Smart Roadster/Coupe gearbox
Discussion
zebra said:
You've not been here long enough have you.......
Actually, I've been around here a lot longer than you in one guise or another... but I missed that thread. 
Gotta be said, 300bhp/tonne, as so often, probably had a point that was unpopular because it was closer to the truth than some
Having owned/driven both a Roadster and several Tivs, I can say that you'd need more talent and a lot more balls than me to set a markedly faster pace in the TVR on the sort of properly challenging roads that show up its suspension flaws whilst denying it the chance to exploit its acceleration fully.
In fairness, the Roadster does handle very well indeed, and can maintain a surprising pace if you know what you're doing...
...Not into Elise territory in that respect, though.
...And the gearbox is still s
te. 
I know which of mine is quicker.
Do all the people (who've actually driven one) that complain about the gearbox only use auto mode? I treat mine as a semi auto, using the paddles, and don't find it at all jerky. It is slow (especially compared to something like a DSG) but the latest MB software helps and a remap does speed it up.
Regarding the spark plugs, if you cut out the panel behind the rear number plate, the body work doesn't have to come off. Treat engine breather valves as a service item and make sure the wiper motor under tray is properly sealed to the bulk head to protect the SAM.
Do all the people (who've actually driven one) that complain about the gearbox only use auto mode? I treat mine as a semi auto, using the paddles, and don't find it at all jerky. It is slow (especially compared to something like a DSG) but the latest MB software helps and a remap does speed it up.
Regarding the spark plugs, if you cut out the panel behind the rear number plate, the body work doesn't have to come off. Treat engine breather valves as a service item and make sure the wiper motor under tray is properly sealed to the bulk head to protect the SAM.
Basil Brush said:
Do all the people (who've actually driven one) that complain about the gearbox only use auto mode? I treat mine as a semi auto, using the paddles, and don't find it at all jerky.
Didn't have any problems with jerkiness, I think you learn to drive around that quickly. And without having to explore the unfamiliar waters of left foot braking (although that can also be fun). What I found really annoying is that, even in semi-auto, it does not bounce on the limiter but shifts up instead. Which can be a little scary when uncalled for. Must be possible to fix that in software, but doubt anybody ever cared enough.Basil Brush said:
Regarding the spark plugs, if you cut out the panel behind the rear number plate, the body work doesn't have to come off.
Clever! Might get one next year again, a coworker wants to find a good home for his very well kept specimen. Sounds like a mod worth doing.Basil Brush said:
Do all the people (who've actually driven one) that complain about the gearbox only use auto mode? I treat mine as a semi auto, using the paddles...
Yes, I always used the paddles. The full auto mode was just unbearable.By contrast, I gave up using the paddles on my company Skoda's DSG box and just left it in full auto all the time. The shifts were so quick and seamless that it just wasn't worth the effort of paddle-shifting. The DSG did occasionally get confused by roundabouts, though, so even that isn't perfect.
Edited by MintSprint on Thursday 30th October 23:22
MintSprint said:
Yes, I always used the paddles. The full auto mode was just unbearable.
By contrast, I gave up using the paddles on my company Skoda's DSG box and just left it in full auto all the time. The shifts were so quick and seamless that it just wasn't worth the effort of paddle-shifting. The DSG did occasionally get confused by roundabouts, though, so even that isn't perfect.
Pretty much the same with my Audi, although changing down with the paddles to overtake is quicker than waiting for the auto down change. By contrast, I gave up using the paddles on my company Skoda's DSG box and just left it in full auto all the time. The shifts were so quick and seamless that it just wasn't worth the effort of paddle-shifting. The DSG did occasionally get confused by roundabouts, though, so even that isn't perfect.
Edited by MintSprint on Thursday 30th October 23:22
The worst part of the smart clutch programming is how long it takes to get off the line. Trying to get onto a busy roundabout can be fun.
Basil Brush said:
... although changing down with the paddles to overtake is quicker than waiting for the auto down change.
Yes, that's true - that was the exception, now you come to mention it. Especially since with the 7-speed box you often found yourself dropping two cogs to overtake, when you'd just been bimbling along on a light throttle.Damn you lot, you have got me thinking about fully manual conversion of Smart's again...
Research shows the clutch acctuator is outside the 'box and can theoretically be easily replaced by a push slave cylinder, probably leaving the factory item connected so as not to confuse the systems. Need to work out how to get a clutch pedal in and can the gear change motor be tricked into operating directly via microswitches...
Research shows the clutch acctuator is outside the 'box and can theoretically be easily replaced by a push slave cylinder, probably leaving the factory item connected so as not to confuse the systems. Need to work out how to get a clutch pedal in and can the gear change motor be tricked into operating directly via microswitches...
Megaflow said:
Damn you lot, you have got me thinking about fully manual conversion of Smart's again...
Research shows the clutch acctuator is outside the 'box and can theoretically be easily replaced by a push slave cylinder, probably leaving the factory item connected so as not to confuse the systems. Need to work out how to get a clutch pedal in and can the gear change motor be tricked into operating directly via microswitches...
I think it would be a lot more involved than that from an electronics POV, which is probably why nobody has done it? Even the converted Lotus Europa ran the standard semi auto set up IIRC.Research shows the clutch acctuator is outside the 'box and can theoretically be easily replaced by a push slave cylinder, probably leaving the factory item connected so as not to confuse the systems. Need to work out how to get a clutch pedal in and can the gear change motor be tricked into operating directly via microswitches...
mike9009 said:
I eventually found it quite satisfying getting the gearchange as smooth and accurate as possible. There was an element of skill to it. Still not great though - however I wouldnt let it put me off buying another.....
There were some good independent specialists around, who would adjust the clutch for you. The'B' service cost about £320 from memory and was every 20,000 miles (also from memory - might be someone else about who currently owns and has the service schedule to hand. (in fact that might be entirely wrong except for the cost ... keep getting mixed up between the various cars I have owned!)
Mike
Those who complain never had to learn how to double-declutch a non-synchromesh gearbox, there are certain similarities ( no clutch of course) in that it's about using more or using less throttle to match the engine revs to the new gears rev expectation.There were some good independent specialists around, who would adjust the clutch for you. The'B' service cost about £320 from memory and was every 20,000 miles (also from memory - might be someone else about who currently owns and has the service schedule to hand. (in fact that might be entirely wrong except for the cost ... keep getting mixed up between the various cars I have owned!)
Mike
It can be made smooth, but not very quick. Paddles help with the co-ordination of hands and right foot. Always use it semi-auto: just like with the AP semi/ auto box in the mini/1100/1300 cars. That AP was an engineering miracle of the 1960s.
Edited by rogerhudson on Saturday 6th May 20:46
Hi all. Ive only owned a smart roadster for one summer, and nothing (so far has gone wrong)..
Here are the good points ive found with roadster ownership
Its a great looking car.
Its a really good handling car, and thats its best point.
Its cheap to run if you service it yourself
Ebay is your friend when you need bits
The internet is your friend when you need advice (evilution website is great)
Bad bits
If the car has not been garaged, the electric bits start to short out because of water or condensation.
Mercedes services are not cheap if you cant manage to do the work yourself, or have a good ( which is getting harder) independeny garage nearby.
The clutch/gearbox could be better, but ive driven worse
If your not that nimble, its hard for some people to get in and out of them.
Overall I love my little car. It reminds me of driving and the handling of a mini marcos i owned many years ago. The marcos was 1275cc. The smart is 699cc. the smart is slightly quicker, and going by memory handles better too.
I would reccomend this under rated little car.
With a manual gearbox it woud be a really great car.
Here are the good points ive found with roadster ownership
Its a great looking car.
Its a really good handling car, and thats its best point.
Its cheap to run if you service it yourself
Ebay is your friend when you need bits
The internet is your friend when you need advice (evilution website is great)
Bad bits
If the car has not been garaged, the electric bits start to short out because of water or condensation.
Mercedes services are not cheap if you cant manage to do the work yourself, or have a good ( which is getting harder) independeny garage nearby.
The clutch/gearbox could be better, but ive driven worse
If your not that nimble, its hard for some people to get in and out of them.
Overall I love my little car. It reminds me of driving and the handling of a mini marcos i owned many years ago. The marcos was 1275cc. The smart is 699cc. the smart is slightly quicker, and going by memory handles better too.
I would reccomend this under rated little car.
With a manual gearbox it woud be a really great car.
Gosh this is an old thread recently revived! but always happy to talk about Smart Roadsters...
I had one for a couple of years, unbelievably it seems, over 10 years ago now... it was a smart roadster coupe.
Gearchange ( at least the control of it ) was improved by adding the paddle shift steering wheel. Then it was sort of fun mastering it with throttle blips for downchanges and so on. Mine had a never fixed software problem where gear changes in Auto mode were incredibly jerky unless the ignition was turned on and off again before starting the engine - how I discovered this I’ll never remember but it was night and day the difference it made.
Steering was slow witted - a faster rack would have helped a lot, but not a deal breaker.
Mine leaked a lot around the door mirrors - Mercedes not interested in fixing it despite the warranty it was still under at the time. In fact they were appalling throughout all my ownership... it was early days for the roadster back then and it felt like I was driving a prototype which was complete nuisance for them to fix or service.
It also had a few other malfunctions ... fuel gauge failed, gearbox occasionally had gremlins which left it stranded once or twice (a simple restart always sorted it though - so more software probs I guess) - wheels corroded badly.
Despite all this it had such character I couldn’t help but like it and forgave everything on the right road on an autumn evening with the roof removed and the little triple cylinder and turbo sound track - such fun! It was ahead of its time - if it had had a short throw manual gearbox and faster steering it would have been nigh on perfect and I think I would still have mine now.
I had one for a couple of years, unbelievably it seems, over 10 years ago now... it was a smart roadster coupe.
Gearchange ( at least the control of it ) was improved by adding the paddle shift steering wheel. Then it was sort of fun mastering it with throttle blips for downchanges and so on. Mine had a never fixed software problem where gear changes in Auto mode were incredibly jerky unless the ignition was turned on and off again before starting the engine - how I discovered this I’ll never remember but it was night and day the difference it made.
Steering was slow witted - a faster rack would have helped a lot, but not a deal breaker.
Mine leaked a lot around the door mirrors - Mercedes not interested in fixing it despite the warranty it was still under at the time. In fact they were appalling throughout all my ownership... it was early days for the roadster back then and it felt like I was driving a prototype which was complete nuisance for them to fix or service.
It also had a few other malfunctions ... fuel gauge failed, gearbox occasionally had gremlins which left it stranded once or twice (a simple restart always sorted it though - so more software probs I guess) - wheels corroded badly.
Despite all this it had such character I couldn’t help but like it and forgave everything on the right road on an autumn evening with the roof removed and the little triple cylinder and turbo sound track - such fun! It was ahead of its time - if it had had a short throw manual gearbox and faster steering it would have been nigh on perfect and I think I would still have mine now.
I had a BRC for about 51,000 miles as a daily. Slower in a straight line than a 1.4 Corsa sport. My car was also noticeably faster than the other Brabuses in the club, so it wasn't knackered. They just aren't fast at all, even mapped. A lot of that is likely down to gearing and gearbox, but it's also a tiny, tiny engine, despite peak power being respectable (peak power to weight isn't a hugely useful metric).
I own an Elise now and once upon a time had an NC MX-5. Anyone who has driven all three will agree that mentioning the Roadie in the same sentence as either is wishful thinking.
They were 'OK', as long as you weren't one of the 'look how fast my Roadie is' crew - those guys used to get upset frequently. Fun ownership community, decent mpg, mine was reliable - but I did everything myself - there are (or were at the time) a lot of 'Specialists' doing substandard work. Adequate handling, but you couldn't turn off the ESP, not that you needed to as they simply err towards understeer. It is possible to roll them (though I didn't roll mine). Air con pipes break repeatedly unless you modify them yourself.
Unless it's very cheap or it's an itch you really want to scratch, I'd buy something else TBH.
I own an Elise now and once upon a time had an NC MX-5. Anyone who has driven all three will agree that mentioning the Roadie in the same sentence as either is wishful thinking.
They were 'OK', as long as you weren't one of the 'look how fast my Roadie is' crew - those guys used to get upset frequently. Fun ownership community, decent mpg, mine was reliable - but I did everything myself - there are (or were at the time) a lot of 'Specialists' doing substandard work. Adequate handling, but you couldn't turn off the ESP, not that you needed to as they simply err towards understeer. It is possible to roll them (though I didn't roll mine). Air con pipes break repeatedly unless you modify them yourself.
Unless it's very cheap or it's an itch you really want to scratch, I'd buy something else TBH.
Just got a Brabus Roadster, wanted one for ages and had a few pennies kicking around so thought why not..
I use it as an occasional use only second car (got a Megane Trophy for my sensible waterproof daily). The Smart will live in the garage and only see dry days.
A car that is not without problems or impracticalities that isn’t really a “sports” car if that’s what you are after.
However it’s infectious, characterful, looks great and is a whole load of fun to drive. It’s a car that makes you and anyone that sees it smile.
I love it.
I use it as an occasional use only second car (got a Megane Trophy for my sensible waterproof daily). The Smart will live in the garage and only see dry days.
A car that is not without problems or impracticalities that isn’t really a “sports” car if that’s what you are after.
However it’s infectious, characterful, looks great and is a whole load of fun to drive. It’s a car that makes you and anyone that sees it smile.
I love it.
Edited by CraigV6 on Thursday 22 August 22:39
Edited by CraigV6 on Thursday 22 August 23:15
CraigV6 said:
Just got a Brabus Roadster Coupe.............
Err, that's not a Coupe, admittedly it's a roadster, but it's not the coupe version!Still a nice car though!
I like my coupe, never had any major problems with it, no water ingress, no electronic gremlins.
As for the gearbox, I never use full auto mode, it took about 2 minutes to get used to it.
It's a fun little car for not a lot of money, can't ask for more than that.
CypSIdders said:
Err, that's not a Coupe, admittedly it's a roadster, but it's not the coupe version!
Still a nice car though!
I like my coupe, never had any major problems with it, no water ingress, no electronic gremlins.
As for the gearbox, I never use full auto mode, it took about 2 minutes to get used to it.
It's a fun little car for not a lot of money, can't ask for more than that.
Schoolboy error, now corrected....Still a nice car though!
I like my coupe, never had any major problems with it, no water ingress, no electronic gremlins.
As for the gearbox, I never use full auto mode, it took about 2 minutes to get used to it.
It's a fun little car for not a lot of money, can't ask for more than that.
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