Child Seat Advice

[havoc]

I think our issue is that we've got a rear-facer (Britax MaxFix) - the plastic 'base' of the seat interferes with this mid-roll on some of the new stuff.

Specific issue is the MaxFix vs the Mk7 Golf (hatch and estate variants), but the Golf has exactly the same-looking mid-roll as the new BMW 3-series, the new Octavia and a handful of other "mainstream" cars (none of which are listed in the fitment guide!).


I'm sure you're right in general, but if there's a buckle crunch issue that's surely less of a problem than finding the child seat pitches by c.20 degrees even when fitted as tight as possible due to the clash of the designs...

[Adrian E]

The DualFix which looks to be the same basic design is quoted on FitFinder as being OK in a Golf7, so if it's not fitting right I'd be ringing Britax to make sure you're either not doing something wrong or that there's nothing you can do with the setup of the seat to avoid the interference.

Lena may be able to comment based on far more fitting experience than me!

[lenats31]

havoc said:

I think our issue is that we've got a rear-facer (Britax MaxFix) - the plastic 'base' of the seat interferes with this mid-roll on some of the new stuff.

Specific issue is the MaxFix vs the Mk7 Golf (hatch and estate variants), but the Golf has exactly the same-looking mid-roll as the new BMW 3-series, the new Octavia and a handful of other "mainstream" cars (none of which are listed in the fitment guide!).


I'm sure you're right in general, but if there's a buckle crunch issue that's surely less of a problem than finding the child seat pitches by c.20 degrees even when fitted as tight as possible due to the clash of the designs...

Hi

I have fitted this seat into cars with mid-rolls before. But those have been cars that the seat was approved for. It allways needs a solid push and some wiggeling to get it tight enough in those cars.

But the mid-rolls are not the same in all cars. The outcome is that there is too much of a gap between the backrest and the front brace on the car seat in some of these cars and in others it will be okay.

The Maxfix and the Dualfix are simply wrong for your car. They are approved for some BMW 3 cars but not the Golf Vll.

Good choises for Golf Vll:

Besafe Izi Kid X3 isofix
Besafe Izi Combi X3 Isofix
Besafe Izi Kid I-Size

Fair G 0/1
Maxi Cosi 2Way Pearl

A good thing to do when installing Besafe seats into cars with rolls, is to hold onto the front braces with one hand while driving them into the backrest. That way you can prevent them from riding up and away from it and get the big gap you don´t want.

[havoc]

Thanks Lena - appreciate the detail there.

Just ordered the Mk7 anyway (Becs likes the Golf-R, and the lease deal's too good to refuse). So we're either swapping seats around when it arrives (I've got a Priori XP in my FD-series Civic saloon which I'm hoping will fit - no data yet on M-Cosi website!), or get a new seat.



What this doesn't solve is the immediate problem - what 'spare' seat to get without spending £££ - I've checked the SIXT website for the place we're going to, and the car options are:-
- VW Golf (doesn't say if Mk6 or 7)
- Astra 5dr
- Mini Countryman
- Pug 3008
...and if we get offered an upgrade, there's SW versions of the Focus and Megane, the 5008, Zafira, Touran, plus bigger still...too much choice to check everything.

I've also done some more searching - ISOFIX seats seem to start at £150 - more than we really want to pay for a spare - so we're stuck with belted seats. Cheaper ones from known names are:-
- Britax Eclipse, but no fitment guide on Britax website
- Britax Prince (not even mentioned on their website?!?)
- Maxi-Cosi Priori SPS (hasn't got the car-belt tensioner of my XP)
- Graco Coast

Better still, MaxiCosi's web fitment guide wants you to pick the car one-by-one, and I can't find a Graco one!



So...given there's no such thing as a 'semi-universal' belted seat, and we're facing a wide range of possible cars, we've four options:-
1) Take the Priori XP from my car - known seat, good seat...and hope it fits in Spain! (means we can park the 'spare seat' issue until we know if the XP will fit the Golf after Xmas)
2) Rent a car seat from SIXT when we get there, and HOPE it's in good condition (Double-!! Many tales of missing installation guides and questionable conditions on the child-belts for all rental companies in Spain...)
3) Buy a generic belt-fit seat that fits the grandparents cars and hope it fits in Spain!
4) Buy a more expensive ISOFIX seat and hope it fits in Spain!

[insert swear words here at how difficult the two industries seem determined to make something fundamental like child safety]

[Adrian E]

havoc said:

[insert swear words here at how difficult the two industries seem determined to make something fundamental like child safety]

Part of the problem there is that you sign off on a car design once, then it's pretty much static bar facelifts involving significant changes.

Child seats pretty much continually develop and there's new ones on the market all the time - this doesn't tie in with model cycles of cars and the child seat manufacturers don't keep an example of every car ever made to check new seats fit old cars.

The standards for seat belt anchorages (incl Isofix) and for child restraints themselves are all agreed at UN-ECE level with the best of intentions, although national interests and different points of view means these are sometimes more complicated than most would like to see. The car industry as a whole and the aftermarket suppliers of products like car seats have variable interactions - on car seats it's better post-EuroNCAP because at least the car manufacturer specifies 2 seats to be fitted at the time of crash testing! Although 3 years down the line those seats will probably no longer be available.....

[havoc]

You're right - but it's still ridiculous - and I think the issue is mainly the child seat companies. All car-seats have to hit a certain # of criteria - hip points, back angles, cushion length.

Within these basics, it arguably wouldn't cost THAT much more to create a slightly adjustable car-seat that CAN fit 99% of 2nd row seats. But that would be too easy...


The only exception to this is the effing stupid "ISOFIX mid-roll" that seems to be creeping through half of the car industry - it's there as it's a VISUALLY elegant solution to getting another NCAP point through having ISOFIX guides. From an ergonomics and a manufacturing perspective*, it's actually imperfect...but the OEMs, esp. the premium OEMs, like their visual sign-offs. And sod the impact on already-existing child seats, despite the fact that they market these cars TO FAMILIES!!!



* I used to work for a Tier-1 seat manufacturer.

[mozza42]

Seems the safest way to transport our 9mth old little one is in a rear facing seat...

Problem is the rear seats in my car (2008 BMW 5 Series E60) are at a rather steep angle; most seats I've tried leave the backrest at 25 degrees at full recline. Measured up for a Klippan triofix recline but needs 840mm seat back to seat back so wouldn't fit.

I'm starting to think that nothing will fit and am considering a Volvo... Would really rather not change though!

Anyone with any experience with mine, or similar cars? Anyone in the trade and know of new models?

[mozza42]

Seems the safest way to transport our 9mth old little one is in a rear facing seat...

Problem is the rear seats in my car (2008 BMW 5 Series E60) are at a rather steep angle; most seats I've tried leave the backrest at 25 degrees at full recline. Measured up for a Klippan triofix recline but needs 840mm seat back to seat back so wouldn't fit.

I'm starting to think that nothing will fit and am considering a Volvo... Would really rather not change though!

Anyone with any experience with mine, or similar cars? Anyone in the trade and know of new models?

[lenats31]

mozza42 said:

Seems the safest way to transport our 9mth old little one is in a rear facing seat...

Problem is the rear seats in my car (2008 BMW 5 Series E60) are at a rather steep angle; most seats I've tried leave the backrest at 25 degrees at full recline. Measured up for a Klippan triofix recline but needs 840mm seat back to seat back so wouldn't fit.

I'm starting to think that nothing will fit and am considering a Volvo... Would really rather not change though!

Anyone with any experience with mine, or similar cars? Anyone in the trade and know of new models?

You could try these two:

Besafe Izi Kid ISize
Klippan Kiss

Both approved for X5 and have very good recline positions

having a Volvo doesn´t mean you get heaps of room

Skoda and Ford makes some spacious cars. Så does Peugeot - to mention a few.

Please beaware that some 7-seaters have underfloor storage compartments that need to be filled with something like EPS-foam

[lenats31]

havoc said:

You're right - but it's still ridiculous - and I think the issue is mainly the child seat companies. All car-seats have to hit a certain # of criteria - hip points, back angles, cushion length.

Within these basics, it arguably wouldn't cost THAT much more to create a slightly adjustable car-seat that CAN fit 99% of 2nd row seats. But that would be too easy...


The only exception to this is the effing stupid "ISOFIX mid-roll" that seems to be creeping through half of the car industry - it's there as it's a VISUALLY elegant solution to getting another NCAP point through having ISOFIX guides. From an ergonomics and a manufacturing perspective*, it's actually imperfect...but the OEMs, esp. the premium OEMs, like their visual sign-offs. And sod the impact on already-existing child seats, despite the fact that they market these cars TO FAMILIES!!!



* I used to work for a Tier-1 seat manufacturer.

This is where the new UN R129 (I-Size) regulations come in handy, because it involves both the CRS industry as well as the car industry. Tgis has not been the case so far. However, we still have to brace ourselves with patience because the new regulations won´t be fully activated until 2018 or so. Consumers will nolonger have to check carlists when buying a CRS.

We have a few I-Size seats but so far no I-Size ready cars

[havoc]

lenats31 said:

We have a few I-Size seats but so far no I-Size ready cars

LOL! figures...

Cheers Lena.

We've decided to bag and take the Priori XP - on the MC website it says it fits ~80% of the cars we're likely to be offered on hols, so that seems a safe bet...and the cheapest option for now (as long as it doesn't get broken by the airline...).

[mozza42]

lenats31 said:

You could try these two:

Besafe Izi Kid ISize
Klippan Kiss

Both approved for X5 and have very good recline positions

having a Volvo doesn´t mean you get heaps of room

Skoda and Ford makes some spacious cars. Så does Peugeot - to mention a few.

Please beaware that some 7-seaters have underfloor storage compartments that need to be filled with something like EPS-foam

Lena thanks for the response. I should have said e60 is a 5 series saloon - with very sloped seats, so the recline still leaves the back quick upright.

Have you any further recommendations? Thanks again.

[lenats31]

mozza42 said:

Lena thanks for the response. I should have said e60 is a 5 series saloon - with very sloped seats, so the recline still leaves the back quick upright.

Have you any further recommendations? Thanks again.

That´s why you need a seat with a very good recline angle. Some of these recline more than others. These two are the best isofix options for cars with very sloping seats.

Another one, which I am more reluctant to suggest is the Maxi Cosi Mobi. It is a belted car seat and it needs to be tethered down using two tether straps. Tethering is the norm for rearfacing belted seats. But the reason that I am reluctant to suggest this one is because it needs a lot of space in most cars and for most families. It is not a seat that should be bought online. No car seat should be available online without at least some guidance. But this one ...this is one of those you need to see, before you buy .

[Philb1]

Apologies if this has been asked before. What is the opinion safety wise for lie flat baby seats? Have got a maxi-cosi cabriofix with iosfix base at the moment but my second child who is 12 days old dislikes it. She is happier when lying down and cries more in the car seat. I think it is the banana shape position those sears tend to put you in that she doesn't like.

Are there any fitting requirements such as type of seatbelt for third seat and are they a better or worse option than the 'standard' newborn seats when it comes to safety? Currently have a Seat Toledo mk2 but looking to change to something bigger soon.

Thanks for any info you guys can offer.

[Adrian E]

I wouldn't touch one with a barge pole I'm afraid. The newborn baby test dummy has no instrumentation and the regular test methods don't really show the likely risk of injury

Is your newborn quite small? Sometimes the lie flat seats have a place for pre-term babies if sleep apnea is a concern. Best option assuming there's nothing wrong with the cabriofix is to persevere but keep time in the seat to a minimum

[Philb1]

Thanks for that Adrian. I did wonder about them, if they were that good then most people would buy them but have never heard of them.

I think maybe part of the problem for my daughter is that the seat is more upright in my Seat compared to when it was in my wife's Mk6 golf where the seat design seemed to make the same child seat a bit more reclined. My wife saw thread elsewhere that suggested trying a 0-3 years seat as they have a different shape. Do you think that would be a possible option or do you recommend a cabriofix style seat for greater safety.

Thanks again.

[w00tman]

Don't suppose anyone knows is a 2008 Skoda Fabia hatchback is likely to have isofix points? My google skills are lacking..

[Adrian E]

Philb1 said:

Thanks for that Adrian. I did wonder about them, if they were that good then most people would buy them but have never heard of them.

I think maybe part of the problem for my daughter is that the seat is more upright in my Seat compared to when it was in my wife's Mk6 golf where the seat design seemed to make the same child seat a bit more reclined. My wife saw thread elsewhere that suggested trying a 0-3 years seat as they have a different shape. Do you think that would be a possible option or do you recommend a cabriofix style seat for greater safety.

Thanks again.

There was a period a few years back where Jane were making one and quite a few jumped at it but it took up so much space across the back of a car and lasted such a short period of time before babies were ready to be more upright that it never took off in big numbers, thankfully

I had the same issues with 2 Audis and the Cabriofix seat - in my wife's old a6 it sat quite flat but in my s8 the seat base was much more angled and sprog would end up with his head nodding towards his chest when he fell asleep - I didn't buy the car till he was 8 months old so never experienced how he might have coped with that! It should improve with age and strength but maybe try the same journey in both cars and see if the result varies?!

An infant carrier should last an 'average' baby till more of less 18 months - definitely the safest place for them until they've grown out of it in terms of head protection by the shell and the 13kg weight limit for the seat. My son was 98th %ile for weight and was still in his till 14 months! Long after many of his lighter peers had 'moved up' despite gentle advice to the contrary.....

[Adrian E]

w00tman said:

Don't suppose anyone knows is a 2008 Skoda Fabia hatchback is likely to have isofix points? My google skills are lacking..

It absolutely should have - our 2005 Leon did. If it's the same seat arrangement pull the base of the seat up as if to fold them down the backrest fully and you should be able to find the bars very easily, assuming a feel around in the gap between base and back doesn't find them (it should otherwise you'd struggle to install a seat)

[Ian Geary]

mozza42 said:

Seems the safest way to transport our 9mth old little one is in a rear facing seat...

Problem is the rear seats in my car (2008 BMW 5 Series E60) are at a rather steep angle; most seats I've tried leave the backrest at 25 degrees at full recline. Measured up for a Klippan triofix recline but needs 840mm seat back to seat back so wouldn't fit.

I'm starting to think that nothing will fit and am considering a Volvo... Would really rather not change though!

Anyone with any experience with mine, or similar cars? Anyone in the trade and know of new models?

Evening,

whilst my car isn't the same, I too had an issue with the rear seat base being too sloped (ie high up under the knees). This meant our rear facing seat was sloped upwards, and the baby's head flopped forward when he nodded off.

Rather than changing the car (!?!) I simply went to a breakers yard and found a car with a (clean) identical rear seat base, and paid £5 for it.

Then, by un-clipping the upholstery cover I could carve away the foam underneath until the seat was no longer sloped at such a steep angle.

It took about 25 minutes - certainly quicker than selling, and subsequently buying a new car (and quite possibly cheaper too).


Obviously I kept the original seat, and put it back in the car once the kid grew up a bit.



Ian