Chris Harris takes on Ferrari on US website....in a big way
Discussion
havoc said:
RobM77 said:
Good find. Big balls!
I've been watching quite a few of the DR videos tonight, and they've all been excellent:FWD Masterclass: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZN1aP1o_m8
Power Oversteer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2Vt3ybz0t0
Review of the 997.2 GT3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45DWdH20Hmg (if you only watch one thing - watch the cornering at 2m05s - wow).
DR was just too early (i.e. pre iPad and the followers). I still prefer to read a magazine after all day in front of a screen though...
Alfanatic said:
And yet somewhat ironically Jeremy Clarkson is quite possibly the UK journalist least likely to pull his punches when he doesn't like a car, or something the manufacturer did. His piece on the GTO quite bluntly accused Ferrari of cashing in on the GTO name, and more or less dismissed the car itself as an overgrown Nintendo.
I thought that.Maybe Ferrari are a bit scared of JC and TG!? Is it almost where they don't want to not send a car because they will have the piss taken ala Bentley, which is even more harmful from where I was sat
Good on the TG guys on that one, very amusing really
Dave
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Don't worry, I can't see myself being in that position financially any time soon. I do find it hard to believe they are that omnipresent though, surely the request to not lend your car out would come from the upper echelons of Ferrari management, and you are unlikely to be treated any differently by your servicing dealer? As far as insinuating you wouldn't be in the best position to buy a new model, I feel like Ferrari are overstating their own importance. They obviously aren't mass produced a'la Ford Focus, but they aren't priceless one offs either. If I wanted a new model and had the money, I'd get one off someone who has bought one to specualate. Up yours Ferrari!
stuttgartmetal said:
The e type 3.8 mk1 jaguar press car would do 150MPH.
No factory car could do that.So this press tweak is hardly new is it?
That one is an interesting case, it has often been suggested that it had a D-Type engine etc. but a couple of weeks ago in his Autocar column Steve Sutcliffe discusses a conversation with Norman Dewis, Jaguar's chief tester at the time who stated that the car was absolutely not powered by a D-type engine, "It was a straight car, with a straight engine. Although, of course, we did make sure everything was, you know, as good as it could be on that car". So, whether we can believe a 90 year old chap who really has nothing to prove, or not, he claims that the Jag was pretty standard, albeit in very good order. It doesn't sound like they went to the same trouble with that car as Ferrari are obviously doing with their press cars currently.No factory car could do that.So this press tweak is hardly new is it?
Add in the comment that all press cars were locked down around the time of the McLaren launch and it really says something in my view.
andyps said:
Add in the comment that all press cars were locked down around the time of the McLaren launch and it really says something in my view.
That Ferrari are afraid of a straight fight?That they feel they should be given special treatment?
That they're arrogant t
ts?All of the above?!?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I reckon that is absolutely correct for 95% of new Ferrari purchases. Same with most things really.When wealthy people buy a £50k diamond ring, is it because they truly and fully understand the nature of the quality of the diamond or is it because they just can?
MTR
RDMcG said:
RobM77 said:
durbster said:
Whatty said:
Job done.
You should tag that quickly Whatty. It'll go viral.
Or just piss someone off who does by putting their name on it instead 
Thanks for your message RDMcG.
I have to confess though that the image was not of my creation. In my haste to share it I neglected to add the link to where I found it. Can't take credit for it sadly.
Orgininated here http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=... And I think it was even second hand then.
Humble apologies and I will now drive the wife's Honda Element for a couple of days as suitable penance.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I'd guess that for these people, the 95%, the numbers that the car produces on test, compared to its competitors, are more important than they are to driving enthusiasts. I'd think for many buyers who are never actually going to push the car to its limits (on purpose at least) it is more important for the pub discussion that they bought the fastest. Or the fastest accelerating. Or the fastest around some or other track. It has the fastest gearbox. Some way or another, they didn't buy second best.Meanwhile, for an enthusiast, they won't care if it takes 0.3 seconds longer to get to 60 or half a second longer to change from second to third. They will care that the car they bought excites them and is interesting when the road gets interesting. A slower car with better feel will appeal to many enthusiasts more than the faster one. But these buyers are the minority by a long way. Most belong in the first half and don't want to be embarrassed when discussing their new car with their peers. Those types will buy the magazines, possibly skip to the last page and just see which one posted the best numbers.
This is all guesswork of course
anonymous said:
[redacted]
That's a very good point; figures are merely superficial and the way the car drives is the more geeky or thorough outlook on matters. If Ferrari are appealing mainly to the former category, it's no surprise they've developed the attitude that Chris Harris speaks of.I'm a car geek and I've often noticed the surprise some people and salesmen show at the emphasis I place on a test drive and how the car drives. As a self confessed car anorak, I've only ever bought cars that I've been given long test drives in, and the one car I tried to skip this on was awful and I couldn't wait to sell it. If I'm given a five minute drive up the road (as I was in a Boxster S once by one of the many awful arrogant independent Porsche dealers), then I don't have enough info on which to base a £20k decision. For someone not really into cars, the numbers on paper or photos in a magazine are enough for them.
jon- said:
Hmm, I wonder. Does anyone know how much of Ferrari's profits are generated from the car business, and how much is generated from the brand aspect...
This is what I was thinking - I reckon that Ferrari massaging these tests is more about brand Ferrari being seen as the best in the world, rather than selling individual cars.havoc said:
RobM77 said:
Good find. Big balls!A 2004 R1 road bike
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM8AzH8T6x8
It's been interesting reading about manufacturers who prep cars for tests to increase their desirability.
Bike manufactures have been known to provide faster examples to journalists.
RobM77 said:
That's very interesting, thanks. I was never into DR (I spend all day on computers...), so never saw that.
It always seemed strange to me how the 997TT was slower round the ring, because it's got a much lower centre of gravity, is lighter, and has around the same power. The tyres are the only thing I can think of.
If anyone else can remember the result of the DR test I'd be interested to know.
The C2S vs GTR comparison is surprising - does anyone remember the figures?
The 997TT (mark 1) had a time in Sportauto of 7:54It always seemed strange to me how the 997TT was slower round the ring, because it's got a much lower centre of gravity, is lighter, and has around the same power. The tyres are the only thing I can think of.
If anyone else can remember the result of the DR test I'd be interested to know.
The C2S vs GTR comparison is surprising - does anyone remember the figures?
The R35 (mark 1) had a time in Sportauto of 7:38
To suggest that a C2S is quicker in a straight line than a GTR is also very odd. One car has a big power advantage over the other, 4WD and at least as good a gearbox (for sprinting). I see Sportauto managed 7:50 with a 997.2 C2S with carbon brakes, PDK etc posh tyres.
If wikipedia is correct the 997 GT2 is quicker than the GTR (makes sense) with 7:33 'ring time and the GTR (mark 2) is a little quicker than the older car (7:34) but not as quick as the GT2.
It's all a bit pointless getting excited about how accurate things are to this degree. None the less the Sportauto (and other independent tests) suggest that the R35 press cars are no more tweaked than the Porsche (or anyone else's) press cars.
Some bike type may remember in the '80s Suzuki had a two stroke bike called the RG500 (square four, two stroke). The press bikes were VERY quick. Eventually someone tested a customer bike and found it was missing about 25% of the power of the press bikes...
Great Pretender said:
DR also compared the GTR against the E90 M3 and a 997 C2S in a straight line drag.
Even with it's significant power deficit, the C2S out-sprinted the Nissan
I think that was the slowest time anyone has recorded from a GT-R, they're a lot quicker than a C2S (unless you still live in conspiracy dreamland).Even with it's significant power deficit, the C2S out-sprinted the Nissan
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff