on the way
Really? I understand that the fact that it is one of the best looking cars this side of £50K is very compelling but are you honestly saying you could live with the crashy ride, scuttle shake and general feeling that things were going to shake themselves apart at any moment. The test drive I had was in a basically new demo car and it was already squeaking and creaking if we ran over anything in the road thicker than a 10 pence piece. It felt as if it already had 100k on the clock and was running on woodden wheels rather than modern rubber.

Admittedly I've not tried it's hard top sibling so can't comment although I did have a go in a 147 GTA many moons ago which didn't seem to suffer from the same problem. I just can't put into words how bad I thought the ride was on the Spyder and being into cars of a more sporty persuasion I am usually very tolerant to harsh riding cars.

Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 12th January 12:17

RicksAlfas

13,355 posts

243 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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dwilkie said:
See I still think the 159 was one of the nicest cars from a driver pov that I've ever had the pleasure of, it was truly superb and every bit as good as the 156. The Brera/Spider on the other hand...
I'm not sure I understand. The 159 does drive very well and the Brera drives like a shorter 2 door version, so I'm surprised you like the 159 but not the Brera. Never driven a Spider but I find the Brera has a pretty rigid shell and a decent ride.

Guvernator

13,109 posts

164 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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A lex said:
Guvernator said:
T5SOR said:
I'm still not convinced. I thought the 2.2 that I drove was great. I went home in my MK1 MX5 and although I love it the Alfa stayed on my mind.

Mmmmm 3.2 on the way
Really? I understand that the fact that it is one of the best looking cars this side of £50K is very compelling but are you honestly saying you could live with the crashy ride, scuttle shake and general feeling that things were going to shake themselves apart at any moment. The test drive I had was in a basically new demo car and it was already squeaking and creaking if we ran over anything in the road thicker than a 10 pence piece. It felt as if it already had 100k on the clock and was running on woodden wheels rather than modern rubber.
In almost two years of driving these cars I cant say I ever noticed this problem, certainly not to the extent it bothered me. Almost sounds like the dealer left the delivery chocks in the springs or something.
Not sure, maybe something was wrong with it. I was certainly shocked that it could be so bad. The only thing I can compare it too from previous experience was when I had a go in a mates Escort RS Turbo when I was 18. He had the genius idea of chopping a few inches off the springs to lower the car. biggrin

However the dealer didn't seem too surprised when I told him why I'd come back so early. He just shrugged his shoulders and said "Yes they can be a little bumpy" and other people who have driven the Spyder have also made similiar comments.

minimatt1967

17,089 posts

205 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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It's so pretty, what were the problems? Other than it being too pretty?

duncanlarke

9 posts

188 months

Wednesday 12th January 2011
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I am sorry to be reading this about such a lovely looking car but it does fit in with every report i have read about these cars;to slow and terrible ride; i suppose i will just have to get my 1991 SZ out of the garage at the weekend and go for a blast with a huge smile on my face,only if it is dry,my god not in the wet,frightening in the wet!.

V6Alfisti

3,305 posts

226 months

Thursday 13th January 2011
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I can't talk about the drive as I haven't driven a Spider, and have read many similar review but genuinely surprised by the mention of the interior quality?

The Spider/Brera/159 all share the same dash and I have found the interior to be incredibly well stuck together. The dash plastics are VASTLY superior to a 2008 5 series I recently sat in, instead of a low rent stippled finish it has a far nicer and more realistic finish, real metal and not "metal effect", buttons e.t.c all feel good and solid with near zero gap. I think the only bit that feels low rent is the little ashtray bin....and that's it? :/

Edited by V6Alfisti on Thursday 13th January 20:48

Guvernator

13,109 posts

164 months

Friday 14th January 2011
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V6Alfisti said:
I can't talk about the drive as I haven't driven a Spider, and have read many similar review but genuinely surprised by the mention of the interior quality?

The Spider/Brera/159 all share the same dash and I have found the interior to be incredibly well stuck together. The dash plastics are VASTLY superior to a 2008 5 series I recently sat in, instead of a low rent stippled finish it has a far nicer and more realistic finish, real metal and not "metal effect", buttons e.t.c all feel good and solid with near zero gap. I think the only bit that feels low rent is the little ashtray bin....and that's it? :/

Edited by V6Alfisti on Thursday 13th January 20:48
I agree, Alfa's have interiors that most so called "premium German marques" could only dream about. I'm not so much talking build quality more about asthetics. I really wish the German marques would take a leaf out of the Alfa book and make their interiors more interesting. It's a shame that the rest of the car doesn't match. My ideal car would be designed by Alfa and built by Porsche.

Edited by Guvernator on Friday 14th January 10:39

TdM-GTV

290 posts

216 months

Friday 14th January 2011
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I sat in a 159 and wasn't particularly impressed with the build quality.

The thing is though I don't know whether that is true for ALL 159/Brera/Spiders. Having owned a GTV for 7 years and been in plenty of others in the intervening time, I've found that the build quality changes drastically from one car to another.

My car is solid, doesn't rattle or crash, nothing falls off as a whole it's just very well screwed together - some other cars of the same model on the other hand are hopeless.

This seems to be an Alfa problem they just get bits out of a general part bin and knock them together as they feel like on the day.

All I want from Alfa is a nice light RWD car with proper handling. We know they can do it but will FIAT let them?

alfamonk

31 posts

183 months

Friday 14th January 2011
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Sad to say, as a 3-time Alfa owner, I just don't get excited by the current crop of Alfas. It's the Busso..
They used to be a bit unhinged, a bit scrabbly, a bit rough around the edges in a drunken aristocratic way. And now, they have to compete in a brand-savvy market, against hyper-competent competition.
I fear it they might be an automotive casualty within 10 years or so, unless they do something radical.

T5SOR

1,991 posts

224 months

Sunday 16th January 2011
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Guvernator said:
T5SOR said:
I'm still not convinced. I thought the 2.2 that I drove was great. I went home in my MK1 MX5 and although I love it the Alfa stayed on my mind.

Mmmmm 3.2 on the way
Really? I understand that the fact that it is one of the best looking cars this side of £50K is very compelling but are you honestly saying you could live with the crashy ride, scuttle shake and general feeling that things were going to shake themselves apart at any moment. The test drive I had was in a basically new demo car and it was already squeaking and creaking if we ran over anything in the road thicker than a 10 pence piece. It felt as if it already had 100k on the clock and was running on woodden wheels rather than modern rubber.

Admittedly I've not tried it's hard top sibling so can't comment although I did have a go in a 147 GTA many moons ago which didn't seem to suffer from the same problem. I just can't put into words how bad I thought the ride was on the Spyder and being into cars of a more sporty persuasion I am usually very tolerant to harsh riding cars.

Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 12th January 12:17
I need to test drive a 3.2 before I make a decision (only driven th 2.2), but I thought it felt a good ride. I was a bit bumpy at times, but my MX5 is like that on every bump in the road. Maybe I am used to a harsh ride, but I really liked the Spider when I drove it last weekend.

Anyone here have/had a 3.2 Spider and care to comment on ownership?

T5SOR

1,991 posts

224 months

Sunday 16th January 2011
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A lex said:
T5SOR said:
Guvernator said:
T5SOR said:
I'm still not convinced. I thought the 2.2 that I drove was great. I went home in my MK1 MX5 and although I love it the Alfa stayed on my mind.

Mmmmm 3.2 on the way
Really? I understand that the fact that it is one of the best looking cars this side of £50K is very compelling but are you honestly saying you could live with the crashy ride, scuttle shake and general feeling that things were going to shake themselves apart at any moment. The test drive I had was in a basically new demo car and it was already squeaking and creaking if we ran over anything in the road thicker than a 10 pence piece. It felt as if it already had 100k on the clock and was running on woodden wheels rather than modern rubber.

Admittedly I've not tried it's hard top sibling so can't comment although I did have a go in a 147 GTA many moons ago which didn't seem to suffer from the same problem. I just can't put into words how bad I thought the ride was on the Spyder and being into cars of a more sporty persuasion I am usually very tolerant to harsh riding cars.

Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 12th January 12:17
I need to test drive a 3.2 before I make a decision (only driven th 2.2), but I thought it felt a good ride. I was a bit bumpy at times, but my MX5 is like that on every bump in the road. Maybe I am used to a harsh ride, but I really liked the Spider when I drove it last weekend.

Anyone here have/had a 3.2 Spider and care to comment on ownership?
As far as I can tell its pretty much like owning any other Spider - economy is about 20mpg +- 5. Performance is good and it can be made to sound v. nice for not much folding. Are you going for an earlier model, or the 'update' which had the nicer seats and interior touches? I found the brakes to be powerful but a bit wooden, apparently a characteristic of a lot of Brembo 4-pots.
Thanks Alex.

I was looking at 2007-2010 models. What year did they do the update?

interloper

2,747 posts

254 months

Sunday 16th January 2011
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RicksAlfas said:
dwilkie said:
See I still think the 159 was one of the nicest cars from a driver pov that I've ever had the pleasure of, it was truly superb and every bit as good as the 156. The Brera/Spider on the other hand...
I'm not sure I understand. The 159 does drive very well and the Brera drives like a shorter 2 door version, so I'm surprised you like the 159 but not the Brera. Never driven a Spider but I find the Brera has a pretty rigid shell and a decent ride.
I understand perfectly! I used to work for an Alfa dealer, the 159 worked, the driving position was good, the ride and handling not bad etc. When they hacked a foot or so out of the chassis and lowered the roof, in the Brera they buggered up the driving position.

I'm a very average 5'10" and found that I couldn't get low enough in the Brera, my head was too close to roof, not helped by the fact that the A and B pillars seemed to curve inwards toward the lowered roof.

The comments re the scuttle shake on the spider are interesting, the early V6 models I drove didn't seem too bad (and the roads around Reading, Pangbourne, Bracknell etc are bleeding awful! Makes you wonder if as production has continued and the popularity dipped they have started cutting corners? Certainly not as bad for shake as the old BMW Z3 or Nineties Saab 900/93, which were utter horrors in this regard.

Another thing the "ribbed for her pleasure" leather seats, seriously what the hell were they thinking? The cheap cloth seats in the 159 are dead comfy, pay extra for leather and you get hard and unsupportive, they probably don't even wipe clean very easily due to the design!

In my view the Brera and spider were, poorly thought out hack jobs, the old GT was a much better coupe.

Edited by interloper on Sunday 16th January 10:46

Guvernator

13,109 posts

164 months

Monday 17th January 2011
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So what next for Alfa? I guess the Mito is OK as far as small hatchbacks but I'm not in the market for a small hatch and why they felt the need to replace that awesome 6 light arrangement which was probably the best "face" on any mainstream car I have seen in the last 10 years with this new startled owl look is beyond me.

The Giulietta isn't really doing to for me either. I don't think it's half as pretty as previous Alfa's, so what else has Alfa got in the pipeline?

If Alfa made a decent coupe or Spyder which addressed some of the previous issues mentioned, handled well and brought back some of the magic of the old V6 engines, I'd be there like a shot. Something about the Italian Alfa's which makes them a bit more exotic than some of the other mainstream manufacturers which appeals to me. If only they got some of the other basics right they could do very well and certainly earn another fan but at the moment I think they are still living off past glories.

robsco

7,822 posts

175 months

Monday 17th January 2011
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Guvernator said:
So what next for Alfa? I guess the Mito is OK as far as small hatchbacks but I'm not in the market for a small hatch and why they felt the need to replace that awesome 6 light arrangement which was probably the best "face" on any mainstream car I have seen in the last 10 years with this new startled owl look is beyond me.

The Giulietta isn't really doing to for me either. I don't think it's half as pretty as previous Alfa's, so what else has Alfa got in the pipeline?

If Alfa made a decent coupe or Spyder which addressed some of the previous issues mentioned, handled well and brought back some of the magic of the old V6 engines, I'd be there like a shot. Something about the Italian Alfa's which makes them a bit more exotic than some of the other mainstream manufacturers which appeals to me. If only they got some of the other basics right they could do very well and certainly earn another fan but at the moment I think they are still living off past glories.
Living off past glories is a little harsh. Alfa have a strong line up at the moment, their strongest for a long time. The Mito has received a lot of praise, cracking up to date engines and good build quality. The 159 is an excellent steer and looks simply divine with another line up of good engines (1750TBi to replace the old 2.2, excellent range of diesels). The GT's only real weak point IMHO its interior, which, being based on the 147, doesn't seem to have the same robustness as the 159/Brera etc.

Interesting that you mention the Giulietta's looks. They might not be to your taste, but there's no denying that it seems to be a great car (though I've not driven one). It was only just pipped by the Golf in a recent road test, which is an honourable result. They also have the new Spider in the pipeline of course, if the Duettotanta concept was anything to go by. If the pricing is keen and they get the chassis right, Alfa should have a field day.